We need to start charging for NHS services

[Fragmentedbrain]

£15 for the GP
£20 for A&E
NHS routes to paid-for fast track treatment
Options to pay for nicer rooms

We need to stop putting working people on disability benefits for want of a functioning health service it's barbaric

It certainly is with the staff. There’s tooo many tiers of management and not enough investment in the people on the front line. Diversity advisors etc etc etc.
been there then went to work for the private sector.
Shock amazement, costings for everthin broken down so we could see where money was being spent.
so much more effective than pouring it into a black hole.

Look at the threads dotted all over Mumsnet of people in agony with dental infections, long overdue fillings, broken and missing teeth because they literally cannot get an NHS dentist and cannot afford private. Many can't even afford NHS.

That model may exist in some European countries, but the model here that already exists is dentistry and it's fucking shocking. The dentists here are almost all absolutely useless as well. You will be getting worse treatment but paying for it.

What happens if somebody gets a cancer diagnosis and requires multiple visits? All those assuming it won't happen to them will be fortunate enough to only see the go maximum twice a year, who have never been through severe illness. Disease can strike anybody at any time, it should not be financially ruining as well as emotionally.

As an outsider looking in to your system, I think this paragraph nails it.

Second, in the long term, there is no evidencethat suggests any specific funding models routinely delivers a better health care systemthan any other. In fact, what tends to differentiate performance of health systems is the level of investment rather than underlying model of funding. This would suggest that a lengthy, costly and disruptive transition to social insurance is unlikely to deliver significant improvements in and of itself, without a corresponding increase in investment.

I see certain trends in posts about the NHS and the biggest trend is inefficiency.

A previous poster who mentioned her mum spending 8 weeks in a hospital for a scan, missed appointments because appointment notifications can’t be shared with family, people spending weeks to be discharged waiting for after care arrangements, etc.

I’m not here to try to convince anyone that US healthcare should be implemented, but you can’t deny that it’s efficient.

Things like dedicated MRI and ultrasound machines in ERs, systems that allow you to add people to your hospital/Dr records (for medications, appts, HCP messaging systems, test results, etc.), stand alone scan centers, Integrated hospitals (see a doctor at one but have 5 or more to choose from for some procedures), hours of availability (I have an MRI scheduled for next week at 6:15 am first appointment of the day…last appointment is 10 pm. This doesn’t include ER and inpatient scans which are available 24/7).

Another example;
I’ve mentioned before I’m currently undergoing cancer treatment and my cancer center has a 24/7 emergency clinic. At the start of this adventure I was encouraged to call the 24/7 nurse line if there was a problem and they would either instruct me to attend their clinic if it was something cancer or treatment related or go to the ER if it was something else (like a broken leg). This keeps cancer patients out of the ER (and away for a lot of germs, gives the patients specialized care related to their treatment, and shortens general wait times in the ER for non-cancer patients. It’s a win all around!

Don’t get me started on appointment scheduling, information, etc. by mail. How is that even a thing in this day and age. Phone, text, and/or patient online portals have been the norm since I’ve been alive (almost 50) (depending on tech introduction obviously).

It would seem that efficiency would be the place to start which would lead to cost savings eventually (missed appointments, headcount, faster diagnosis/treatment, repeat visits, answer shopping, mistakes, etc.).

I agree we should start charging, not sure how that would keep working people off benefits though.
My mentally ill relative won't be able to start working just because of NHS charges, they have meds to regulate them, and are able to access doctors, but are not well enough to work, probably ever.

I think refugees get free health care.

Those who genuinely cannot afford it could apply for exemptions or assistance. It would mean those who don't really need the service would be less likely to (ab)use it. In the long run doctors would be freed up to treat those who actually need it properly.

Similar happened to me regarding my DS. They basically put him on a list to see the specialist assuming he would need an operation (which he absolutely didn’t need) but by they time the specialist would have taken a quick look, he would have seen in 10 seconds what the nurse specialist missed. So he would have said everything is fine off you trot, so that referral was unnecessary because it never needed to get that far had the GP seen him. So yep there is a lot of waste that has financial implications.

