AITA for giving DH an ultimatum?

[FrenchFries96]

I’m fed up, Mumsnet. Like completely and utterly emotionally drained.

DH and I run a business in the motor trade. He’s been in the trade for about 20 years, I’ve been involved since I was a small child with dad/grandad. Finally decided to build our own about 5 years ago.

Business is successful. We have a lovely customer base, and are often fully booked 3-4 weeks in advance. We both play a part day to day and work equally as hard as the other. We’re open 9-5 and for the most part, it works.

DH is a chronic people pleaser… (I’m talking saying yes to jobs we agreed not to take on, over-booking daily workload, reducing prices for people, working late for “friends” who only appear when they have a car related issue, overriding company policy “because the customer asked for it”, etc)… and this has been the root of several explosive rows over the years. I often go home on my own, sort the kids out, make dinner, feed the dogs, etc etc, and then go to bed, all before he leaves work.

Recently it’s happening more often and I’m suffering because he cannot set boundaries with people, or with himself. Our relationship is on the brink, his health is deteriorating, family life is suffering, and quite honestly, resentment is creeping in.

I’m at the point of giving him an ultimatum - sort your act out, or we shut it down.

I know it sounds extreme, and I’ve worked just as hard for this as he has, but I’m so done. I would HAPPILY walk back into a paid employment if it meant saving everything else.

AITA? What would you do?

What’s his role in the business what is your role? It sounds like it may not be a good fit for him and there needs to be an adjustment.

It sounds like you can manage appropriate customer facing relationships, but your husband either can't or won't. Since it's a successful business and you have good customers it seems a shame to close it down.. Would it be possible for you to continue running the business but with another person in the role your husband fills now? He would step away from the business and get another job elsewhere.
Alternatively, would he attend counselling to work through why he feels the need to behave in this way?
I can feel your frustration and anger and can understand it. Does he realise how close to the edge things are and what answers does he give?

He does need to probably put some boundaries in place, but being a people pleaser is a personality trait. My dad was the same and it drove my mum mad, but it was a part of who he was and hard to just switch off. You need a proper chat where you make it clear you’re not prepared to do all the child care, family life whilst he does favours for people. His family need to he his priority. Getting him to actually change though, won’t be easy.

Is he aware he is a people pleaser?!?

If he is sit him down and remind him in saying yes to everyone else he is actually displeasing / letting you and the kids down and shouldn’t you and the kids be number 1?

My DP tried the I’m a people pleaser line on me once and was shocked when he realised pleasing others ( that sounds wrong but you get the idea) was at the expense of my and the kids happiness so …was he actually a people pleaser if his family is not happy

Yanbu.

How hard is it to say id love to help but the boss says no.

Also he isnt pleasingvthe people who matter- his family!!!!!

He's not a good man, he's a selfish one.
His ego puts people pleasing first, aheead of his children.

This makes him a shit husband and a shit father who avoids his children.

Yanbu.
Do whatever you have to make him realise you are done, the business is finished and his selfishness and ego has destroyed it.

He sounds like a moron that people make a food of.

Just a response to some points…

We have equal shares in the business, so equal authority. He does majority of the physical mechanical work, we both write vehicle software files, and I do some minor mechanical work and vehicle diagnostics, as well as the majority of the administrative side.

Moving him out of the business just isn’t an option. I know it sounds obnoxious, but I’ve only met a couple of other people who has the level of skills and knowledge that he has, replacing him from a business perspective would be impossible. Equally, there’s been times where I’ve temporarily stepped away from the business for various reasons and everything has gone to shit, so it doesn’t run without me either!

I think he’s somewhat aware that he’s a people pleaser, and I’ve absolutely made it clear that by pleasing everyone else, our children and I are suffering for it. Off the back of those conversations it will improve, everything will run smoothly, he’ll say no to people more comfortably and I feel we’re getting somewhere - then it starts to slip again and we end up back at square one.

I’m absolutely not a people pleaser. I love our customers and will always do my best to give them the best experience. Equally, I will go above and beyond for people who give me the same energy, but in a general sense, I don’t care if people like me - I care about people who care about me! So I genuinely struggle to fathom how the needs of complete strangers can have such a hold on someone’s life.

If he was truly a people pleaser then he would be bending over backwards to please you too, but he doesn't. He changes just enough to shut you up before continuing in his normal way which involves him doing whatever he decides he wants to do which also includes him opting out of family life and letting you work full time, deal with the children full time, and do the majority of the housework/admin whilst he just does one.

Open your eyes.

If it's a successful business, I'd be cautious about making him change too much. People are valuing the extra service and good value.

Is there some way you can channel that into more of an upside? Encouraging people to do reviews, social media, word of mouth referrals etc.? A business owner actually doing right by people with some passion is something to build on, not break down.

I don't work in the trade at all, but it sounds like the problem is where he is talking to the customer. Can you move him away from that, so he's just fixing things, and doesn't actually discuss with the customer at all?

