Bloody rude kids and parents- AIBU to be annoyed?

[dollydoops]

I’m a head of department in a secondary school and since the GCSE results came out last Thursday, I’ve been looking over students’ scripts who are near to the boundary for the next grade up, to see if they should be sent for a review of marking. I’ve had about 30 to do, and each one takes between 30 and 45 minutes, so the workload is not inconsiderable.

I have absolutely no problem doing this, as I said on a thread last week. I think of it as part of my job, and it gives me pleasure when a student’s grade goes up. However, I do have a problem with the staggeringly rude and entitled behaviour of some students and parents, including
-parents and students repeatedly emailing me to ‘chase’ their scripts and badger me to get them done quickly, even though they only came to me on Friday and there has been a bank holiday weekend in between
-students just sending me their scripts to review without even asking me
-students asking me to review their scripts without saying please or thank you
-students not acknowledging my email about their script at all, even though I have spent a long time writing it and making personalised recommendations
-one student who responded to my email suggesting that they shouldn’t get a review of marking, as their paper had been fairly marked, with ‘I find that hard to believe’(!!)

This is just so rude!! Do people not have any sense of basic email etiquette or manners any more? Has anyone else experienced similar?

name changed to protect my students and myself!

I’m a teacher. Nothing to add but just wanted to show solidarity. I know everyone is anxious at this time of year and they want the best outcomes for themselves/DC but the sense of entitlement/rudeness makes it difficult to bite your tongue at times. For any particularly rude/entitled ones, just let them know that you are officially back at work on the 5th September (or whatever) and will review it then.

Remember, you’re a lovely person and they really are grateful for all your hard work underneath (deep, deep down …)

Not remotely surprised by this! It's hard not to take things personally when you're working so hard for them, especially in your holiday. But they are the centre of their little worlds, and you are merely a 'service provider' :(

However, does your school expect you to do this?! That's bonkers to me, we pick out the ones who are 1, maybe 2 marks from threshold and pay for remarks - the rest can appeal/pay by themselves!

They assume it is part of your job.

which it sort of is.

also they don’t get taught how to write business type emails. When I was at school (old gimmer) we got taught how to write letters properly.

No, they don't have manners anymore. It never used to be like this. They'd be grateful and concerned about the extra effort you're putting in.

It's clear to see all over MN how the parental thought process goes (I'll just get the teacher to look at the script before asking for "remark") and those kids who just dump them on you and still refuse to accept your professional judgement have been doing it throughout year 10 and 11; only then it was theirteachers' application of the mark scheme they felt it appropriate to question with no qualifications in anything, as evidenced by the grade 3 they got because they fight against learning.

But even if it is part of my job, surely they should at least maintain basic courtesy? I don’t write to my colleagues just saying ‘Plan this scheme of work’!

Everyone is very stressed.

But you clearly work hard and that should be recognised - but more by the system and your managers than by stressed out kids.

I think since jobs have got ridiculously pressured, people expect more thanks - but really you should just have a manageable job, a good manager and a better salary. Then the kids that thanked you would be a bonus and the ones who didn't would be less of an issue.

Agreed. It's very rude and I, for one, am grateful for the teachers who reviewed my DS' papers.
Sorry so many are rude !

Definitely. They should ask politely and treat you like the expert they need in their corner for free.

It's nobody else's job, so becomes part of the deal by default, but I maintain it's part of September's reflections and for only the results our data shows might be problematic, not at the whim of everyone who can't accept their performance.

You have my full sympathies, OP. I feel like since the pandemic in particular entitlement has ramped up to the next level.

I quite often think about this and wonder why. I feel like society is becoming more ever more divided with the haves and have nots. A lot of
people are really struggling with all sorts of big issues - cost of living, cost of childcare, access to healthcare, climbing the career ladder or getting a career, lack and inaffordabiltiy of housing and so on.

Some types of crime are really rising like phone theft, shoplifting and drug dealing, which makes people feel vulnerable. The press , the Conservatives and Reform are whipping up a whole load of hysteria about people coming here on small boats and raping our women and girls, making people feel more vulnerable still.

