To wonder if tipping is necessary anymore… ?

[FrustratedOldLady]

Got into a random conversation with my teen daughters the other day when they saw me leave a tip for their haircuts.
So they were asking why we tip hairdressers and waiters, when other jobs don’t get tipped, however good a job they do. Especially now that there’s a minimum wage across the board.
My eldest works in a supermarket while doing A-levels so doesn’t get a tip obviously, but her friend who works in a gastro pub does (even though her hourly rate is higher to start with).
So she was saying ‘so if I go out for a meal or get a hair cut, I should tip someone who is earning more than me?’
I said it was just expected for certain industries, but that it’s up to her. It got me thinking though. Is tipping still necessary/fair?

YABU - yes, tipping is still necessary
YANBU - maybe time to stop, there’s a minimum wage now

Ah ok. Quite cheeky of them! But I guess if the staff aren’t working because they’re ill, it makes sense not to get tips during that time.

But that’s one of the points of my post, why do some roles still attract tips.
I thought it was because historically they were low paid roles and relied on tips.
But now, with the minimum wage/living wage, some of these roles are perfectly well paid for supply/demand of staff or level of skill.

Saying that, I’ll probably still tip. It’s too ingrained now and I’d probably feel tight if I don’t.
I find I tip less now because everything’s by card. Things like takeaway deliveries or taxis. I used to leave the change, but you pay exact amount by card 👀
It’s mainly hairdressers and restaurants I’m thinking of with this post.

I wonder if the hairdresser scenario is a female thing. I don’t see men tipping at the barbers.
I took my boys to get haircuts. The barbers are cash only (no comment 😂) and I said to keep the change. It was only £3 and the guy looked really surprised.
Who knows. I must be getting old if this is what I’m thinking about on a Friday night 😂

Yes, but none of my examples are of sickness (I've never worked in a hospitality job where you get anything more than SSP anyway). My point is not that you should get tips if you aren't at work - I just mean that those of us living on tips often physically earn around 28k a year, but with the security of only earning 24k. If the restaurant simply put the prices up and paid 28k straight to the employee, rather than having customers tip, the staff would have better security. We would have got 80% of 28k on furlough - not 80% of 24k. We would get paid 90% 28k on maternity, not 24k.

They want staff who are good, so they do service charge to advertise pay as 28k - but without the responsibility of footing their wage bill.

TLDR; Companies should do better to provide secure wages that are consistent!

Agreed, I’ve never even thought about this aspect (spoilt public sector worker over here 🙈)
Seems to me, they’re putting prices up and partially blaming increased labour costs. But then not passing the extra onto the staff 👎🏻

I never tip in the UK unless it’s for a large group meal

I don't live in the UK and have never heard of anyone tipping a hairdresser here. Some people leave tips in jars at hospitality places but that's the end of it - thank goodness. Why should a hairdresser be any more deserving of a tip than anyone in any other job? They are providing a service for which they get paid.

If they aren't earning minimum wage then perhaps they are working illegally.

I hate tipping. It’s very stressful and awkward. I just want to be told what to pay and not have to calculate what’s appropriate and then worry if I got it right.

I want to pay a good price for the service and I want to be told up front what that is.

I'm sure that is illegal. There has been recent legislation about employees tips.

Your daughter makes a valid point. I barely tip now, the only reason I tip the hairdresser is because I know it gets me perks that I wouldn’t get if I didn’t.

I tip anyone who provides decent service, because it’s a rarity these days! So my nail tech, my hairdresser, cab drivers, decent wait staff. I was a waitress about 100 years ago, and the tips made a difference to me. I can afford it so why wouldn’t I?

@Pineconesandpetals Do you not think the employer should pay a fair wage and this be reflected in the charges for the service? I bet you don’t tip your doctor! What about an architect or the person who finds your size in the stockroom when you shop for clothes?
We tend to select certain services and not others. It feels a bit Lady Bountiful to me. I’d rather they paid staff well and no tips.

