Parents choosing not to vaccinate their children

[MidnightPatrol]

A child has died in Liverpool as part of an outbreak of measles. 17 are currently hospitalised with it in the city, as part of a wider outbreak.

73% of children in Liverpool are vaccinated against measles - vs an England average of 84%.

A rate of 95% immunisation is required for herd immunity. No child in the UK needs to be getting measles - we can vaccinate against it.

In Liverpool, there is a risk of a widespread measles outbreak due to this low rate of immunisation - it is very infectious, so the risk to the population is significant.

If you are a parent that doesn’t get your child vaccinated, why?

Should the government not be using further incentives to encourage people to take up vaccination - are a third of Liverpudlians really against vaccinating their children?

Should non-vaccinated children be limited from accessing nursery or schools (as in other countries)?

@Needlenardlenoo Why did you say the NHS isn't providing information?

https://www.nhs.uk/vaccinations/why-vaccination-is-important-and-the-safest-way-to-protect-yourself/

For goodness sake! They do! Clear, concise text. Further links to more information. Information on possible side effects.

It’s a direct result of Covid

What questions isn’t science answering regarding vaccines?

I agree with this. I know two parents who refused the MMR but they then sourced a separate measles vaccine. If the government wants people vaccinated against measles (and rightly so), why don’t they offer a separate vaccine? That would raise the vaccination rate a fair bit, I think. They could even charge a reasonable amount for it.

Does that separate vaccine exist any more?

If a baby’s immune system is so poorly developed, how do you think it will cope with a dose of whooping cough? Or meningitis?

To the people questioning the number given at once. Are you aware that one of the baby imms given is a 6 in 1 vaccine? This is given at the same time as the men B vaccine. Less people seem to have an issue with this than the MMR for some reason…

I didn't say they weren't. Having read the article I posted and the linked research, I suspect that they're not sending a leaflet with information at an appropriate reading level to the correct address, in a timely fashion, and then making there be a reasonable choice of appointments in accessible places for parents (well, mums) to book around work.

Of course the information is there if you're looking for it.

I have several chronic health conditions and I feel like I've got a part time job trying to keep on top of them there are so many barriers in the way. And I've got money, education and no new born!

Adult experiences also differ from your husband’s one example. The greater education and guidance should have come from your “highly experienced” doctor, who should have also told you that it was simply his opinion and that this is a very rare occurrence. In your single circumstance it’s obvious that knowing there was a reaction, as a precaution the situation should be avoided. This does not then give causation to question the millions of vaccines which are given safely to children all around the world, something which has been scientifically proven not to have adverse affects except in very rare situations.

You can have it separately if you pay for it. There’s no medical evidence that there is any benefit to this. In fact it’s unpleasant for the child having 3 separate vaccinations (x2 so 6 in total) and uses unnecessary nurse appointments.

Just search measles on FB, find an article and look at the comments
autism
sheep
we had measles and we were fine
not injected that crap

Ah Facebook - that highly accurate source of information and scientific publications... oh wait..

BTW - we weren't fine - wander around any early 20th centuary graveyard and look at the amount of child graves.

In fact here you go, first few comments and posts when I searched measles

I am so sick of hearing about the measles out break!! There is measles EVERY year around the first quarter of the year!! And guess what?!? These kids contracting it, 💉 or not, are getting the real antibodies needed to be forever immune. Measles is not a deadly illness by itself. It’s a vitamin A deficiency and can be resolved fairly quickly when vitamins A and C are administered to help the body recover.
The media is being paid to bring huge attention to the cases and cause mass hysteria. Please stop the madness, do not feed into it.

that is correct! The antibodies that are created from measles can in fact fight cancer cells. The problem is it has to be a true strain of measles and not the fabricated strain that comes from 💉

For my non-vaxing friends - if you’re feeling fear mongered by the unfortunate “measles” death that gave absolutely 0 info aside from being unvaccinated.. go read the comments in the link below. & then also, remember this. Vaxxed children 100% can and will likely contract measles. The unvaxxed didn’t bring this “outbreak.” We have plenty of resources and a massive community of people to help tackles this together and plenty of doctors and nurses that back and support not vaxxing. 🫶🏻

Measles is one of the contagious human diseases,it has been around decades and we all survived it,why the sudden scare mongering