It would need him to have some sort of boundary still I think - he'd need to just refer them to you, which I suppose he might not!

What does he say when you discuss with him?

I hear you, and my eyes are open to what’s going on.

Despite what it may sound like, he’s a very good person. He’s extremely talented in his work. We both have very good relations with the majority of our customers, are always receiving lovely feedback, and have a good reputation both locally and further afield.

We are a small business, it’s just the two of us and we employ one other mechanic so we all work together are share a large portion of the jobs. When I leave in the afternoon, it’s down to them to then deal with vehicle collections, payments, etc. Moving him to a non-customer-facing role would be impossible.

He does try to redirect people to me, but over the years that’s been a problem in itself because I get the “I need to speak to someone who knows about cars” or “I needs to talk to a man” (yes, I know 🙄).
All of our regulars will speak to me and there’s no issue, but it’s the minority who think they can undermine me by speaking to him that are the problem, and unfortunately, his tendency to please those people just plays into their hands.

I don’t know what I want to achieve to be honest, I’m just incredibly frustrated and needed to have a rant!

Despite what it may sound like, he’s a very good person.

He probably is a very good person - to others. But you need him to be good to you and the children too. There is a reason why there's this stereotype regarding abusive men being charming upstanding pillars of the community whilst their wife is beaten black and blue behind closed doors. They hide in plain sight. Now I'm not saying your DH is abusive as he might just be thoughtless and selfish, however the resulting outcome is still the same on you. He does his own thing whilst you are running yourself ragged after him, for him, instead of him. You are twisting yourself inside out and he's giving nothing back.

Since you now know he won't change you will need to change your reactions. Either accept this is your (crap) life, or put in measures to reduce your running around eg cleaner, babysitter, relief (possibly male) receptionist, or make moves to start planning a separate future. They are all shit decisions but they are all you have, and he is the one who has forced these shit decisions onto you because he can't be bothered to change for you, or for the family unit. It IS a gut punching realisation when you finally understand what is happening. I'm sorry if you feel I'm being harsh here, full disclosure - I stayed for 30 yrs with a similar good man and it nearly broke me.

This sounds like a "how do we run our business better" question. Have you thought about a business coach? (I'm not one, but I used to run my own business and I know how hard it is and think an outside perspective could be useful)

Drawing conclusions that the husband is abusive or doing this on purpose because he refuses to change or whatever seems like a massive stretch.

You need to have a discussion around how the business works for you both. particularly if you are nearing retirement.

Do you have a clear budget of what profit you want to capture per week/month? Are you monetising the extra requests and favours?
My dad was a perfectionist and helpful to a fault - literally. Your DH needs to realise that the opportunity cost of this work is his family, and whilst that’s not got an invoice it does have a heavy price. He may be scarred from drought times, or thinking he needs to earn x while he can…?

Also sounds like you have specialist software and tools, and client relationships and those are valuable. Have you broached succession planning or could you sell the business to a competitor or someone in a complementary or adjacent business?

My partner runs a successful motor trade business and has done for over 30 years, but he definitely "downs tools" at a certain time of day and that's him done.

Can you get your husband to set proper start and finish times and not waiver?

Does your husband love his job? Because if he does it's probably difficult for him to then be present with you and the children if he's secretly wishing he was working.

I would look at financials so you can show that you make your money from the regulars who behave. These ones who he is scared of upsetting could be lost without much financial hardship and WITH a far better life.

And yes, if you are that stage then an ultimatum is reasonable.

The only control and leverage you have is selling your shares and youll need to use it.

Do you have any dispute resolution processes? If not, I'd suggest setting an appointment with mediator to draft a charter for dispute resolution, followed with an ultimatum of attending the meeting or you sell your shares.

Once he fails to follow the dispute process, you follow it.

Basically you're in a position where your only two outcomes are putting up or forcing change. Forcing change may result in a loss of livelihood or divorce.

But you're clear you can't go on with this so I'd crack on with reaching a conclusion.

Callous as it sounds, if you sell your shares and retain the money, you can start over when he runs the business into the ground and let him back in in either an employed position or as a person without equal say.

I think some pp are a bit harsh and acting like your husband is some evil person maliciously avoiding the family and all the other man hating rhetoric.

It’s not that deep. I work in the industry and a lot of small shops are like this. The work just almost never ends and idk how you’ve managed to run it with just the two of you. Impressive but wild. If the business is successful, then think about hiring a secretary to handle scheduling and customers and maybe you can train them to write estimates and do diagnostics (plug in a scan tool?).

I’m from a different country and it’s hard to fill roles in this industry so I do get it. Estimators and the like are not growing on trees. But really you guys need more help. Not to throw a tantrum and shut the business down completely. Grow it, expand it, maybe bring your children in when the time comes.

To be honest, it sounds as though this is a powder keg waiting to explode so you might as well give him the ultimatum now rather than a few years down the line. Perhaps if he sees you are deadly serious he might amend his ways but it probably won't last from what you've told us. It does seem a great pity to close the business though after you've both worked so hard.