Teaching OMG!

[LucilleBluth]

I have been training to teach this year. I started my PGCE as a 43 year old in September 2024. I’m about to finish it-well I say that. I’m feel like I’m hitting rock bottom with two weeks to go. I have worked in schools as support staff before so I wasn’t totally blind and I have good friends who are teachers, but oh my god, it is such hard work. The workload is insane-the kids are lovely but I’m dealing with so much extra stuff like SEN, EAL is off the charts, behaviour, kids without equipment and who can’t cope unless a lesson is chunked and scaffolded so much I may as well spoon feed it.

I don’t feel I can do it full time so I applied for a Cover Supervisor role-15 qualified teachers applied for a £21000 year job, I,didn't get it. What’s the point

Teacher pay needs doubling. I’ve been awake since 1am.

However the figures you quote are in reality not huge increases. Friends who are teachers says it’s not the SEN that’s the issue, it’s parents who want support their child/school. This is leading to an increase in bad behaviour from not only students but parents too!

I appreciate your insight and fully agree that nursing and teaching are very different professions with their own pressures — but I do want to point out a contradiction here.

The comparison was made - teachers were described as earning "significantly more" than Band 5 nurses, with figures quoted. But now that it's clear the roles aren't equivalent in pay progression, structure, or working conditions, the argument is shifting to “we can’t compare.”

I agree we shouldn’t be pitting professions against each other. But if pay comparisons are going to be raised, they need to be accurate and framed in context. Both professions are undervalued in different ways, and both deserve better.

Congratulations for getting all but through the PGCE year.
I tried to do similar and realised that teaching in secondary was not for me after two weeks in school.

At present the messaging that is coming out is simple ‘get rid of EHCPs’. Which parents have fought tooth and nail to get in the first place. The government should keep its mouth shut until it has a complete new way to provide planned out, with stated requirements, aims and a timetable.

Then SEN parents wouldn’t be panicking.

My DS, now 22 has wanted to become a primary school teacher since he did work experience back in secondary school. He graduated from his degree in Early Childhood Studies a couple of years ago. He took a break before starting his PGCE and continued working as a TA at primary level.
Now, he has decided he no longer wants to follow a career in teaching. He has always been aware of the extra hours and the stress the teachers deal with. Last year, he was the 1:1 TA for a child with attachment issues- this child was often violent to other staff members and children but my DS had a good relationship with him and the child was never violent towards my DS. The issue was, whenever my DS wasn't around, the child would violently attack others and my DS felt a huge sense of responsibility around this. My DS MH suffered, he was very attached to the child and watched as he inched his way closer to being excluded. The child was eventually excluded and my DS was so affected by this as he felt he'd failed the child. I have to add that the school, his colleges, the parents and the outside agencies my DS had to deal with were incredibly supportive. The point I want to make is, my DS had no extra training to deal with these violent outbursts, except a session of safely restraining violent children.
The whole experience has put him off teaching. He does still work at the same school as a TA while he decides what he wants to do.
The flip side of this is, I have a friend with a child with SEN. Her child hit a TA. The TA was in tears and went home and my friend was asked to go up to the school to discuss this. She was very rude about the TA starting saying she would have been trained to deal with things like that. I did put her straight- very firmly but it upset me that she thought there would be training for that!
I would say- please finish the PGCE, it's an extra qualification that you can use as others have said. It would be a shame to get so close to qualifying and not do it.
Good luck!

you have to account for the fact that many teachers are forced to work part time just so that they can manage their work load. In that sense their getting paid say two thirds of their salary for still working effectively full time.
This pisses me off so much in terms of new mothers and parents. Teachers are predominantly women of child bearing age and their careers (and bank balance) suffer because of this.

This is true of many jobs. I work in accountancy and almost no one comes back 5 days a week after having kids.