So I think we are going through a big societal shift. I was sitting in my local cafe the other day having a quiet read and eating breakfast . There was one other woman in there (I slightly know her). She is about 60 and has grown up children. She had a FaceTime call without using headphones for FORTY minutes. I complained to her at the end and she said it was Ok on this occasion because her son was in Australia and they wanted to talk to each other. Strangely enough, I did not want to have their chat inflicted on me but when I said this, she just remarked that she was excited to hear his news. She was totally unable to see my POV.

@dollydoops thank you for taking the time to assess for the re grades. If they are going to be rude they can wait till school starts properly. Manners cost nothing. My son had a re mark a few years ago, we were both very grateful!! Me a bit annoyed as it cost me £45 for the privilege!! 😂

I've had a few rude ones. They're sitting in my inbox for a non contact period next week. The polite ones have been dealt with.

I wouldn’t say that my school ‘expects’ me to do it as such, but it is something that we have always done. Nobody has asked me to do it directly, but as I say, I see it as an automatic part of my job.

Is it really part of the job? This business of easily being able to review scripts is relatively new, at least in my subject, and has been the source of massively increased workload, during the holidays, with absolutely no discussion or consultation - just an assumption that teachers, especially HoDs, and especially of English, will do it. And they mainly do. In some schools I imagine heads put the pressure on too.

And that's before we start on the rudeness. A couple of years ago I spent so much time on this and barely any of the grades went up because the marks were deemed 'reasonable,' so I vowed never again - though of course I would do it in a heartbeat if someone asked me nicely or if I was genuinely concerned a student's marks were wrong. Luckily I have been promoted out of a role where this would be expected anyway and I think if this business of teachers checking the marking has to be a thing we need to reflect that in teachers' contracts - it's not fair on students that whether or not this happens is due to luck. We also need to ask what the fuck is going on with marking - why on earth should we be having to check it is being done correctly with no guarantee it will be addressed even if we do find issues?

Being thanked for something you have done should be a given not a "bonus". No wonder there is a serious lack of manners everywhere if this is the prevailing attitude.

My last school reviews of marking were a specific policy to get the pass rates and high grade percentages up as high as possible.

i’m an ex maths teacher and the more senior members of the dept (so not just hod) reviewed anything close to a grade boundary.

it was time consuming, but at least spread around the department.

This is a great approach @MrsHamlet, I should try that!

I don't get or expect many thanks in the normal course of my work. I'm polite and say thanks quite a lot, but I wouldn't expect stressed out teens to email me thanks for doing my job. But I would presume many of them would tend to say thanks more in person, because that's just normal interaction.

I also apply it to colleagues ;)

So when someone emails you some complex information that enables you to move on with the next step in a process, you don’t routinely drop them a quick thanks? I’m not expecting an essay- a student just replied with ‘Ok, thank you!’ the other day, and I was perfectly happy.

If a parent messaged asking/telling you to do something would not expect at least a please and thank you?

Yes I do, but we're not talking about me.

Do I expect all teens to thank me by email? No. I like it when they do, but I understand their state of mind.

@verycloakanddaggers I take your point, but the parents are also copied in on these emails. Would they not a) prompt their teen to send a brief word of thanks or b) send one themselves?

I don't personally reflect this way on every interaction. I get plenty of nice thanks and don't feel aggrieved when I don't.

I interact with people who are often frazzled. I don't think people have their eyes on all the balls they're juggling.

I believe most people appreciate the things others do and scientific research tells us choosing to focus on the positives is healthier than focusing on the gaps.

I'm sure you're really good at your job and you are positively impacting those young people.

My daughter has requested a remark and her email was polite I checked it. She said she was sorry to disturb her teacher whilst on holiday and wonder if she could kindly look at her script. Very polite.

She checks for a reply daily but I imagine they will reply on Monday when they return. I do wonder how long she should leave it before chasing them. As there is of course a cut off date.

Any advice from any teachers?