I've screwed my career up- anyone else?

[Minkdeville]

It's probably more of a rant than anything.
I qualified as a secondary school teacher 10 years ago back when it was just 1 NQT year and not 2 ECTs.
I'd done a languages degree prior to that, my placement school offered me a fixed term contract but I declined it to go and teach abroad.
I did 3 years abroad teaching in different settings which was great. Came back to try and do the NQT but struggled to get interviews so took on TA/Cover Supervisor and supply work for the next 5 years, as well as tutoring.

I have enjoyed the work I've done but I just wish I did my NQT year 10 years ago. 2 years ago I entered the Civil Service for a change as an Admin Officer. I earn £26.7k a year and make it up to 29 with tutoring and the odd scrap of overtime we have to fight for.

I can't even seem to make it to EO (Executive Officer), which is embarrassing. I got onto a reserve list for 1 role which then expired, and I've made many applications, one personal statement I scored 5s and a 6 but still didn't make it to interview.

Not just applying in my own department but others, EO is a very competitive entry level grade. I honestly feel embarrassed..if I'd stuck with teaching I could possibly be on the Upper Pay Scale by now.

Would a school realistically take on someone to do their ECT 10 years later? My subject is languages which I know is a shortage but still.

I'm honestly pretty down about this and feel like I've wasted everything. Civil Service has an annual pay increase but not always in line with inflation, the application and interview process is challenging and no reflection on your performance or experience.

I know the pension is very good but I actually don't have any other benefits (no flexi!).

I do think it’s easy to take a wrong turn, and a bad time to be job hunting…have you thought about business roles that require languages? Not a great time to get into exports though..

remember careers aren’t linear anymore, it’s more of a game of snakes and ladders than it ever was, and pretty much all careers will end in ‘failure’ these days as we age out of them, or AI replaces us. It’s good to like your job but it’s not your value, it’s just a job.

@pottylolly

Could you tell me more about this, please?

Me too please

I was nearly 39 before I left my AO role, I'd been there 20 years.

Look at EOIs, they can be a great way to get that experience for promotion. It's how I got mine and I got an EOI for an HEO role not long after promotion, again, giving me so much useful experience.

The department I am on has very few HEO roles with management responsibilities, most of those are SEO. Roles with direct reports, where you manage work but not the person can be really good for developing those skills you need as a line manager.

Also, as PPs have said it is not at all too late to explore other careers.

Op best mfl teachers I had in high school made it fun and interactive.
Got us out of our seats, we stood on chairs or desks to recite bits
Did loads games.
Silly songs
Basically having a great time while learning language.

Massive tangent here, but considering I posted on another thread about becoming a train driver (big push for female drivers atm) how about Eurostar? Use those language skills, get to travel, earn more than many other jobs, flexi hours and you don't have to manage people! https://www.eurostar.com/uk-en/about-eurostar/careers

I get what you're saying and you're not wrong but I don't think it's just personality she's facing. A friend years ago, working in a service industry, had a customer from a wealthy white South African family who was new to Britain (my friend was also white South African, grew up there and had been in Britain a long time). This customer spoke to my friend like dirt and was very demanding and didn't understand why she couldn't always have her own way. I asked my friend about it (why she put up with it) and she said it was cultural. That when people come from a situation in their home country where employing servants in normal and they've been part of that, they have a tendency to treat service staff the same way and not afford them the respect that in the UK we automatically give to everyone. She said it can take time for people to adjust.

I think this is what the poster means. The Middle Eastern students have paid for their language course and, in their eyes, that makes them her boss/employer. So they think they can do as they like and expect her to suck it up.

I've also failed my driving test several times, and can't afford lessons until im earning more so I'm feeling like a bit of a loser compared to my friends at this age haha

@pottylolly I don't think it's quite that straightforward... You often need a background in something like computational linguistics for this. And LOTS of experience to work as a consultant!

@Minkdeville I trained as an MFL teacher (French, German and Spanish). To cut a long story short, after a few years in the classroom, I set up as a self-employed private tutor and now earn approximately £80k per year.

I do still tutor all three modern languages but the majority of my work (75%+) comes from tutoring English. I found it easy to move from MFL into English tutoring, although it did require a lot of work to familiarise myself with the texts for literature as well as the requirements for language, mark schemes, etc. I mostly tutor secondary but also some primary.

Would tutoring English appeal to you? There's a lot of demand. If you were interested in tutoring full time, it's much safer than relying on MFL, which is undervalued and obviously not a core subject.

The working hours aren't for everyone (evenings and weekends, plus I work some school holidays) but it's way more flexible than school teaching, I work from home, and I love working one-to-one with the students. It's taken a while to build things up but I am now hugely in demand, with a waiting list (although I never take this for granted).

