Is this part of being a Narcissist?

[Peterpickedapickled]

My DM is possibly a narc. She has no diagnosis but has many traits. At best she is difficult and toxic.

She is elderly but in great health and independent. I have had many, many issues with her behaviour over the years which include manipulation, guilt tripping, wanting attention, getting angry and she wants my attention all the time. She is capable of making her own decisions but relies on me to do that with many things.

Over the years I have learned how to deal with her to a certain extent but it’s so ingrained that it’s difficult sometimes and she still makes me feel guilty and like I am going mad.

I just need a space to put things down in writing because she is at it again and I feel so fed up. It comes in waves, when I am doing what she wants she is lovely and when I don’t, she is horrible.

She has just had a wave where she is messaging me constantly and it’s about my DD birthday in a months time. I have given opinions and lots of ideas and sent pictures of things to help but she sends me long, long messages basically wanting me to deal with it. She does this with EVERYTHING!

I was starting to feel overwhelmed trying to deal with her jobs and work, family life, house stuff etc. she then bought some glasses off the internet even though she knew she needed an eye test first and asked me to drop her at the post office to take them back. I said I would take them back save her walking back home. I mentioned that I would be going another day as it was the weekend and I would struggle to get parked. All sorted!

It was my birthday that day and I was going out. Phone kept pinging that night and at 5am the next morning, heading Important! Long messages saying she had changed the return place to some where else because I said there was no parking. The messages were confusing saying she will take them back but then sending me the return code. DM is definitely not having any memory issues etc. These message went on and on until I just said “please just confirm what I am doing as I am confused”

Thats where she starts. “Look if it’s all too much trouble don’t bother! It was because you said you couldn’t park” on she went basically she feels guilt about me having to ask me to do a job and then thinks I am thinking it’s an inconvenience when I really don’t.

I was so fed up with being constantly hassled and manipulated that I just said This was not a problem for me but now you have made it a problem. We had agreed what was happening and that’s that”. She does this all the time. I gave it some breathing space, for me more than her as I live in her pocket most of the time.

I contacted her today as we had made some arrangements for the weekend. She replied that I needed to apologise for treating her disrespectfully. I made the drama out of it. Why couldn’t I just go to where she asked me to go and she will never ask me to do anything ever again.

This is how it is all the time and I can’t tell you how absolutely rock bottom I am with it all. I am 51 years old and I have been dealing with this since I had a baby at 34! My brother moved away and it’s just me. I have had a traumatic few months when I lost my Dad and I don’t want to continue what’s left of my life feeling this way.

Thanks for listening.

What was she like before you had a baby?

I am really sorry to hear this it sounds extremely difficult. I have a difficult mother, (not as difficult as that but certainly potential to be) and the only things that helped me were: moving 200 miles away (which I appreciate is not always possible!); silencing notifications until they burn themselves out and then picking it up at my convenience; being clear about boundaries and what I can and can’t do; hardening myself against the emotional blackmail. My youngest sister got counselling to help her establish healthy boundaries with mum, this might be worth considering?

She does sounds bloody difficult.... I'm older than you and have been dealing with similar with my elderly dad... It's been an utter nightmare... Soul murder.

What happens when you put boundaries in place ?

Have you looked up Dr Ramani on youtube? (psychologist specialising in narcissism) or les Carter (psychologist with the same interest).

Narcissists rarely get diagnosed, apart from in forensic environments.

Narcissists relationships with others are completely transactional... Sadly...

@Petitchat well my DH says she has always been like it but I didn’t see it the way I see it now. She dictated a lot of things after I had my DD, made demands because she looked after her so I could work but that was her choice. I had a lovely MIL that was willing to help.

She ruined many special occasions like when I wanted to surprise her with the baby news and said I was driving to a party at her house. She accused me of having a drink at my MIL house the day before and she felt she was being victimised. She had it all wrong of course.

I don’t need her! That’s the problem. Last week she was looking for a care home miles away where my brother lives because I don’t want to care for her. She also went to hospital recently, nothing wrong with her, and called me and told all the friends she had made in the hospital that “My daughter doesn’t want to look after me. She had a spare room and turned it into an office you know” She laughs but it isn’t funny anymore, it’s hurtful. Now I look forward to her falling out as it gives me a break but I feel angry that I am turning myself inside out for this women and she treats me like dirt. I wish my Dad were here cause he understood. They divorced and he went on to live a great life

@IamtheDevilsAvocado I have done a vast amount of research. She may not be narc but she is still a very needy and toxic person regardless of the label.

I have often thought about counselling but have yet to take the leap. Being treat like this makes you wonder if it’s you that is the problem. It’s very difficult to come to terms with the fact it may not be you. DM is very anxious, needy and wants to please, almost begging her thank you’s so I don’t know if that’s a reflection on her behaviour.

