To think you can’t call yourself a liberal anymore if you don’t agree with gender ideology?

[Spookygoose]

I’ve always considered myself a liberal and I agree with all aspects of liberal political viewpoints, apart from gender ideology and the idea that there are more than two sexes. I hate the idea of being viewed as conservative or a Tory, but it seems these days people who reject the gender ideology movement are labelled conservative. Can you be a liberal and not agree with this?? I understand everyone is an individual and specific viewpoints differ from person to person, no matter what political identity they call themselves, however it seems anyone with anti trans views are labelled conservative. I think it’s more of a thing in America but maybe it’s becoming a bigger thing here too?..As a gay woman, one of my biggest issues with it is I feel it’s erasing gay rights and making society more homophobic

I’m considerably to the left of Labour, and believe that women’s hard-won rights cannot be eroded because of the fetish and/or dysmorphia of a tiny minority of men.

Do we have to neatly fit into a box? Who’s identifying you as anything? I’m with you, liberal leftie but hard line for me is gender ideology and the absolute farce that you can change sex. Doesn’t make me any less liberal, I don’t stand for all conservative views because one of my values is.

I'm in my late 60s and have been a traditional socialist all my adult life. I do not believe in gender ideology but still hold all the same values - socialist ones - I've held for 50 years.

Not falling into line with a diktat that I have to believe in something impossible doesn't make me a conservative and it certainly doesn't make me a "bigot".

I think its the Gender nuts that have gone so far left they've taken a right turn.
GC beliefs are firmly liberal.

If you allow people, many of whom have very poor characters by objective standards, no empathy, extremely self centred some to narcissistic levels, no care for women and children etc etc, to label you according to their rigid beliefs then no you can’t but if you are confident in your own character then you can call yourself what you feel fits best to you.

Why do we have to be labelled? We don’t all fit neatly into boxes. I am generally to the left of the centre, but I also don’t agree with gender ideology. I don’t think that makes me anything except someone who is left of centre but doesn’t agree with gender ideology!
(I should add that I believe anyone can dress how they want; if a man wants to wear traditionally woman’s clothing etc then I have no issues with that whatsoever. I just don’t think you can change sex).

I don’t think of myself as ‘a liberal’ though, that wasn’t a UK thing although presumably some people are picking this term up from US media.

Id consider myself a social democrat. I don’t even consider myself a large L Liberal Democrat/Liberal Party person, because it’s always seemed to me that they are too focused on individual rights before any sense of collective values, and that often seemed to go along with some highly dubious views on sexual freedom without addressing any of the risks or genuine liberation (cf Cyril Smith, Jeremy Thorpe ).

I don’t see any conflict between social democracy and keeping sex as a category in law and policy.

Having been someone who was subjected to a man turning up at work in his fetish gear on his day off, I disagree. Part of the fetish IS the reaction that people give when they turn up in frilly knickers and so it makes you an unwilling participant in their sex lives.

Male body dysmorphia issues being weaponised is just more toxic thinking, we really do have to ignore the pseudo logic of people with labels ready to sling.

How can you be liberal and believe in gender ideology? Gender ideology is a profoundly illiberal ideology

Yes I think it is impossible just to say ‘wear what you like’ and think you’ve solved everything. I’m suspicious of any formal restrictions on clothing (hijab ban? No thanks) but clothing also ALWAYS has meaning and it’s naive to say ‘oh Ron just finds that leather gimp suit warmer on winter days’.

If I had to call myself something then it’d be centre left but I’m firmly with you on gender ideology. I also think benefits are out of control/need reform but I strongly support public spending on public services. As I pay a shit load of tax I’m in the somewhat privileged position of gaining personally if people vote the opposite way to me though…

Well a man can call himself a woman so yes you can call yourself a Liberal.

This

I am centre left, firmly opposed to gender ideology and believe that gender identity is nonsense and has been used by a small and highly policitised cohort of men has weaponised it to attack women.

BUT I also believe parts of the feminist movement have become pretty irrational about this and inadvertently played into the hands of the hard right in their criticism of "woke" ideology.

Where does that leave me?

The point is the traditional distinctions between "liberal" and "right" are largely meaningless these days.

Not quite so left wing, but yes - this

Another liberal minded person here who is opposed to gender ideology. However I have always thought it nonsense that you have to parcel together a load of opinions and beliefs as belonging together and if you accept one you have to accept them all.

Incidentally I don't necessarily think being gender critical makes you "anti-trans". "Anti-trans-activist" maybe. I have no issue with individual trans people just wanting to go quietly about their lives without being hassled or humiliated. I just don't buy all the "trans women are women" nonsense.

I’m what I guess people would consider left wing. I don’t hold strong views on “gender ideology” except that is has been whipped up to be a culture war, to stoke division, and I can’t understand why so many people on both sides are so worked up about it when it is actually the least problematic thing facing the nation.

There's nothing liberal or progressive about gender ideology, which is not only designed to stereotype the sexes and erode women's legal rights and cultural freedoms, but has also encouraged a generation of gender-nonconforming and mostly neurodivergent gay people to believe that voluntarily sterilising themselves with hormones is a right they're prepared to fight for. For sure, it's a better look for the swivel-eyed right than rounding them up and sending them to death camps, but it's still a light year from anything I would call liberal.

I don't understand why being gender critical is political. Believing/knowing that humans cannot change sex is to me a scientific fact rather than a right-wing belief.
Is it to do with left-leaning people being "kind" and therefore trying to show them selves to be supportive of trans rights?
I am left-leaning, support trans rights (trans women and trans men, who are mostly ignored) but not at the expense of women's rights.

Tbh I am sick of the divisiveness atm.
Eveything has to be one or the other. I am sure only a few months ago you could just have a view that doesnt fit into a box.

I’m fairly left wing and socialist and I am firmly against gender ideology. People should be free to dress as they wish and call themselves anything they want and should not be discriminated against. But people cannot change sex and any pretence on this matter destroys the rights of women and people who are homosexual.

I am gutted that there are no political parties that support my beliefs. Traditionally I either voted Labour, LibDem or Green but none of these parties have convinced me that this issue is high on their agenda. I’m politically homeless.

Gender ideology doesn't say there are more than two sexes..most people accept most babies are born one of two sexes
Gender is a man-made construction growing all the time..my DD first boyfriends father transitioned and caused no end of damage to the children . Had the full vaginal surgery and still looked like a man in a wig ..

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If you want to be allowed to call people by the sex-specific pronouns you believe are accurate for them, rather than the ones they prefer, then I think you need to accept that other people are allowed to refer to you by the political label they believe is accurate for you, rather than the one you prefer.

If someone said to me, they were conservative, liberal, or labour I really would have no idea about their views on various different areas. I space there are a series of Venn diagrams that cut across all these things.