To wonder why the fuck long covid isn’t considered a serious outcome

[Clutchingatfog]

Why is covid often only talked about in terms of hospitalisations or deaths? Even in determining whether we are eligible for vaccination, long covid isn’t factored in. Not vulnerable to covid? Are you kidding me?! Oh, you don’t factor in that vaccination reduces risk of long covid either? Got it. FFS.

Where is this fantasy land where people’s risk of LC doesn’t increase with reinfection, where people are magically spared if they are healthy, where kids don’t get it, where only people who are vaccinated/not vaccinated (depending on stance) get it, where only people who have severe cases get it, where long covid was something that used to happen earlier in the pandemic, where most people fully recover, where you are not left to rot. I want to move there!

If you have LC or now have to care for someone with LC, please tell me you understand where I’m coming from.

I think you’re putting your frustration with all the posters on this thread on me, when I have made 4 odd curious and supportive posts. I think you’re being rude.

Then I'm not sure what point you were trying to make - other than making a cheap joke at the expense of everyone on this thread who is seriously ill? Whatever, thanks for your contribution I guess

Would you post the same "curious" posts about cancer? Or MND? Suggesting it was just psychosomatic?

It's not me who is being offensive

No, I'm not suggesting anyone ignore medical info but we have had people on this very thread focus on abbreviations, labels and research papers and it isn't always helpful. Yes, be informed re diagnosis and treatment but don't let other people's limitations dictate your own.

Everyone is different and what one person who has a chronic illness or post viral fatigue can do will be very different to other people.

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"Given what we have learned in the past eight years about this illness, it is intellectually embarrassing to suggest that ME is a psychological illness."[2]
Professor Betsy Keller 2015.

Betsy A. Keller, PhD, is a professor in the Department of Exercise & Sport Sciences at Ithaca College in New York. She is a fellow of the American College of Sports Medicine (ACSM),

Professor Betsy Keller, Exercise Researcher, now also ME researcher, who pioneered the 2-day Cardiopulmonary Exercise Testing studies for ME.

These objective exercise studies demonstrate that people with ME (and ME-like Long Covid, that's Long Covid with PEM) have a unique response to exercise, are unable to reproduce activity on day 2 of the testing, when compared with healthy people and deconditioned people. Demonstrates that ME (and Long Covid) are not deconditioning.

@Bambamhoohoo

• You are free to attribute your own illness to whatever you please.

You do not have the right to extend your beliefs/thoughts about your own illness to everyone else with the same disease.

ME Research scientists worldwide had settled the 'is ME a physical or psychological disorder/is it a bit of both' question many years ago. All international Medical Authorities (WHO/CDC/NIH/NAM/NICE) class ME as a physical, disabling, sometimes fatal, Neuro-Immune-Vascular or Multisystem Disease

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It's staggering that people on this thread persist with outdated/debunked, unevidenced arguments that ME (and by extension Long Covid) are in any way any kind of psychological/psychosomatic condition.

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Of course. I have no idea why everyone thinks cancer is some taboo topic that no one can discuss?!?

So is any research paper written about ME EXACTLY the same as any other post viral- or indeed -autoimmune disease? I reckon even Betsy the sports scientist would be surprised to hear that.

I think you’re being deliberately obtuse yourself now.

So you'd tell someone with cancer their tumour may just be "psychosomatic" and will go away if they have the right mindset?

can you quote where I have said that any psychosomatic disease will go away with the right mindset please?

Nope. I have posted research references, the Mayo Clinic Proceedings Guide to Diagnosing and Treating ME, various references.

Can you explain to me whether or not you would suggest to someone that their cancer was psychosomatic please?

I’ve already answered that you can go back and take a loook whilst you avoid admitting I said nothing of the sort.

'Labels'? Would you be meaning the names of symptoms and conditions, by any chance? And would the 'abbreviations' you speak of be shortened versions of recognised medical terms? And those research papers... would those be published by qualified scientists who, well... know what they are talking about because they've spent years studying science and medicine?

Just wondering.

No you haven't.

Gosh that was a simple and stubborn way to get out of saying sorry for being an arsehole. I’m quite impressed tbh.

It's worrying to read the many opinionated posts psychologising ME and Long Covid (LC, LC with PEM) on this Mumsnet thread, barely 2 weeks after The Lancet published a very large study which found that

'Long COVID in Kids Risk Doubles After Second Infection'

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'In the large study of long COVID, researchers analyzed the health records of more than 465,000 children and teens, finding that a second Covid infection dramatically increases kids’ risk of myocarditis, blood clots, damaged kidneys, abnormal heart beats and other health problems.

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All of those children had an initial COVID infection, and more than 58,400 went on to have a second infection, researchers said.

Results showed that reinfection doubled a child’s risk of later diagnosis for long COVID.

Subsequently, kids diagnosed with long COVID had a tripled risk of myocarditis, a swelling of the heart muscle than can weaken the heart, researchers said.
Long COVID children also were more than twice as likely to develop blood clots, and were at increased risk for many other health problems associated with the syndrome, the study says.

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The results run counter to popular perceptions that COVID in children is mild, and that reinfections don’t carry the same risk of long COVID that initial infections do, researchers said.'

https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2025-10-02/kids-long-covid-risk-doubles-after-second-infection-researchers-say

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'Long COVID associated with SARS-CoV-2 reinfection among children and adolescents in the omicron era (RECOVER-EHR): a retrospective cohort study'
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(25)00476-1/fulltext

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Oh I am not apologising. And I haven't been an arsehole.

I am just waiting for you to explain whether or not you would ask people with cancer or MND whether they thought their symptoms could be "psychological rather than physical" in origin. You seem remarkably reluctant to do so

Because I have done so, and you can’t be bothered to read back to check. Literally, the last time that questions was asked- it’s already been asked about 4 times so you don’t have to go back very far.

I follow someone on TikTok with* *stage 4 colon cancer who believes it was triggeredby/ the tumour progressed faster due to extreme stress/ cortisol.

I don’t know why you think this is so unusual/ unsaid.

Are you a DWP assessor?

An interesting point that several people mentioned re physical issues with me was regards oxygen sats - when I initially started with neuro issues post covid my oxygen sats were very frequently late 80s and very low 90s - the GP asked me to monitor it on my iPhone as hospital had observed it was very much on the lowish side-and as I improved over the next 10 months crept back up to an average of 94 to 96% . Clearly whatever the issue was it was interfering with oxygen levels .

Yes and research is showing the effects are cumulative and it doesn’t go back to zero. So with every Covid infection your risk of long covid keeps going up. And kids get Covid the most often. This is irrelevant or whether the infection is asymptomatic or mild.

Even if you feel like it won’t happen to you (if it doesn’t it’s pure luck) I have no idea why people aren’t worried for their kids. They will be exposed to Covid every year and all year round.

@Bambamhoohoo - I have found this reply of yours to a question from @CassandraWebb.

She asked you - “Would you post the same "curious" posts about cancer? Or MND? Suggesting it was just psychosomatic?
It's not me who is being offensive”

And you replied - “Of course. I have no idea why everyone thinks cancer is some taboo topic that no one can discuss?!?”

That does look to me as if you are saying that you would suggest that cancer was just psychosomatic. If it is a misunderstanding, I can see how it happened.

Yes - seems like @CassandraWebb is so overexcited she can’t read her own posts.

Not a joke. That was HIS experience (and us as a family) of ME, not Long Covid. Perhaps it was an interesting point for some people to ponder, perhaps not. I hope you’re feeling better soon.

But ME and long Covid are exactly the same, Betsy the sports scientist says so

😭 sorry couldn’t resist