3 day suspension for having phone out in school

[TooBored1]

Would you think this was reasonable?

For context my DC's school is consulting on going phone free - pupils will have to put their phone into a lockable pouch when they enter school. They will be subject to random bag checks, and if your phone is not in the locked pouch, or if you are caught using it, there will be an automatic 3 day suspension.

Overall, I'm in favour of going phone free, but I think the punishment is too much, especially as it is harsher than that given for fighting/bullying or disrupting lessons.

I also don't think it will prevent cyber bullying, as, as experienced by both my children, this happens in the evening, rather than during the day.

The punishment is ok - your are being unreasonable
The punishment is not ok - you are not being unreasonable

If the pupils know what the rule is I don’t see a problem. If they loose access to their phones and have difficulty with their journey to school and no phone to use out of school, good - will make them think before breaking the rule again. Punishments are meant to hurt.

"Punishments are meant to hurt"
Hmmm.... maybe?
But if a child (potentially as young as 11) literally cannot get home from school because it's too far to walk and can't get the bus because they can't access their bus pass, can't order an Uber because they don't have access to the app, can't contact their parents because there's no public phones.....
That's beyond a reasonable punishment in my opinion.
Some would also not be able to do their homework because schools put it all on apps 😂
Also you could have another child who commits the same "crime" and gets the same punishment but it doesn't affect them because they live a 5 minute walk from school and have alternative access to the internet at home.
So essentially one child is being punished, one child isn't.

Parents do it by behaving as parents. By engaging with the school in a meaningful, mutually respectful dialogue for the benefit of the children.

The fact that you are obviously not capable of this, doesn't mean that other parents aren't.

Gosh, that is awful communication from the school. Irrespective of whether or not the new rule is 'correct', the way they handled the punishment really goes to show that SOME schools really don't have the best interests if children at heart.

Yes, I agree about rules applying to staff too. The irony of adults dressed in summer clothing making children wear ties/blazers is not lost on me (and yes, my children have worn correct uniform, no I've not whined to school, in case anyone is wondering).

I'd love to know what rule I've ignored?

Ah, I see now. If this is the way you communicate, I'm not surprised you aren't able to manage a rational consultation

I agree, they shouldn't need them. I'm just exploring the proportionality of the sanction, when violence within school doesn't merit the same level of punishment.

Do be assured that if the outcome of the consultation is that a 3 day suspension is decided upon, any child of mine caught with their phone will serve their time with no complaints from either child or me.

@TooBored1 It’s not a case of parents not being engaged or wanting to! It will be the school not wanting to. If they really want 3 days they will get it and not all parents will ageee with you. You do seem very sure other people think like you do but when you read the thread, they don’t. I’m guessing you don’t know schools or mats very well.

I’m not able to manage a rational consultation? What on earth do you mean? I’ve responded in numerous consultations down the years, all come out with the result that the organisation consulting does what it wants anyway. Had you not been patronising to me, I might not have posted as I did. I’ve repeatedly said 3 days is too much for a first offence of phone out. Good luck with the school. You are “that” parent already.

You have once again claimed that the school sanctions less for criminal assault.

I just don't believe this anecdotal 'evidence'.

As you will know, given your role in professional consultations, you cannot consult with someone if they persistently refuse to base their perspectives in reality.

Completely baffled as to why a parent would have an issue with this! Unless they are happy for their kid to be cyber bullied or to be on their phone constantly which will ultimately affect their grades! All schools should be phone free. There’s absolutely no need for them and they cause no end of issues!

@Foostit it's not the banning of phone use in school that's the issue - it's the rather extreme 3 day suspension for a phone being seen out of its pouch during school hours.
That I personally think is an over the top punishment.

@Foostit So cyber bullying only happens in school? Obviously rubbish.

Well, I do know that my child was pushed down a flight of stairs. I do know that another child was taken out of school due to unresolved bullying.

Situation 1, a 2 day internal exclusion was applied

In situation 2, letters home to the other parents, internal exclusion, 'mediation' meetings between the children. No further action taken.

Please don't try and tell me that the lived reality of my children is not real.

Oh I totally agree, banning phones in schools cann only be a good thing. It's the sanction that I wanted to discuss.

From talking to other parents at the school, they are almost entirely onboard with a phone ban but very very few in favour of a 3 day suspension for a first offence.

I do agree schools may only want to pay lipservice to a consultation - it's our right and duty as parents to hold them to a proper standard, something I intend to do. I am fully capable of doing this, even if you are not.

As I've already said, if the eventual rule IS 3 day suspension, then my children will comply but until then, I have every right to engage in meaningful dialogue with the school.

Indeed, cyber bullying happens at home too. Totally in agreement with you in that. But surely all the more reason for a meaningful dialogue between school and parents?

Kids have pushed around on stairs for generations. What about a child attacking another with a piece of wood in the loo? What about a dc who punches another 5 times? What action would the school take then? What about being caught with drugs in school? Pushing and shoving isn’t great but usually doesn’t have the same consequences as the above behaviour. Sanctions should be appropriate though.

Generally I'm in favour, provided there's a 'two strikes and then suspension' or something similar in place first. I know how we struggle with phone use at home with ds, so can only imagine how difficult it has become for schools. I'm also in favour of total phone bans (I.e. locking them away during school hours) along with much harder consequences for vaping as well. Both are out of control in secondary schools from our experience.

Well if you want to take your kid on holiday but want to avoid the fine, just get them to get caught using their phone in school the day before you go 🤣

It's stupid that the message they are sending is that having a phone is a more serious offence than assault and bullying, and it's also silly that the outcome is that the child misses education. Taking the phone away would be much more effective.

I don't think it's the being phone free that is the issue here. It's the unnecessary level of punishment for having a phone out.

I have let students have phones out in lessons. The student who is waiting to hear if a close relative has made it through an operation or is cancer free, the student whose parent is bringing in their ADHD meds they forgot to take and that they are already feeling jumpy about.

Hopefully the school will realise that the punishment needs to be more along the lines of a one hour detention after school.

@pollymere How do you think dc managed years ago? You are a push over. Of course they can wait!

Pushed down the stairs during free movement of pupils around the school, or targeted and pushed down the stairs from top to bottom when the corridors are empty? Because the former is horrible, nasty and should be sanctioned, while the latter is the kind of violent assault you were portraying earlier.

And this is important as you're claiming phones out gets a harsher sanction than a violent assault, but to understand if you're correct, we'd need to know what you're saying constitutes a violent assault.

Similarly, re: bullying. No child should experience bullying in a school setting, but you weren't comparing the sanction for phones to the sanction for bullying, instead you were comparing the sanction for phones to the sanction for violent assault.

I believe this is your issue. You're needing to exaggerate claims of violent assault to support your point. Tagging the phrase 'lived experience' on to the end doesn't make something actual evidence.

As an aside, I really hope your DC has recovered well. That's a horrible thing to happen.