To think someone with an assault conviction shouldn’t be working for the NHS

[PillockLarkin]

I had to go to the A&E department in my local town at the weekend. I was really surprised to see a man who I know has a conviction for Assault by Beating working at the hospital as a porter. I don’t know him but went to school with him and remember it being reported in the papers, it was about 6 or 7 years ago.

I understand that having a criminal conviction does not preclude you from working from the NHS but I was thinking that would be for a less serious offence, like unpaid parking fines or something.

I doubt he could have faked a DBS check so must have declared his conviction to the hospital and been allowed to work for them.

I’m all for second chances but I’m really surprised that someone can work the NHS despite having a criminal conviction for violence. AIBU?

This is an appropriate one. He is no more likely than anyone else to smack a patient in the face. And he is actually in a job with quite a high chance of being assaulted himself. Let him do his job without sitting there judging him.
Mumsnet is quite often very “they shouldn’t be seen again” when someone has a criminal conviction so I’m not surprised by your OP, but you really need to move on from that mindset. He needs a job. This is a job that most people don’t want to do. He is doing it. He isn’t a risk. Let it go.

YABU - You don't know him personally therefore you don't know anything about him, the assault, conviction or his consequences. Your knowledge comes from the local newspaper which if anything like ours, provides half a story.
And vulnerable people aren't only to be found in hospitals, they can also be found in banks and other industries.
What job do you think is suitable for a man with an assault conviction or indeed any conviction.

There will be a policy in place. If the job required a DBS then providing the conviction is not 'spent' then it will have been flagged up. A decision will have been made as to whether the crime he was convicted of means he is a risk to the people he his working with.

If the conviction is spent, then it will not have been flagged on his DBS and he has the right not to declare it.

He will have had a DBS check and depending when the incident occurred its probably spent.
He will not have needed an enhanced DBS- only clinical staff require those.

Ooh it "doesn't sit right" with the OP
bless

I don’t mind, some people want to get better and rehabilitated and it’s better than them being on benefits.

His conviction is probably spent. In any case, someone who got a jail sentence for battering someone in a drunken brawl or whatever is unlikely to be any kind of risk to a hospital patient.

He’s a porter. His job is to move patients and equipment around. You’re talking about him ‘working with the vulnerable’ but unless his offence involved him deliberately preying on or taking advantage of people in a vulnerable state, there’s nothing to suggest he’s a danger to patients as he wheels their trolley down to X-ray. His offence was battery, not grooming or sex offences or theft or premeditated sadism - he isn’t a predator. Do you really think he’s likely to kick an old lady in the head as he wheels her down to the operating theatre?

FWIW, I’m in hospital as we speak and I’d be happy to be wheeled anywhere by a man with a conviction for battery. If they had a conviction for opportunist sex offences, that would be different and I wouldn’t fancy being on a trolley in the lift with them. But if I knew a porter had headbutted a man in a bar fight I wouldn’t be worried he was suddenly going to thump me.

Ok but how do you square this with the difficulty recruiting for these roles? Is it better to have nobody in post than him, for example?

I went to University to study Nursing and there was a girl on my course with an ABH conviction. We were all DBS checked and each person's results were reviewed on a case-by-case basis.

She is now a Senior Nursing Sister. People turn their lives around.

Plus, having worked in the NHS for 15 years, I can tell you - if having a criminal record precluded anyone from being a Porter, there would be almost no Porter's, and I work at one of the biggest University Hospital Trusts in the Country.

He will have been risk assessed and monitored. Maybe he’s changed and deserves a second chance ? He probably really needs his job and at least he’s working and paying taxes .

Pack it in OP. Not everyone is as perfect as you.

His job it pushing beds wheelchairs from one part of the hospital to another. Full staffed hospital. The odds of him decided to beat up a random little old lady taking her to the CT waiting area are let’s face it highly unlikely.

Either his conviction is spent and thus doesn’t matter. It’s not spent but his been deemed no longer a risk.

If ex convicts cannot get work they have no life to be nice citizens for. You do realise there isn’t a king like of people waiting to push beds and wheelchairs around a hospital right.

Id be more worried if he had a fraud conviction tbh. One is a clearly visible crime one isn’t.

A basic assault charge 7 years ago will be spent by now, it wouldn’t even show on a DBS check as a result.

We can’t punish people forever. You commit the crime, serve your time, you’re limited by an unspent conviction and once that conviction is spent that he should be no less likely to get that job than you or I.

I feel my need to control everything just because I dont like it does not mean I get to control everything is not the answer, great skill to learn in life

And this idea that they dont know i would credit them with more intelligence than that

100% agree.

Vulnerable people not to exposed to violent offenders?

You dont believe that people can change or that rehabilitation can happen? Or that circumstances can change? His offence was 7 years ago. He hasn't reoffended in that time. Should he be punished for the whole of his life?

So you would rather this person sat at home claiming benefits for the rest of their life & not work ?

You do not know if this person has completed courses related to their crime & rehabilitation

You do not know if this person volunteers outside of work to help their community

I have worked & socialised with a couple of people who have been to prison. They have spoken about their crimes & repented.

People make mistakes

People can learn from their mistakes

Can you not forgive & give this person a second chance ?

Nobody is 100% perfect ever

I think if he had several convictions for violence then I would probably agree with you. But tbh if someone sorts their shit out after one then I’d rather he was working and doing something useful than not.

YABU, it's good to hear he's in employment.

People seem to be thinking I am saying he shouldn’t have a job. That is not the case.

I simply think if you have a criminal record for a violent act (or acts) that you shouldn’t work with vulnerable people.

Nothing really to add except it's odd how people with lists of criminal convictions seem to be able to walk into jobs whereas people who have foolishly forgotten to acquire any convictions in 30 plus years of adulthood can't even get an interview.

I wish I'd robbed a few more banks when I was younger ....

What specific risk is he posing in his role?

As someone else has already pointed out he will not have needed an enhanced DBS check which means any spent convictions will not have shown up on a standard DBS check.

How do you know he 'walked into his job'?

In a world where you can accidentally kill someone with a poorly-timed punch it is important to allow for rehabilitation.

I had to explain a conviction at every interview with the NHS for over fifteen years, it was always taken on an individual basis.

The recruiting manager will have discussed it with him and decided it was appropriate to take the risk.