I got into tutoring English by doing one-to-one sessions with looked-after children in secondary schools - this was initially as a way back into teaching after maternity but that somehow never happened. It was something of a baptism of fire teaching English with little experience of that specifically but it's the best thing I ever did.

Okay. But you don't actually know yourself what their motivations were, or why the students were challenging for the OP to teach.

The Middle East is huge and extremely diverse. It's very much a Civil Service no-no to overgeneralise or slip into what looks like negative stereotyping, even when well-intentioned. This is a public forum!

Friends who teach in schools and universities often share anecdotes about the apparent sense of entitlement among their students, and it's easy to think it's because they're Gen Z. But they might find it among older people too if they also had them in their classes.

It's best to keep assumptions of cultural differences to ourselves in case we're being unfair without realising. I'm also thinking about young mums thinking of applying to the Civil Service - also mums with kids in school - who are reading this with connections to the MENA region. Teachers and government workers have to treat people from all backgrounds fairly, and be seen to do so.

Was it in a manual car? Could you switch to automatic lessons? That reduces the complexity of driving - I know quite a few people that found driving in a manual car very difficult, but were much more able to drive (and pass a test) in an automatic. It might help to build your confidence if you can tackle this, and get a driving test pass under your belt :)

I’ve never had a career, I’ve only had jobs. I think I just assumed something would stick and I would climb through the ranks.
I am now 47 years old and juggle 4 part time min wage jobs. I love two of them but they won’t go anywhere other than what they are. I despise two of them.
Even if I were to take on one full time job, if I could find someone who would employ me.
I wouldn’t get much above min wage.
I am not qualified in anything.
I also have health issues.

Double post

I'm looking for a German tutor for my daughter currently

@JarellQuansahsGolfClubs

Wow! Is that ESOL or "normal" English?

"Normal" English: mostly GCSE English language and literature and KS3 (Y7-9) plus some primary (mostly Y5/6). I don't do any ESOL.

If the main barrier to trying for higher roles in the CS is leadership experience, I would say that your teaching experience with adults (albeit overseas) would definitely count!
But if you need more, or more specific skills, can you do some volunteering? Lots of great skills for the CV to be picked up in voluntary roles. good luck x

I think you would get work (my school would support an ECT in this position if we had a vacancy and liked them or had no other good option) but teaching is tough, especially MFL because students often have little interest in it. Your behaviour management challenges sound like they were mainly due to lack of experience. In a decent school, that is surmountable.

ECTs get a small timetable reduction - 10% in first year and 5% in September second. I hear the paperwork is demanding though.

But you'd need to be able to tell a positive story about why you want to go back to teaching. I mean do you, actually?

I am in a similar position as you. However, I did a PGCE and was failed unfairly. I haven’t since been able to build up a career, even though I had a first in my undergraduate degree and a distinction in my masters. I feel as lost as you.

I don't know which part of the civil service or where in the country, some have higher vacancy rates for EO posts than others, so if you can it might be worth expanding your civil service job search. Also have you had feedback on why you were not successful? Have you ensured you attend any workshops offered on the application process?

If you were my 35 year old friend with a languages degree and teaching degree earning not even £30k in the civil service I'd tell you to start looking for roles that use your skills. Language tutoring, interpreting, any role that needs a language you speak (like project management, account management, finance....) You haven't ruined your career but I do think you need to go in a new direction. get onto Indeed or LinkedIn and type in your languages and see what comes up.

As a lifelong CS worker, HEO roles are pretty difficult to get and I imagine OP will struggle if she’s already struggling with EO vacancies. I’ve seen hardworking CS colleagues with great experience continuously fail for successive years as there’s quite a difference in expectations from EO to HEO - never mind from AO!

HEO roles are often more specific in terms of the role so you’ve either done it or haven’t as it were. Also, contrary to public opinion, many times HEO roles go to external candidates who often from the private sector have more varied and stronger examples of leadership, challenging, problem solving skills etc.

I agree though that if OP wants to continue trying for EO work to try the work coach role. I did it myself for almost 10 years. It’s not for the faint hearted though but there are quite good opportunities for development - unless you’re stuck in a small office where SLT are just one big clique and then you’re a bit stuffed!

To progress in Civil Servicr you heed to volunteer for extra responsibility to build ip your examples for competencies for the grade above. Try going fof Work Coach roles, they cone up quite regularly had a lot of ex teachers do it.

Can you do any deputising or take on a project etc? Get a mentor and join donething like the Summer School, Beyond Boundaries. Apply foyhthe fast stream?

To progress in Civil Servicr you heed to volunteer for extra responsibility to build ip your examples for competencies for the grade above. Try going fof Work Coach roles, they cone up quite regularly had a lot of ex teachers do it.

Can you do any deputising or take on a project etc? Get a mentor and join donething like the Summer School, Beyond Boundaries. Apply foyhthe fast stream?