I agree people will be reluctant to pay and I don’t blame them, as it is rubbish because we pay enough tax/NI, but I can’t see it getting better at all, because the governments keep spouting out there is no money

I pay for mine. Always did. Where I grew up it was paid and I actually didn't even know for years one can get it free here. Still considerably cheaper than a kid so win

It's €30 on the day to see a doctor in France. 70% refunded by the state and 30% refunded by your own insurance.

I couldn’t imagine anything worse.

My son was in hospital for 10 months last year. It was a horrendous time and I lost my job due to needing to be there for him for such a long time, I couldn’t imagine also having to worry about how on earth I’d pay for any hospital bills. Having a child in hospital is expensive enough as it is.

Now he has constant appointments and again, I couldn’t begin to imagine how on earth I’d be able to pay for them.

It would be horrifying.

Where did you pluck those prices from? Are they actually based on anything?

This! Penalising the same poor sods in the middle whilst my wealthy 84 year old MIL who is far far more likely to need the health service and worked five years her whole life, adds missed appointments to her list of freebies.

Christ, I can't believe people can't imagine any other healthcare system other than the 'American' system. You do know that most of Europe has a perfectly good healthcare system that is at least equal to American healthcare. Why do some people think that only America has a private healthcare system, there is a big wide world out there that has efficient and affordable healthcare systems that are not run like the NHS and not run like the American system. Open your eyes.

America is not the world, I don't why people just automatically use the American system as an argument against changing the way the NHS is run, unless you are hoping to frighten people away from at least considering there are better ways to run a health service than the NHS.

'We need to stop putting working people on disability benefits for want of a functioning health service it's barbaric'

Well as you voted for the Tories while they were in power, you and like minded people are responsible. NHS was is in a lot better shape before your lot got in

Obviously not all issues can be eradicated by getting fitter. But in the UK we have many many people who are ill due to diet or lack of exercise. They could take more responsibility for their own health. We don't have a diabetes epidemic due to genetics we have it due to UPF.

Well, they are forbidden work, so how would they "pay" for it. If you want them to pay, you have to allow them to work while their request is sorted. I wonder which would be more popular...

I hope you're campaigining for changes to inheritance tax, then. Currently many married couples are able to leave £1m free of tax to their children and grandchildren. This is obscene. It's an enormous life-changing amount of money and still would be if (say) £100k had been paid in IHT leaving £900k for the family. If that happened on a large scale it would be a big help in funding a decent system of social and health care.

The long and short of is that we are not paying enough in taxes and NI. The NHS is also not well run and there is a big crisis in staff recruitment and retention. This leads to a lot of people being unable to work and stops the economy growing. Vicious circle.

Labour are in power now so we’ll see how they do with the economy by the time they leave. Borrowing and taxes up so far.

Labour are already toast. We need Reform at the next election.

Surely if there were fewer time wasters and no shows, the surgery could organise clinicians to work different shifts across the week?

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g absolutely. Use her money. She should be paying for prescriptions and not being given nearly £450 pm in non means tested AA every month too!
And as an NHS worker of 35 years I know more than enough about how poorly run it is.

usernamealreadytaken I can work all the Saturdays you want. But then need an extra day off in the week. So no more appointments are actually provided.

If u ran the NHS I would be cutting a swathe through the payroll.

On Radio 4 the other week there was a programme about the financial crisis in the NHS. Two chief executives were interviewed, with one saying cancer services were having to be cut.

So I went on website of one - and I will name and shame: it was Birmingham - and they were advertising for a Diversity & Inclusion Officer for £86,000 + benefits. I couldn’t think to whom to complain - but that is taxpayers’ - nay, patients’ money that is being frittered away.

The NHS model has changed over the years; this would just be another change. NHS dentists aren't free at the point of use, but are still NHS. GPs aren't employed by the NHS, they are private contractors. The NHS was not set up to treat people who neglected their own health despite reasonable education, and was not set up to treat the world at our expense, which it frequently seems to. It also wasn't set up to drain skilled workers from developing countries in order to keep up with population growth from both wealthy and developing countries. But here we are.

Ah yes, evil nasty DEI. AKA making sure that people with disabilities can work in the NHS. How disgraceful /s