To think this is fraud and do I say something or stay out of it?

[doitellthem]

I have NC'd for this. A friend of mine NEVER has to pay for work on her house...she has a family member who is high up in a business and so all of the work is put through the business. She says they are doing the jobs as favours! surely this is fraud! do i stay out of it or say something (who do i even report to!!)She currentky has a landscper in doing the garden...just so happens to be the landscaper who does the work for said business!

That's right. Definitely don't tell everyone in the pub on Friday evening about your plans to steal from the local supermarket next week. Someone might open their mouth and fuck up all your well laid plans! Jealous bitches eh!

If the person is employed by the company and redirecting contractors and the company is actually paying and unaware yes this is fraud.

Look on companies house and get the directors of the company details. write to them and their accountant and tell them of your concerns.

It is easily investigated.

Perhaps she pays in kind…….😉😉🤭🤭

He's high up so must earn a lot so has probably offered to pay for the work through his company.

I think you're just jealous that she has well off family willing to do that for her.

Wtf? He is her family. He could be her dad or brother.

As someone who has a business, Two scenarios here and I’m not sure which it is

scenario a - company a ( and the ‘friends’ relative - 100% uses his own salaried people and lets them do work , buy stuff and pays them and gets an equivalent reduction against corporation tax - only really works if it’s a company that are profitable and paying corp tax and often VAT - whereby there will be VAT ‘out’ but no VAT ‘in’ - hence a rebate or an offset if VAT due in general

scenario B - company A uses contractors for jobs from company B ( who said relative works for) and company B are sending in inflated invoices to company A to cover off work at Ops ‘friends’ house -

company A if in profit may not actually care , if they could do with a deduction against corporation tax- however almost certainly wouldn’t approve if they knew it was going on - but if they were on a fixed price job presumably company A were ok with the quote . If it’s inflated they could always have gone elsewhere where they aren’t fudging invoices to fix relatives places.

either way OP, it’s annoying but yes it does happen.

it’s only really fraud if all within company a if it’s ’kept In the quiet and someone hasn’t approved it’

in the other scenario it’s not fraud as such if company A accepted fixed price quote from company B - it is however fraud if company B are charging billable time and supplies and thenusing them on a job not costed for and billable for - but the fraud is against company A by company B

As someone who has a business, Two scenarios here and I’m not sure which it is

scenario a - company a ( and the ‘friends’ relative - 100% uses his own salaried people and lets them do work , buy stuff and pays them and gets an equivalent reduction against corporation tax - only really works if it’s a company that are profitable and paying corp tax and often VAT - whereby there will be VAT ‘out’ but no VAT ‘in’ - hence a rebate or an offset if VAT due in general

scenario B - company A uses contractors for jobs from company B ( who said relative works for) and company B are sending in inflated invoices to company A to cover off work at Ops ‘friends’ house -

company A if in profit may not actually care , if they could do with a deduction against corporation tax- however almost certainly wouldn’t approve if they knew it was going on - but if they were on a fixed price job presumably company A were ok with the quote . If it’s inflated they could always have gone elsewhere where they aren’t fudging invoices to fix relatives places.

either way OP, it’s annoying but yes it does happen.

it’s only really fraud if all within company a if it’s ’kept In the quiet and someone hasn’t approved it’

in the other scenario it’s not fraud as such if company A accepted fixed price quote from company B - it is however fraud if company B are charging billable time and supplies and thenusing them on a job not costed for and billable for - but the fraud is against company A by company B

either way I wouldn’t interfere-

As someone who has a business, Two scenarios here and I’m not sure which it is

scenario a - company a ( and the ‘friends’ relative - 100% uses his own salaried people and lets them do work , buy stuff and pays them and gets an equivalent reduction against corporation tax - only really works if it’s a company that are profitable and paying corp tax and often VAT - whereby there will be VAT ‘out’ but no VAT ‘in’ - hence a rebate or an offset if VAT due in general

scenario B - company A uses contractors for jobs from company B ( who said relative works for) and company B are sending in inflated invoices to company A to cover off work at Ops ‘friends’ house -

company A if in profit may not actually care , if they could do with a deduction against corporation tax- however almost certainly wouldn’t approve if they knew it was going on - but if they were on a fixed price job presumably company A were ok with the quote . If it’s inflated they could always have gone elsewhere where they aren’t fudging invoices to fix relatives places.

either way OP, it’s annoying but yes it does happen.

it’s only really fraud if all within company a if it’s ’kept In the quiet and someone hasn’t approved it’

in the other scenario it’s not fraud as such if company A accepted fixed price quote from company B - it is however fraud if company B are charging billable time and supplies and thenusing them on a job not costed for and billable for - but the fraud is against company A by company B

either way I wouldn’t interfere-

As someone who has a business, Two scenarios here and I’m not sure which it is

scenario a - company a ( and the ‘friends’ relative - 100% uses his own salaried people and lets them do work , buy stuff and pays them and gets an equivalent reduction against corporation tax - only really works if it’s a company that are profitable and paying corp tax and often VAT - whereby there will be VAT ‘out’ but no VAT ‘in’ - hence a rebate or an offset if VAT due in general

scenario B - company A uses contractors for jobs from company B ( who said relative works for) and company B are sending in inflated invoices to company A to cover off work at Ops ‘friends’ house -

company A if in profit may not actually care , if they could do with a deduction against corporation tax- however almost certainly wouldn’t approve if they knew it was going on - but if they were on a fixed price job presumably company A were ok with the quote . If it’s inflated they could always have gone elsewhere where they aren’t fudging invoices to fix relatives places.

either way OP, it’s annoying but yes it does happen.

