To think the government needs to stop selling online GP booking systems as an improvement as they’re not particularly when they’re switched off for most of the day

[Gr3yStar5]

Like many GP surgeries ours switched to an online system and no longer takes booking calls. This was some time ago so it has had time to bed in. You fill in a form which gets triaged and it’s decided if you need urgent or a 2 week wait. It was sold as improving patient care and a better booking system except it isn’t. The system is supposed to be open from 8.30-3.30.In reality the system mostly actually seems to close by lunch time until the next day due to being “overwhelmed”. So basically if you don’t get on first thing you’ve had it, you can’t even ring and you have to keep checking to see when it reopens. It’s worse not better and most of the time you can’t see a doctor for 2 weeks if you do get to fill out a form. There is now no in between. You are supposed to say when you can’t do appointments but it just ignores that. It’s nigh on impossible to get a doctor of your choice. If they don’t get you in for a 2 week appointment or you can’t do the time they’ve allocated you have to resubmit your form for the next batch of 2 week appointments( if it’s open). The setting up was dire with condescending staff on the phone just basically shooing the bemused elderly off. My mum has told me of several of her elderly friends who have been reduced to tears by the whole process. I thought this was maybe just our surgery but it isn’t. Lots online with similar tales particularly re the “overwhelm” switching off of the booking system. Oh and now apparantly our GPs can't do gynaecology appointments, that has to be in gynecology clinic and booked separately which is actually currently closed and not taking appointments. Back in the day you could request a female GP and have female issues treated by your GP, not now, being female is an extra loop to jump through.

So AIBU to think that the government needs to be honest and concede that the new online system is actually shite for patients and getting a GP appointment has never been so hard and stressful particularly when they’re apparently going to be investing in extra spaces at GP surgeries. Thanks but no thanks I’d rather have more GPs and a better booking system that actually benefits patients and gets you an appointment in a timely fashion.

It doesn’t seem to be that though. Going by this thread they struggle to get work. https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5101805-but-i-thought-there-was-a-shortage-of-gps

Yep we get this too. It’s not made clear until you need to use it that the system shuts down quickly so basically it’s worse than before or that women have to jump through extra hoops for anything gynaecologically related.

And this is why the system doesn't work. I used to work for a doctor who was a gp between 1970 and 1980 always complained about the contracts young doctors were on...no out of hours, huge pay etc.

GPS in England start on £74k and the pay range goes to £115. Whilst I'm all for rewarding work and achievement. The average full time salary is £37k...so a doctor starts are double the average

For most GPs 3 days a week work is full time hours, almost.

My GPs work 10-12 hours per day. Nobody can do that safely 5 days a week, and why should they?

Many GPs are parents, and may want a better work life balance.

And yeah if I’d been studying to a high level for the best part of 10 years, and had a job making life or death decisions I’d want decent pay too.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-deal-for-gps-will-fix-the-front-door-of-the-nhs

Whst a load of rubbish. They haven’t fixed the front door , surgeries just switching off the online booking system for most of the day has locked it shut and made things worse than before.

Shouldn’t Wes Streeting be either holding GP practices to account, helping them to deliver what he says they are and they actually aren’t or acknowledge that his soundbites are misleading.

That’s seems strange if it’s switched off for most of the day

At my local surgery we can submit a form between 8am and 4pm doing it via the website

I think it’s a great system- when I needed to discuss a routine issue, I filled in a form and later that day was given an appointment for the following week around 9 days later. That’s what I wanted.

Appreciate if you’re looking for urgent/on the day, it would need to urgent symptoms- at my surgery the triage is done by one of the GPs and seems to work very well

Honestly it saves the stress of the 8am scramble for appointments!

Also the triage system doesn’t ‘turn off’ once appointments are taken, it’s a continuous system and so you can submit between 8-4 daily

Absolutely this!

My cousin is a GP and I agree with all the points you’ve made

People making comments about ‘lazy GPs’ only wanting to work part of the week…I suspect the vast majority of people judging have absolutely NO IDEA of the reality involved in working as a GP

Our surgery is a relative latecomer to this system and only brought it in this week. I needed to order a new medicine on prescription and waited until the new system came in, because under the old system you had to call on the dot of 8.30am, M-F, which was horribly inconvenient for anyone commuting to work.

So on Thurs, late morning, I went onto the new system (Anima) and it worked like a charm! I had a response from a doctor within 2 hours to say that my prescription had been sent to my nominated pharmacy and yesterday I went to pick it up. So for that request and for me (highly computer and smart phone literate), it was great. However, for my DM, who is 77 and never uses the smart phone she keeps switched off and left at home, it would be hopeless. However, is anyone cannot or does not wish to use the new system, they can still use the old telephone booking system. I think that's a good balance tbh.