Service charge in restaurants really annoys me. Why do we pay extra to get the food from the kitchen to the table? At 12.5%, I’d happily collect it! Or I’ll just pay the all in price and expect it served at the table. The Swiss don’t tip. Sensible people!

6.5% of employers pay minimum wage. I’m fairly certain my Dr isn’t a recipient of that, nor my architect. It’s my money and I’ll spend it how I like. If you don’t want to pay service charge in a restaurant, don’t. Tell them to remove it. Or move to Switzerland. Be Lady Less Bountiful if you wish. Your choice.

Yanbu. Tips are not necessary and service charges are a deterrent to eating out. I wish restaurants realised this when they slap on 12.5% - if prices have risen due to minimum wage increases, asking customers to pay even more just puts them off coming to the restaurant!

@Pineconesandpetals Lady Bountiful refers to people who think others are below them and give them a small gift - like a tip. They feel they are superior and hand out to the deserving poor! So not me who is Lady Bountiful. I was referring to being grateful for a service and how people say thank you. Why not the shop assistant who finds something for you? Why not the junior technician who is just starting out in architecture? What about the school kitchen staff who feed dc? Maybe check out who gets minimum wage and only tip them?

Or more likely they’re self employed and so don’t earn an hourly rate and get paid by the job, which might not take them up to minimum wage. The flip side being they’ll be paid way more than minimum wage on a busy night, or that they accept it for the flexibility of not being an employee.

Um yes, like my Nail Tech and Hairdresser? Both young, both starting out in life.
I am fully aware of what “Lady Bountiful” means, thank you and no, I don’t feel superior in any way. Why should I? And tipping by no means suggests I don’t say thank you. I do, because I have manners.
I am simply baffled that you think you can dictate to me, or anyone else, how we spend our own, hard earned money.

@Pineconesandpetals I’m not dictating. It’s a conversation. I’m assuming you know the difference.

But, why don’t you tip the shop assistant? Why is it just people in certain industries that you tip? Beauty industry? Why not tip low paid people doing any service job that helps you? Maybe you like the kudos of tipping and it makes you feel good about yourself because it’s a very visible gesture? Would you rather these people were not paid more by employer so a tip wasn’t something you had to think about ? But of course, you hand over your money as you wish.

I've never tipped in the UK. I don't think it's necessary.

It’s an outdated practice. I’m probably going to sound like a complete cheapskate but if I’m just out with my husband and DS I actively get the service charge removed because I think it’s just a sneaky way to get extra money (that rarely goes to the server from both knowing people in hospitality and own places) and will only tip if it’s particularly good service. I genuinely don’t see why I’d pay extra after advertised prices for food.

I don’t really agree with tipping however I will
give extra if I think it’s particularly good service and will leave a review saying I thought they were brilliant. It’s the same as I would do anywhere, e.g. hospital stay I wouldn’t leave money as it’s not accepted but I’ve left nice chocolates and made sure manager knew that a particular nurse was amazing.

I feel like jobs where people traditionally get tips are jobs that are paid hourly yet require a specific skillset, as opposed to other hourly roles such as stocking shelves.
I'm in the US, so obviously it's a whole different culture, but I do see a difference in expectation between a tipped job and a non tipped job in terms of skill and experience.

Why do you tip elsewhere, if not uk?

Such a negative, judgemental and patronising attitude. "Kudos and it makes me feel good?" If I was similarly negative and judgemental, I could assume you were simply miserly and a skinflint? That you would rather I didn't tip because it makes you feel bad that you don't?
And yes, of course people should be paid properly. I am an employer and I do exactly that. Minimum and "Living" Wage isn't enough to live on for many people, and I do not pay anyone that, including trainees, but those are the standards set by the Government of the day. If you want it to be increased, campaign to them, do not begrudge the extras individuals choose to give, out of their own, often highly taxed, income.