Here we go again. Poison pushing

I am in a lot of alternative parenting groups and the misinformation is rife. It plays on parents emotions when every time a vaccine is mentioned all the commentators say it is “poison” and beg you not to give it to your child.
There’s a sentiment that if you don’t vaccinate your child they will be the perfect child who never gets ill due to their “perfect” immune system because of course pre vaccines no one ever got ill.
Theres also the idea that any illness is a vaccine injury. Apparently my daughter’s appendicitis 5 years after her preschool boosters was somehow caused by them. By what possible mechanism I don’t know.
I saw a post this week by a mum who was upset as she had given her child the 8 week vaccines and stopped after that but her now toddler had had recurring ear infections and she was certain that it must have been those 8 week vaccines that had caused this and pretty much every comment was agreeing with her!
Many people take the view that “big pharma” is just trying to make people ill despite the fact that they’d make a lot more money from treating all these diseases and the subsequent lifelong health conditions if everyone actually got the diseases. They also conveniently ignore the fact that all these conspiracy theorists make their money by being antivax and need to keep views up by making sensational claims even if they aren’t in any way accurate.
I think it’s partly that parents nowadays have no memory of having or seeing these diseases due to the success of vaccines and partly it’s a difficulty with preventive medicine that you are giving something to your healthy child so there’s an element of fear that it might change something even when it’s proven to be very safe.

@BoredZelda the case I have been referring to did not have anything to do with the AZ vaccine, nor did they suffer from a blood clot. I said life changing injury but stayed deliberately vague to avoid outing. You know nothing of this case.

I have seen the impact of vaccine damage.
My friend's little girl is incapacitated for life, physically and mentally.
In a wheelchair, unable to care for herself at all.

She was a healthy child before the vaccine.

I know that… I’m replying to the OP about why people aren’t getting their children vaccinated and giving some examples of what people are saying and reasons why
my mum was a ward sister in a children’s hospital, trust me I don’t need to walk around a graveyard to know the power of vaccines

I haven’t had the MMR and can’t have it so big fan of herd immunity and vaccination

I vaguely remember coming across something (either in a documentary or possibly a newspaper article) where anti-vaxxers were saying that they were concerned about the use of formalin/formaldehyde in the MMR vaccination, which might be part of the reason why some people choose not to vaccinate their children.

I know that there are risks attached to formalin/formaldehyde (I see it regularly on containers at work), but I suppose that you have to weigh up the risks in comparison to the potential illness and/or fatality of your child.

Apologies - misread your post.

Seems unusual that people would suggest reducing the number of vaccines given in one dose, if access to a GP appointment is the problem.

Many vaccines are given in schools, what’s the excuse there? The first vaccines are given at 8, 12 and 16 weeks, how many mothers aren’t on mat leave at this point? These barriers seem to be more about low income families, so the baby likely isn’t in nursery, who is looking after them if both parents are at work? I can’t understand anyone saying they didn’t know. The NHS has automated systems that send letters out for vaccine reminders.

If families are struggling to get their babies vaccinated because of a lack of GP access, this means you have families of babies who are not regularly being seen by the healthcare teams - health visitors, GP check ups, weight clinics etc. That’s a bigger issue if that’s happening.

The only point here that makes sense is that you can’t check your child’s status. That should be something you can look up and find easily. I went for every vaccine but couldn’t be certain of what my daughter had been vaccinated against.

My daughter developed a dairy intolerance after an infection. It’s quite common.

Common sense public policy. Hopefully the UK will catch up sooner rather than later.

You can’t have it separately - at least one is no longer manufactured.

Was there any explanation offered for the lower uptake in the city?

So 17 deaths out of 8 million vaccinations. Would anyone sane bet on a horse with a 17 to 8 billion chance of winning? - I think not.

The sort of scaremongering we see about vaccines is what causes deaths, not the vaccines.

I had measles as a child in the 60s before I got vaccinated. I remember being very ill in a dark room. It's why I wear hearing aids.

I had school friends who'd had polio, no one's even heard of polio now but it wasn't uncommon in the 60s. Children left wearing iron bars (calipers) on their legs.
DS1 was born in 1996 and DS2 in 98 at the height of the autism speculation. It was quite a tough decision giving them both MMR. Had social media been around then I wonder how much harder it would have been.

I do agree that there should be restricted access to nursery / education for anti Vax families.