@TheCaloricDeclineit was brought up as it’s always compared.
No you can’t compare my job to yours as I literally deal with clinical decisions based on my assessment to treat patients. A mistake could kill a human being on my feet and critical thinking for 13 hours (as I get paid for 12 but often have to work through break whilst trying to grab something to eat)
But that doesn’t say that my stress is worse that anyone else’s! Teaching and nursing are known to be stressful public sector jobs.
My friends respect each others professions.

But you can compare pay scales: both post grad public sector roles.
Teachers are paid more… from qualifying. It’s there in black and white.
I am highly experienced after 15 years I have extra qualifications including nurse prescribing which I am not paid extra to do.
My friends who are qualified 14/15 years as teachers were shocked at my wage as it is significantly higher. (45-50k without TLRs ) Extra responsibilities they are paid for, it’s the policy for the Trust they work for.
This is why we don’t discuss!

Most nurses spend their whole career as staff nurses and can’t go above 37k in pay

I returned to teaching after a break working in the NHS on a nursing grade. I loved going back into class and was a full time SENCO in a local school. The work load was hard, and expectations from parents high, especially as we took children who had been excluded from other schools (and often more excluded several times). We also had both the Women’s Refuge and the Children’s Home in our catchment area, so often suddenly had to deal with traumatised children arriving with little of no notice. We coped - actually I think we did pretty well as I managed a great team of TAs and we were usually able to turn things around for the children. Then we had an influx of EAL children who had little or no English. They came my way as well - but with no extra money. We still managed.
Then things changed. The first change was parents became aware of SEN as a cash cow. I was suddenly inundated with parents, form in hand, and asking me to sign to say their child was autistic - despite any evidence to the contrary of anything we could see in school. They would be blatant about their reasons for asking ‘ I need a few more points so I can get a shower installed’’ ‘ ‘I can get a car from Motability for them’, ‘I can get a bigger council house’ etc etc. When I explained I couldn’t sign if I hadn’t actually observed the behaviours they were telling us , the abuse would start - threats to go to the press, verbal abuse, being rubbished, complaints to governors etc. Our SEN numbers started to go off the charts. But still we were providing a good service. At the same time we were seeing at least 30% of every Reception class arriving with language difficulties - they could speak , but couldn’t explain things. (how can they ever write a sentence if they can’t say it first?). Seven different language programmes and our own contracted in speech and language therapist helped.
Then the budget cuts began.
I could weep at what I see now. Exhausted teachers struggling with children who can’t sit, can’t listen, can’t concentrate - and don’t care if they are told off. Parents who regard their children as absolute angels and it’s everyone else (especially the teachers) who are the problem - despite all evidence to the contrary. More children than not who require ‘special support’ that one teacher simply can’t give, especially when so many of the TAs have had to be let go.
I’ve seen parents fighting each other, rolling on the floor pulling each others hair - in the school buildings. I’ve seen parents swearing at their children - or ignoring them. In fact one professional who visited , watching me work, said afterwords ‘you are more a therapist these days than a teacher’. It’s sad because it’s true. I’ve lost count of the threats, and the times I’ve been hurt by unruly child.
I love teaching. It’s a privilege to be able to help children. But it must be a partnership with parents. It’s time teachers were given respect as professionals. As a first step at the end of each day I’d at least like to see parents look at their child in the face, smile at them, and ask how their day was - and listen to that answer - rather than be glued onto their mobile phones and ignoring their children - something unfortunately I see far too often at the end of the school day.

Just to be clear no one was comparing pay until that was brought into the discussion. I was talking about the workload and realities of teaching, especially around SEN, not trying to argue that one profession has it worse.

But once teacher pay was mentioned — and used to imply teachers somehow have it easier — it naturally required a response, with proper context. You can’t compare salaries in isolation and then say “the roles are too different to compare” when it suits the argument.

A high number of my family are nurses, and I have huge respect for what they do — I’m under no illusion about the emotional, physical, and clinical demands of the job. But I also know the reality of teaching. While the consequences might not be clinical, they’re still serious — safeguarding, legal responsibilities, the wellbeing and education of 30+ children at a time, constantly adapting to needs (often with zero support), and navigating a system that is data-driven and chronically under-resourced.