it’s only really fraud if all within company a if it’s ’kept In the quiet and someone hasn’t approved it’

in the other scenario it’s not fraud as such if company A accepted fixed price quote from company B - it is however fraud if company B are charging billable time and supplies and thenusing them on a job not costed for and billable for - but the fraud is against company A by company B

As someone who has a business, Two scenarios here and I’m not sure which it is

scenario a - company a ( and the ‘friends’ relative - 100% uses his own salaried people and lets them do work , buy stuff and pays them and gets an equivalent reduction against corporation tax - only really works if it’s a company that are profitable and paying corp tax and often VAT - whereby there will be VAT ‘out’ but no VAT ‘in’ - hence a rebate or an offset if VAT due in general

scenario B - company A uses contractors for jobs from company B ( who said relative works for) and company B are sending in inflated invoices to company A to cover off work at Ops ‘friends’ house -

company A if in profit may not actually care , if they could do with a deduction against corporation tax- however almost certainly wouldn’t approve if they knew it was going on - but if they were on a fixed price job presumably company A were ok with the quote . If it’s inflated they could always have gone elsewhere where they aren’t fudging invoices to fix relatives places.

either way OP, it’s annoying but yes it does happen.

it’s only really fraud if all within company a if it’s ’kept In the quiet and someone hasn’t approved it’

in the other scenario it’s not fraud as such if company A accepted fixed price quote from company B - it is however fraud if company B are charging billable time and supplies and thenusing them on a job not costed for and billable for - but the fraud is against company A by company B

either way I wouldn’t interfere-

Apologies for multiple texting - this is my wifi which freezes in this particular building and then makes damn sure I ram home the message!!

why does it have to be a man? Could be her mother or sister?!

You are jealous, nosy, and bitter. You are not this persons friend. I don't know how you can post this, don't you feel embarrased.
My suggestion is you reflect on yourself and think about why you are so concerned either this person's life.

Typical MN responses. It's fine to defraud a business out of 1000s but woe betide you if you defraud benefits of £1. Such double standards. I had a boyfriend who subcontracted for a large multinational and often helped his friends out by 'raising an invoice.' It's outright fraud and just imagine if everyone did it. Businesses would go bankrupt. It's every bit as serious as defrauding the government.

Ooops, sorry……I missed that bit! That will teach me to RTFT 🤣🤣🤣

You clearly need to get a life.

True, my bad. Every building company I dealt with had just men so I did jump to stereotypes.

It absolutely is fraud, the neighbours are not employed by the company that are paying for the work to their house!

I know. I think some people aren't understanding whatbop is saying though and thinks they own the business. Also maybe not familiar with the devastation business fraud causes to owners, employees and customers.

It isn’t fraud unless the company isn’t aware of what is being done which I doubt. There isn’t therefore any deception

@doitellthem apologies I missed your previous response- it really depends if company A are paying a fixed ‘all inclusive’ price that they signed off and were happy with - if they did it’s not fraud but I agree it’s very poor business practice and I hope company A aren’t a public service and ‘have to use company B’ If so then yep, I think it’s fraud .

if however company B are charging for materials and time ‘ongoing’ and it’s not fixed , then I think that is fraud -

however as I’ve said if company A aren’t profitable and looking to ‘lose’ a bit of profit for corp tax purposes, they possibly won’t really care.

This is fraud. The company is unknowingly paying for work which is being done for free for the relative. The company paying will also unwittingly be paying less tax because it will have deductions which don't relate to their income earning process. It is literally no better than stealing from the company and HMRC. I don't know why people are defending the friend of OP because she is equally dishonest. It's hard to hide this forever if the company has an HMRC audit or gets audtors in if they realise their profit margins are lower than they should be. If the relative is caught he is likely to be prosecuted and certainly dismissed.

How do you know this?

There is a difference if you are providing a service for free and there are no company policies in the receivers employment contract, however seems wrong you are adding the materials on to other clients invoices.

It sounds like the OP is implying that their friend is effectively stealing from the company they work for by allowing the subcontractors to cost these jobs to the business they work for. I have seen this done twice at work. Once was for a payment I was given to authorise, I just done a bit of digging, realised it was not a ligit buisness cost and passed it to the one who was at fault and said I am keeping out of it. Did not report but would not agree to pay it. Another time was nothing to do with my contracts but had heard that 1 of the big bosses had been sacked and the reason was as he was getting work done on his house and adding the costs onto other jobs. Someone working on these contracts had looked into why costs were so high and caught him out. It is not OK. It is illegal as it is theft. If they don't own the buisness, it is not their money to spend for personal gain

Oh, dear, you are in a state
I'm generally in favour of dobbing frauds in. I think it's a nasty, sneaky kind of crime and it always hurts someone.

That said, I see an awful lot of posts here from infuriated 'friends' of benefit claimants, detailing lavish benefits they simply cannot be claiming - the 'friends' are so blinded by envy, they make up ridiculous scenarios and won't be told they've misunderstood something. I feel sorry for the DWP employees who have to process these mad reports.

I'm afraid your envy has taken you down a similar path, OP. If your mate's actually told you, in so many words, that the service she receives is being charged to other customers, then yes, there is fraud - or theft, I'm not sure which.

But has she told you this, exactly? Could the friend with the company simply be doing her a favour? In business, there's an informal concept known as a favour bank: people do each other favours, expecting to even out over the course of time.

Do you have reason to know the workers' payments are being fraudulently accounted for, or have you chosen to assume it?

In any case, I don't know who you'd report it to. Not the company, obviously! The local authority, perhaps? After all, you are not the one suffering detriment here (if anyone is) so you're not what the courts would call a complainant. Hmmm.

Perhaps you need to make friends with this construction company chap ...