My 16 yo has taken a job that has turned out to voluntary!

[Lemurlady]

My 16 yo DS has taken what he thought was a paid job at our local swimming club as a poolside helper with a view to doing his coaching qualifications. He had to do his DBS and a 3 hour safeguarding course in his own time. He has done his first month (2.5hours/week) and asked when he was getting paid. He has been told it’s voluntary for 6 months and after that they will decide whether to take him on at £8/hour. It was never mentioned in any of the email correspondence that it was unpaid. He did not sign a contract and got the gig because he used to swim at the club and reached out to them. AIBU to expect him to be paid for the hours he has done and in thinking this is very exploitative as it would seem the only way into coaching is to work for free for 6 months. Is it even legal?

Oh no in swimming clubs, coaches get paid. According to swim England head coaches get paid about £30k. All the adult age coaches get paid- this is variable due to level of coaching. It is only the committee that are unpaid

It's not unusual for unpaid voluntary work to be part of a qualification requirement. If he is getting experience in the industry he intends to work in once he's qualified then surely there is a clear benefit to him continuing with this work. It's not a full time position so he could also get another role which does pay for income.

No way would I be working for free while other people are getting paid!

Parent of a DC in a similar arrangement here - but sounds like your DC's sports club is being at the very least untransparent and at worst exploitative, so here is the comparison.

It's not from swimming it's a different sport but the other principles - of it being a community sports club run by volunteers - are the same.

My DC is in a 3 month voluntary period, working one session of about one hour in length per week. During that period the club (a) sees how they perform - are they reliable in showing up, do they take it seriously, can they actually do the job? and at the end of the period applies for their DBS check and a required membership to a sports body. The club pays for the DBS check and the membership. So the "deal" is - the DC shows up and works voluntarily at one session per week for 3 months, they club pays for the DBS and membership. If the DC looks like the right material, then after that the DC will be offered a paid job at an hourly rate. This was made 100% clear from the start. I don't think there is any guarantee of a paid job but I know the sports club does predict what pipeline of helpers it will need and take on only as many volunteers as needed.

It sounds like your DC is doing twice as much work for twice as long with less transparency.

My experience of community sports clubs is that they fulfil a great function but can sometimes get quite captured by poor behaviour and unfair practices by the leaders if there is not decent governance of this. I have a good level of confidence in the leadership of the sports club in the example above but a much lower level of confidence in the leadership at another one my DC is involved in and for this reason have deliberately avoided them getting involved in the similar scheme at that club.

Volunteer roles that require a DBS check and safeguarding should be very carefully overseen, especially if some of these people are only 16 and probably in a prime position to be safeguarded themselves, as well as under-16s who would be on the end of any safeguarding and volunteer policies that are key to the training of those leaders/ lifeguards/ coaches. An example to consider is that the person should not have started their role until the DBS check results came back as satisfactory, and that can take quite a while. A lot of sports clubs seem to resent all of this area but it leaves a bad taste for me.
Being vague about what's paid and not, and the 6 month 'free work' deal (when most other things, if they're paid, have a maximum 3 month probation, because sick pay, pension, etc is bound up with that 3 month norm and beyond), does not inspire confidence that practices are following current good/best practice here.

Yes, I appreciate that, but he's not coaching, and there are many hours of volunteer work that he's benefited from as a member.

I’m shocked they made him pay for his own DBS, never experienced this in any role voluntary or otherwise. They also clearly haven’t been transparent. I’d stop bothering if I were him.

Is he being given any benefit through his volunteering work (eg: free swims )
If so he's entitled to minimum wage pay.

There's a page on the HMRC which I will dig out shortly

https://www.gov.uk/volunteering/pay-and-expenses

https://sheffieldvolunteercentre.org.uk/uploads/files/Paying_volunteer_expenses_legal_pitfalls_and_examples_Final.pdf

This is a very good idea.

Job advertisements should, legally, make clear using the word voluntary that they are unpaid.

I hope OP gets some answers from ACAS.

