16 & 17 year olds to be given the vote

[Whereishenow]

Just seen this announcement on BBC now. Amazing news!!! Now we just need to try and get youngsters out USING those votes.

I did answer the question. Because 16 is in line with other life long decisions we allow people the make for themselves.
And I'm not sure how being weeks away from a transition is anything remotely like the actual contextual life experience you said is so important...
(Please use the quote function, rather than mention. Makes the discussion much easier to follow and isn't difficult to operate)

There's not enough of them to get us in any kind of trouble, so don't worry about that.

Great news!
16 year old have a bigger investment in the future than most. Also, people are talking about life experience, but what use is the life experience of a 90 year old when it comes to education? Outdoor play? Youth services? We all have different life experience at any one time. It makes sense to make use of as broad a range of voices as possible.

It will also encourage politicians to consider the needs of young people, and hopefully engage more people in politics generally.

About time!!

If they're old enough to pay tax they're old enough to vote!

You need to be 18 to play the bloody lottery.

In theory yes. But I have been shocked at how many young people I know who - maybe misguidedly - have told me they will be voting Reform. They too are sick of life being difficult under the current Government. Young people are often not able to look at the long term picture either - they just aren't mature enough.

I've long thought that if 16-year-olds are liable to pay income tax (if working), then it's only right to give them the vote. The government should either exempt them from income tax or enfranchise them. I don't mind which, by the way.

I think it is a good thing. If you want political parties to focus more on long term policies that support young people then giving young people a vote is a positive way of encouraging this.

Well, technically, newborn babies have the biggest investment in the future going by your logic - why not give all teenagers/children/babies a vote?

Might some Labour MPs lose their seat in some areas though because of this, some areas have a high independent vote.

there is actually no minimum age for paying tax - even if you're toddler and somehow manage to earn enough to pay income tax, then you have to pay it.

16 year olds will vote (if they do) to protect their future. Many 65+ vote to preserve their existing econmic advantages (unless it comes to Brexit). My mum has a good atttitude - she votes to benefit my brother and I not herself.

Really can't believe anyone is against this tbh. Government would be happy enough to send 16 years out to war if it came to it - they definitely should have the right to vote.

Personally I think we all have a duty to vote and eligible votes ought to be fined if they don't vote, like they do in Australia.

I once (a long time ago) spent some time on the campaign trail with an (academic) psychologist who was standing for election. His party wanted to lower the voting age to 16.

I asked him in his professional opinion as a psychologist whether 16 year olds had the maturity to vote, because I didn’t think I had the knowledge or experience at that age (I was in my twenties).

His response was that research suggested that there are very few floating voters who vote based on policies and manifestos. Most people pick a party and stick with it, like they pick a football team. Often they make the choice for trivial or emotional reasons, eg who their parents or friends or a celebrity support or the local tradition. If people do switch, it is often for a single reason/a single issue, something that has happened nationally or in their local constituency, rather than because they feel the another party will be better eg Tory voters not voting because they are angry about Brexit. Changes in power are often just as much about the number of voters who support a party who turn out rather than voters actually switching sides IYSWIM.

His party’s policies appealed to the 16-18 demographic, so they wanted to lower the voting age to 16, not just because they would get their votes but also because they were more likely to continue to vote for the same party throughout their lives.

TBF, I didn’t ever check the research as it wasn’t relevant at the time, I was only interested in quoting his opinion 😂

For clarity, it wasn’t the Labour Party.

Agree.

And agree its gerrymandering.

I think its a bit of a worry about policies when politicians signal they think they might be popular with the most immature end of the population...

Maybe so - but you know this is different. 16 year olds can leave home and set up home on their own etc. Whole different ball game to a baby etc.

Does this mean we should expect some significant pension reform before the next election....?

Wonder if they will update the voter ID requirements?
A 16/17 yr old would need a driving licence (full or provisional) passport or voter ID authority form from local council. School or student bus passes aren’t currently accepted but retired or disabled bus passes are.
https://www.gov.uk/how-to-vote/photo-id-youll-

People actually change a lot maturity-wise between 16 and 18.

It doesn't really matter what the arguments are. What matters is whether they are valid or not.

Clearly there is a subjective choice about whether a cohort is qualified to make these sorts of decisions.

Or should we give 14 year olds the vote, or 12 year olds ?

I think most people would agree with the concept of a cut off, that at some point people attain the minimum necessary knowledge, life experience and maturity to make decisions independently of anyone else.

It seems strange to me though that this cut off is not a universal point. At the moment it seems to be (mostly) at the age of 18. But now it appears we are going to make some things like voting earlier, and there doesn't appear to me to be much logic or consistency in that.

Why should people not be allowed to drive, gamble, smoke or drink, look at porn on their own in a pub if they are 16 as well ? There are answers to these questions. But this is more about a joined up policy on the age of adulthood and when children should gain adult responsibility, rather than a quick gerrymander in order to get more votes.

The interesting thing is I see there is not much evidence based discussion on why 16 year olds should be allowed to vote. Most of it seems to be centred around "it's their future and they should have a say in it". Very little seems to be around whether 16 year olds are psychologically ready for it, what studies have been performed to demonstrate this and scientifically support the change of process.

It also seems pretty telling to me that most of the people who have experience of 16 year olds appear to concur that they aren't really ready or mature enough to have the vote.

The whole thing doesn't exactly appear well thought through to me. Which in itself is a sign that it is all about a quick gerrymander and less about a rational discussion.

Agree entirely.

When they need more votes they will lower it to 12 and offer a free lollipop.

Great. I’ve always believed this should be the case. There are some very politically switched on teenagers who should be able to vote, there are also quite a few that don’t give a shit about politics.

Excellent idea!

I completely agree. If you don't want them to vote then make them exempt from paying taxes. You can't take their taxes and not allow them to decide how it is spent.

'I think this is a dreadful idea and I'm not a right wing voter. 16 and 17 year olds think they know things but they don't, at that age they are very impressionable to extreme left and right positions. I thought I was grown up at 16, I wasn't and neither were my friends and we all had jobs etc alongside study. 16 and 17 year olds don't have the life experience to make those sorts of decisions. Mind you a lot of older voters don't either. I think this just shows that Labour are scared of reform, so rather than trying to do something to change things and win back around a lot of former long term supporters this is the route they will take. I'd always been a labour supporter until recent years and now find myself politically homeless.'

For the previous 14 years its has been Tories so well done for helping them or Reform back in

As or 16/17 year olds being impressionable to left or right wings the country is veering hard right and no 16/17 year olds have voted or been included in main polls.