She once said that when I go on holiday, she gets depressed. All I am starting to realise is it’s not normal. Something doesn’t feel right or good about this relationship!

She doesn’t sound great! My advice - distance yourself and deal with the fallout.

take ages to reply
let her rant or moan - ignore what she has to say
don’t visit her much
don’t speak to her much or when you do, limit it and say I have to go now - and go.

it’s the only way to stay sane.
it will be hard at first but stay strong.
her behavior may change. It may not but you’ll become less impacted by her constant criticism. She can ask you to do many things but if you just don’t do them - what can she do but moan….

Sounds like a classic narc to me. Feels like you are describing my own mother. The petty stuff about where to do the return and the endless phone calls over it? Yep. I mean, they make a huge deal out of nothing. The need for control, admiration, constant contact, endless references to "disrespect", the guilt, the manipulation, the silent treatments, the childish reactions. They're always the victim, even when they're the perpetrator. They're only happy when they get their way and it's very fleeting. They live to criticize. My mother was downright obsessed with me, practically stalked me (read: had to know every detail of my life through any means necessary), and no amount of time I gave her was ever enough. However, she seemed to literally hate me, rarely ever said a kind word, complained the entire time she was with me. So much negativity and gossip. My mother couldn't honor the smallest of boundaries without getting my father to try to bully me into compliance and or pitching a fit. She only lit up when she was talking trash about someone and the rest of the time she was anxious and depressed because basically she lived her life feeling like nothing was ever enough. She ruined ENDLESS special occasions.

Dealing with someone like this is exhausting.

I went NC over 7 years ago. It was liberating.

I have not missed her for even one day. My only regret was not having the courage to do it sooner.

Dr Ramani on youtube (psychologist specialising in narcissism) or les Carter (psychologist with the same interest).

Seconded - both very illuminating.

Just distance yourself, mute her texts and calls and answer when ready, if she wants something doing you just xyz at abc time and if that doesn’t suit her tell her she will have to find someone else

if she goes silent on you let her, you have to break the cycle

Jerry Wise (YouTube) and Dr. Sherrie Campbell (FB) are also great. Sherrie has some excellent books, too.

She is deliberately yanking your chain and you still going running.

Think about why you put her needs before your DH, DC and yourself. Why are you letting them have a raw deal from you because of her? Why is she more important than them?

She is very clever at what she does. I messaged her today after a few days cooling off. It was my plan to have her visit us this Sunday. I don’t know why I do this. She makes me feel sorry for her. After the endless messages and drama I didn’t want her at my house. My DH leaves the room and sits upstairs pretending to be busy! So I messaged her to say me and my DD would come to her as he wanted to get on with some jobs. It was a lie and I know I should’ve never invited her in the first place but I just couldn’t bare spending time with her this week.

She messaged me back saying “I should not insult her intelligence as she knows I don’t want her to come over. She is not sending messages two and fro so if I am not apologising I need to leave her alone”
BUT here is the manipulation and guilt tripping, she then puts “I have got other things to worry about than some stupid glasses”

This is what she does, wants me to start worrying that she has something else going on like an illness or emergency” Maybe she does but most of the time she does it for attention and to gain sympathy. I once went on holiday and called here when we arrived and she told me a GP had called her at home, knowing she lived alone, with test results and she had cancer. Turned out she didn’t but she didn’t want to make a complaint.

I have just messaged “okay, I will leave you be” I sometimes wish she would go and live with my brother. They are two peas in a pod. He has no children, doesn’t work, drives and his wife works all day. They have a spare room and a downstairs bathroom!!!! Perfect for her but she doesn’t want that of course.

"She'll never ask me to do anything again"
Good! Take her at her word. Don't offer to do anything else and don't let her guilt trip you. She may/may not be a narcissist but she's a bloody ungrateful pain in the arse and bossy with it.

@RandomMess the honest reason I keep going back for more is for a number of reasons, some of which are in grained in me, are habits that have played out for so long.

These are 1. Because I am frightened of what will happen if I have strong boundaries and about how uncomfortable I will feel

The guilt of her dying and me having regrets about difficult decisions I have made

Because I have been brought up to respect your mother and father and that any sort of nonconformity is wrong.

Because I fear what she will do if I don’t give her what she wants. She has told me many times that she has a cupboard full of morphine and will take it if she gets fed up of life.

Because I am still not 100% sure the problem isn’t with me because that’s what toxic people do.

I went to the GP before about her and how it affects me. I read my notes online and the GP had typed that I didn’t see these issues as emotional abuse. It seems the GP did see it as just that. That was the first time I had ever considered this!

Only you can step out of the role you play to get a different outcome.

Read up about grey rock and start parting it into practice.