But he wasn’t hired as a coach. He was taken on as a pool side helper with a view to do his coaching qualifications. I think @Lemurlady means that whilst your son was at the swim club there would likely have been pool side helpers who were volunteers who’s help he has benefited from.

I 100% agree it should have been clear this was a non paid role and I don’t agree with the “we will pay you after 6 months if you’re good enough” - it should be a set time and then you get paid unless you fail your probation. However there has also been an oversight on your/ your sons part in taking a job without a contract, not asking explicitly what the hourly rate was and waiting until he’d worked a month (albeit only 10 hrs) to discuss this. Like others say, chalk it up to experience.

What is your son’s future goals ? If he wants to go into coaching and will get a qualification then it may well be worth sticking at it unless there’s other places that will give him a paid job to do similar. For university applications or any future job a DBS, safeguarding qualification and at least 6 months work experience will be invaluable and more than most 16 year olds will have access to. I’m not saying it’s right but for those saying quit and walk out right now without anything else to go to, I think it’s worth looking at the non monetary value of this “job”

But your dc has no coaching experience of qualifications.
Surely he needs to do some volunteer coaching to get experience and qualifications before he looks for a wage.

This is what ACAS' website says OP: https://www.acas.org.uk/young-workers-and-work-experience/working-hours-during-work-experience so I definitely think they are a good place to start. Please let us know what they say, as this could be helpful to other mums of older teenagers. Best of luck.

Also think you should look at @BigCitys post re other places that he could get paid work and sorry @BigCity youve struggled with getting the support your child needs with swimming 🤍

I would be concerned at the lack of any paperwork, what about insurance, is he covered if anything goes wrong.

Hi Op i have a background in human rights law and reading this INCENSES me.

This is a situation where you step in and teach him about employment rights.

This organisation should be publically shamed - I would go to the local paper - I would go to my local MP - definitely local cllrs.

Its disgusting - they are abusing the lack of understanding of a teenager - please don't let this continue.

Or he could look for a low paid job that doesn’t require experience and qualifications- like what he thought he had

no one should have to volunteer to get experience

For those saying this can fairly be a voluntary role.

it is the duty of this organisation to make that EXTREMELY clear when taking on a volunteer - he should have gone through volunteer training - he should have signed agreements and understanding of what the role involves.

If he is left unaware to the point he asked when he gets paid - they have not done any of this properly.

I would choose to walk away. Six months is a long time to work without pay, and there’s no guarantee of a job at the end, they could simply say he wasn’t needed or didn’t perform well enough. This might even be part of their business model. I’d also consider reporting it to the local council, as they tend to take employment exploitation seriously, especially when it involves minors. Also, HMRC (Minimum Wage Enforcement) if someone is working and not being paid at least minimum wage, even during "training" or "trial" periods, this can be illegal.

He should not work without a contract!!

out Of interest and I mean this genuinely, if there has been no contract actually signed and no mention of payment and no mention of it being voluntary- where does the OP and her son stand with employment law? How can anyone prove that the other party has done anything wrong annd there hasn’t been a misunderstanding. Especially if as many people have previously said volunteering in sports settings is incredibly common.

Thanks for your reply. Some of the helpers have been there for a while and get paid. He wants to go to university but would like to get a coaching qualification done alongside his A levels so he can coach alongside his degree. He’s only in year 12 but if he has to volunteer for 6 months I’m not sure he’ll have time to finish before A levels start. With regards to volunteering, I agree it has value but he already volunteers for an animal charity and has done for 2+ years. I think, being 16, he was excited thinking he had his first job and was naive to the process.

They never discussed pay? Or signed anything? Sounds wrong.
in which case they’d both be at fault, but I’d blame them! He’s 16, he didn’t know, and if they didn’t make it clear that’s exploitation

My DD is a volunteer coach at her trampoline club in common with about 80% of the team. The difference is that she knew it was volunteering and they paid for her DBS and coaching qualification. Your 16yo is being exploited and I would advise him to stop going - effective immediately.

What an absolute piss-take. Someone’s doing the job, they’re entitled to be paid for doing the job.

The lack of written contract doesn’t prove anything, otherwise loads of dodgy employers would never issue contracts to try and get around employment law.