We’re all tired. We’re all doing difficult jobs under broken systems. I’d rather stand alongside fellow public sector workers than argue over who has it worse.

Do you have children? If so I assume you want teachers to teach them?

Yes. Education is one of those sectors in which you're expected to work for free, simply from the good of your heart and 'passion' for your subject. My employer's response when we worked to contract (38 hours) as part of an industrial dispute was to dock whole days' pay for 'partial performance!'

As educators we've made a rod for our own backs by going along with this in the first place. Now it's entrenched into the entire system. No wonder there is currently a recruitment crisis in schools - if not universities, who have the opposite problem.

That's not an outstanding teacher. An outstanding teacher would be able to teach the bottom band year 7s and have the integrity to take a fair share of classes rather than leave them to less experienced or less confidence teachers.

An outstanding teacher would inspire and motivate bottom bands in badly achieving academy schools, in the last lesson of the day.

This is no outstanding teacher.

The objection is that within that group support an individual's particular rights via EHCP may not exist.

Today I had to find and deal with 4 year 10 students who had stolen pig hearts from the science technician room and were throwing them at other students on the corridors. Then I was called to come and remove a truanting student who was running down corridors shouting "two in the pink and one in the stink!" and ripping up her books and throwing them everywhere.
I rounded the day off with a meeting with a very upset teacher who has been subject to a torrent of abuse from a student, when she called home the dad said "what do you expect me to do, he doesnt f*ing listen to me either"
Honestly, there is no amount of money that makes me think this should be my life. I'm too far up the scale now and the main wage earner for my family, so I can't just quit, but there are days where the job takes me to the brink of despair.

Lots of negativity on here. I'm going to upset the balance and be positive.
You are almost there. You've worked really hard to get where you are. You didn't go into it not knowing the pitfalls. You are tired which hinders clear thinking.
Think about the positives you can bring to the job and why you trained in the first place.
Look backwards at what you have achieved, not forwards at what you fear.
You can do it! Make a difference to the young people you work with. Schools need motivated staff, you can be one of them.
Good luck.

I bet you used to think ‘why do teachers get paid more than us?’ in your last job too! I’m nearly 20 years in and you can bet your life I won’t be doing anymore teaching when I finish in two years time.

Can I ask a serious question?
Why back in the 80's and 90's it was 1 teacher to a class and there was none of this struggle. There was mixed abilities in my class back then. Now there is a whole heap of issues and help in the classroom.

My form tutor homeschooled her own children says a lot about the schooling system.

It’s that attitude from parents though that is too commonplace. A TA should be trained to be a teacher, be paid a pittance and be physically abused. So disheartening. I saw a TA role advertised and thought it was a mistake the £10k pay.

Just out of interest what is the difference between monthly take home pay of a newly qualified teacher and a cover supervisor (assuming full time employment)? Does anyone know rough monthly figures after tax / pension etc?

I'm an ex teacher and I home ed my DD. I know a lot of ex teachers who also home ed. It's very telling.

Why are you comparing to nurses? Nobody is denying nurses aren't paid enough! It's not a race to the bottom.
Nurses aren't paid enough
Teachers aren't paid enough
Also consider that teachers have to be educated to degree level.

I wanted to be a teacher since age 6.

I did a 4 year Maths degree with QTS.

I loved my job when I started.

I still love my job now.

I love the daily contact and changing lives.

I can say that, as I have 30 years experience under my belt.

I'm advising DD to NOT do a PGCE after her degree, as the job I'm doing now is not the job I trained for.

The biggest changes are

Safeguarding safeguarding safeguarding
Parents as consumers rather than partners
Children's behaviours/SEN needs have grown exponentially

I wish you all the best OP, however you decide to proceed.

Better question: which rock have you been living under for the last 10 years?