Synagogue course - AIBU to go even though I’m not planning to convert to Judaism?

[Fandango52]

Hi everyone, hope you’re all well. I originally posted this on the Jewish Mumsnetters section, but haven’t got any replies so far, so just thought I would repost here as there’s more traffic.

I’m not Jewish, but am very interested in learning more about Judaism, and I’ve emailed a couple of synagogues where I live - in London - to ask if I could visit them.

One has agreed for me to visit, and the other has asked if I might want to do a course which is open to people wanting to find out more about Judaism and people who’d like to convert.

The course lasts for a year, with weekly sessions, and course attendees are encouraged to play full part in synagogue life, including attending services, and there is a reading list as well. It’s not clear yet whether course attendees are expected to buy the books on the list or whether the books could be accessed another way. There is also a cost to the course - £400 for the year - which works out roughly to about £10 per session.

On the one hand, I’m keen to do the course as it sounds very interesting and it would be a nice way to connect with like-minded people, as course attendees are encouraged to have dinners at the synagogue together as well as the weekly sessions.

On the other hand, as I’m not planning to convert to Judaism but just interested in it, it sounds like quite a lot of commitments and I worry I might be a bit out of place and in the minority. There is the option to go along for three sessions to try out the course before committing to it, and I quite like that idea.

I’d be keen to find out if anyone here has done anything similar to this course and what your thoughts are on it.

Thank you!

£400 plus the cost of books for something you are just curious about? No, I wouldn’t do that. I absolutely love studying (I did an MA and PhD in my 50s) but I wouldn’t do that. There must be any number of ways you could find out about Judaism for free. Information is so easy to come by nowadays. These kind of courses really are aimed at converting people. If you don’t want to convert then don’t do it.

It does sound rather excessively structured, and jolly expensive ! I would just go along to the shul (synagogue) that welcomed you in, and see how you like it. What denomination are you interested in? Orthodox, Liberal, Reform?

I think it sounds like there would be a lot of pressure to convert the further into the course you get, and it might get quite intense. I agree with a PP, there are free and non committal ways of learning about Judaism that I would explore first

I think the 3 sessions are worth a try to see how you feel after that?

On the other hand, as I’m not planning to convert to Judaism but just interested in it

What's wrong with your local library and Google?

Thanks so much all for your replies.

@Sarover, @CarefullyCuratedFurniture, @Momstermash94 - I totally agree with you. The more I looked into the details, the more unsure I got, partly because of the cost (which may just be initial and require added costs, like you say) and because it requires a lot of time and commitment. I’m mainly interested in Liberal/Reform Judaism, but would also like to find out more about Orthodox Judaism. Do you have any suggestions for how I can learn more about Judaism please?

@fourelementary - that sounds like a good plan. I might go along to the first three and see how I feel.

@ScurryfungeSpuddle nothing, of course, but I thought this sounded like an interesting opportunity, as it’s much more immersive and engaging than just Googling and going to my local library (which I’ve already used resources from anyway).

It sounds like there's part of you that wants to convert.

Hmm I think there might be. The first step for me is to try and learn as much as I can before even looking at conversion, as I know I’m not ready at all to take that step yet though. I’d be very grateful if anyone has any suggested resources I could look at to learn more please. Thanks.

I am Jewish for whatever that's worth.

These courses are for people (for the most part) who have already done their homework and are interested in exploring conversion. It's not an opportunity to casually learn about another religion. I'd think you'd want to just read some books and learn more that way to be honest. The conversion courses are intense and really quite personal because they want to ensure that you are truly committed to changing your life to this degree.

Personally I'd think you should just read some books about Judaism (there are thousands if not more than that!) and go from there. if you are interested in exploring conversion then you progress via the synagogue that you like the most.

You can certainly attend services at most places without being a member or being Jewish - though you would likely feel more comfortable at a liberal or similar environment as opposed to a service 100% in Hebrew. Given the current situation, many places will have security so you'll want to reach out ahead of time to see if they need you to register or anything.

