Surely this shouldn’t be allowed in an office?

[Haaaalp]

I started a new job on Monday and the man in the desk next to me is sitting here vaping. It stinks and has given me headaches.

I am not the most senior but relatively senior and I feel if I say something (he’s not as senior as me), then it looks like I’m coming in and making a fuss.

I am quite fearful of cigarette smoke and I don’t really drink much so I don’t know if I’m making a mountain out of a molehill. Nobody else seems bothered though there’s only 4 others.

Completely get it OP, but I think when theres an established president, the people are more senior and you are new you need to be wise to the difference between what the "right thing" is and how things should be and what the reality is.

The reality is you'll say something, they'll agree, and announcement will be made and they'll stop vaping, you'll fail your probation for some spurious reason and they'll go back to vaping.

When I started work, about a hundred years ago (well, more like half a hundred really), smoking was permitted in the office, although decreasing numbers actually did. However, long before it was banished, first to designated rooms and then from buildings altogether, most considerate colleagues would pop outside when they felt the need. In my last workplace you definitely weren't allowed to vape indoors, and in my view that's probably best.

Personally I much prefer a faint whiff of peach or even the dreaded burnt caramel to cigarette smoke (good quality pipe tobacco is ok), but I know other people find it quite unpleasant. My attitude is that anything that causes unnecessary distress to fellow employees should not be acceptable. There are enough people on this very thread saying it triggers respiratory problems for them, even discounting everyone who's just saying "eww, it reeks", to justify keeping it outside. Even if someone's being dramatic, or you think they are, they shouldn't have to put up with unwanted niffs in the workplace.

As an ex-smoker who dated a vaper, I found I had cravings again, so I think second hand vaping is bad for those around them.

One of the difficulties about sending people outside for vaping is there is no natural "end" to the vape. With a cigarette it was over in less than five minutes. With vaping they can be out there for ages on their phones.

I imagine it can be pretty constant in the office too.

Whilst there is no specific strong evidence that vaping is bad for you at a population level, it cannot be beneficial just by using common sense. Certainly as others have noted here, it can exacerbate existing health problems such as asthma. Breathing in and out whatever chemicals are in there…cannot be good for you no matter what some people say!

There is also evidence that some chemicals used within vapes historically are dangerous and have been very harmful and have caused damage to the lungs. There have been deaths.

Vapes can contain all sorts of things which should be a concern.

They are much better for your health than smoking tobacco though!

I personally have never smoked or vaped, and I really detest the smell and fumes from both. I wouldn’t have put up with it for even a minute in the workplace let alone a week. Even if I was the most junior person, and it was the Chief Executive or Manager Director vaping. They’ve gone to the expensive of recruiting you. They won’t want to leaving within the first week.

Most places have been sensible and have treated vaping the same as smoking tobacco. However, it sounds as if you work at a small company that might not have a proper HR.

You need to take action quickly though. The longer you leave it, the more difficult it will be to stop this. Don’t take no for an answer. You have the right to breathe in clean fresh air.

I hope that the legislation will be changing soon! The sooner the better.

https://healthmedia.blog.gov.uk/2024/11/05/the-tobacco-and-vapes-bill-what-you-need-to-know/

Is this legal?? I'd be amazed if it was

@CantHoldMeDown it hasn’t happened for us yet, sadly. There’s a group that vapes in the toilets (and probably an equivalent group in the men’s toilets too) but they haven’t been called out so far.

There is also evidence that some chemicals used within vapes historically are dangerous and have been very harmful and have caused damage to the lungs. There have been deaths.

I haven't seen this evidence, unless you are talking about EVALI which had nothing to do with nicotine vaping in the UK.

It's possible to ban vaping from workplaces etc. without treating it 'the same as smoking'. PHE were very clear that it should not be treated the same and in particular, warned against sending vapers to stand with the smokers.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/use-of-e-cigarettes-in-public-places-and-workplaces/e-cigarettes-in-public-places-and-workplaces-a-5-point-guide-to-policy-making.

I vape. I enjoy it and have no intention of stopping any time soon.

But in an office, or indeed, any indoor space other than my own home and fellow vapers homes? Absolutely not. That's incredibly selfish. I choose to vape, but that doesnt mean I get to inflict my choices on other people.

Also pretty sure it's illegal?

Oh wow - apparently not illegal. Should be - and I say that as a vaper who cant last more than about half an hour without it!

just raise it
of course you cannot vape in an office
you cant vape in a works van

Both of those things completely depend on whether the company has a policy against it or not.

Most do, but not all.

Ask for a copy of your smoke free workplace policy. Most these days say no vaping too.

If it doesn't mention it, I would raise directly ask them not to vape inside and if they continue raise with your manager.

Nope, nobody does know that yet but as it is harmful to vape then it would be highly unlikely NOT to be harmful passively!

While vaping is not risk free, it's really not very harmful and all the identified potential risks are to vapers themselves.

Second hand smoke is harmful because it contains large quantities of carbon monoxide and tar. These are not present in second hand vape because it's not smoke - there's no combustion, which is the whole point.

ASH say: Current evidence suggests that short term exposure to e-cigarette vapour is not harmful to health, although it is possible that regular exposure to people vaping indoors for long periods of time carries some low-level risk. Any potential risks from passive vaping are likely to be significantly lower than the proven harms from passive smoking.

https://ash.org.uk/key-topics/vaping-what-you-need-to-know#6-what-about-secondhand-passive-vaping

Royal College of Physicians' 2024 evidence review concluded the same.

https://www.rcp.ac.uk/policy-and-campaigns/policy-documents/e-cigarettes-and-harm-reduction-an-evidence-review/