Late to this thread to say contrary to what other people have said, Judaism does not encourage people to convert nor put pressure. In fact it is the opposite and you can go through a whole course without ever being asked to convert, and in some cases actively discouraged.

As a member of the community I would advise not using Google or the library as reading is entirely disconnected from experience and capturing the essence of what the religion is about. Judaism is also a way of life so being able to connect with people in the synagogue and actively experiencing while learning is the best way to be absorbed.

People won’t judge you and I think they’d be grateful you were willing to put in the effort to learn more. No doubt you will be welcomed into many family dinners and other such events.

PS. I think go to the three and see how you get on. Likely you will make friends after the second session at the latest.

Judaism discourages conversion, that would not happen. See - the internet isn’t that handy when you want to learn about other people

If I had no intention of converting, I wouldn’t waste my money or their time. Maybe read some books to satisfy your curiosity.

I agree with this.

It's not wasting anyone's time to go along to services, though. If the OP is interested in learning more about Judaism, it's absolutely fine to go along to Shabbat services at the synagogue you like, say hello to a few people and just let yourself be immersed in the experience. Its exactly like going to a new Christian church.

The three sessions sounds like an ideal way to find out if the course would be suitable. I'm an agnostic and enjoy attending different religious ceremonies - there is, I suppose, a hope somewhere that I will experience something that brings me religious faith as I envy people who have that, but I wouldn't want to mislead anyone about being on an active path to conversion.

I’d say go for it! There will NOT be any pressure to convert that’s not how Judaism works. There is no better way to lean anything than to immerse yourself in it whether it’sa lifestyle or a language.

Thanks very much everyone. Can anyone please recommend any resources that would help me more about Judaism please? I’ve bought A Complete Idiot’s Guide to Understanding Judaism by Benjamin Blech (recommended online a few times) and have also started to receive email updates from My Jewish Learning.

They don't want converts. They are god's chosen people and don't really appreciate conversions. You can't opt in, god picks you.

Learning about the religion is respectful in a way that conversion is not.

Hi, I live in London and would be happy to invite you for a Shabbat meal, PM me.

As an aside there are so many free resources, particularly podcasts. I think the cost of £10 a session is fair enough they have to pay the presenter for their time.

I think also provided you sort out the security issue you can visit synagogue services.

re: books. I like Blu Greenberg’s how to run a Jewish household. It’s practical not theology but I think it’s quite useful.

I think £400 for a course is expensive but if you’re interested in it and think it’s worth it then you should do it 😊

There is no pressure to convert in Judaism as Jews don’t proselytise. It’s actually against Judaism to go out seeking converts. These courses are very much designed for people looking to convert (90% of whom will have a Jewish partner) and not as a recruitment tool.

I think you would feel a fish out of water on the course as Judaism itself is very practice focused. You’d be expected to live Jewishly to an extent while taking the course, attending synagogue, observing Shabbat and holidays, etc. I converted to Judaism 20 years ago (and took a similar course).

But Judaism, assuming you get the right sort, is a very welcoming and inclusive religion. Go to a service (a kabbalat Shabbat on Friday evening, something more casual, family service sort) or see if you can get yourself invited to a Shabbat dinner. Read some books. There are some wonderful books aiming at people who are converting but you can just buy them on Amazon.

Do be mindful that high holy days are coming up in the next few weeks, so might not be the best time to attend (you might not understand the context, people will be extra busy and might not have time to spend with you).

After Yom Kippur though, Sukkot is coming up, which is my favourite holiday.

From my understanding, one cannot covert to Judaism as, they believe they are a gods chosen people.

Two very good books you might find interesting:

Choosing a Jewish Life and Essential Judaism

I think we used the book, Conversion to Judaism, a guidebook in my actual course, but it was a bit drier than the two above.

This is not correct

You understand wrong.