I think the fact that most GPs seemed to be in hiding, during covid, didn't help.

Not strange, yours differs to many on here. Ours gets “overwhelmed” so gets switched off for long periods of time. Some on here have theirs switched off not long after opening. You can’t book by phone. Those of us that are not able to race to get into the triage queue before it closes are left with zero way to book appointments as the phone system is no longer running. It’s worse than having to be in the phone queue by 8.30 as you could still get something a few days later.

Also the same day or two weeks with nothing in between is shit. I don’t mind waiting however human beings can’t be put in neat boxes. You may not need to be seen on the same day but to have nothing in between that and two weeks later after battling to get triaged is shite.

The government are dressing this as an improvement and it isn’t.

It's pretty amazing to have posters on Mumsnet complaining that people are allowed to work part time and that they're not on the breadline by doing so. GPs are very, very far from top earners these days, despite being a decade plus into training when they become full fledged.

Lots of practices do manage to start online systems that work. Tbh I think it's a real strength of the NHS model that we have what are effectively small businesses and often highly innovative professionals with the most clinical experience up front in primary care. Yes I'd like a lot more GPs, and yes to complaining to your practice that their systems aren't working.

I don’t care if GPs want to go part time although if tax payers are funding their training( I don’t know if we do) it doesn’t seem a good use of money. What I do care about is practices filling the days they’re not working with experienced GPs which isn’t happening as doctors seem to be struggling to get jobs.

So what’s going on? There seems to be plenty of doctors wanting jobs, loads struggling to get jobs and patients who want to see doctors but can’t. Apparently we have loads of spare cash for surgery refurbs soooo what is the issue?

But we all know that complaining re the NHS is pointless and surgeries seem quite arrogant. I will be following though with a complaint beyond PALs as I’ve watched a lovely surgery I’ve been at for many years turn into an unpleasant non patient friendly service.So many stories in the community of upset disgruntled patients. If you don’t complain the sound bites just go unchallenged. It’s annoying that you have to.

I don’t thing the autonomy model is working. Wouldn’t it be better if they were all under one dep who told them what they had to provide and made it happen. There is so much difference re service,they’re not being held to account and Wes Streeting can make ridiculous brags that just aren’t true.

Sometimes I contemplate retiring back to the UK, then I read something like this and think noooo. How do older people manage this? How does anyone?

I’m in France. I can usually get a GP rdv the next day, sometimes same day. There is a countrywide system called DoctoLib where online bookings can be made with GPs and loads of other medical services - physios, labs for tests, radiology service for X-rays, mammograms, midwives, ENTs and every other specialist. The practitioner just decides what the rdv times / days they want to offer, and the system does the rest. So if I need a mammogram, I go on Doctolib, find my usual radiology clinic, confirm what kind of rdv i want, and choose the slot that suits me. Same for physios, ophthalmologist, gynaecologist, etc etc.

Honestly it’s not often I’m impressed with anything innovative in France, but Doctolib is amazing. It’s not even a government service - it was created by a tech entrepreneur who set it up, then invited medical practitioners to join (they pay for the service), and it has grown rapidly to cover the whole country and loads of different providers.

Systmconnect is utter toilet. And yes, its private enterprise screwing the NHS, I think that company was started by an ex NHS Dr.

Its illiterate too, Systm, not System

We have the system where you fill in a form and they get back to you. I really like it. I've had to use it a few times and they've always responded either by phone or making me an appointment the same day.
I think it really helps to triage people who need urgent appointments. Before we had to phone or try to get an online appointment but it was just first-come gets in and that means that more urgent cases weren't getting seen promptly.

The French GP service is amazing. One of my kids had an accident. Within an hour he’d been seen by the GP, had stitches put in by the same GP, been given a bag of dressings and allowed to choose sweets from a glass Elmer box on his designer desk. Rural GP in the back of nowhere.

Not suggesting we need anything like that but a service better than what we’re getting or at least what the government says we’re getting would be nice.

You’ll be fine if you’re over a certain age with a major condition I think as I’m sure I read the elderly with chronic conditions are going to be made a priority. The rest of us can apparently just put up with shite and most definitely if you’re female in my practice.

That’s great if they don’t shut the system down after a short period of time so most of the day you can’t fill in a form- or ring!

Yup the title bugs me too!!!🤣

Our doctors changed to this last week

Used 3 times this week which is very unusual for me

for an asap app for my dd8 as poorly

For a blood test for me

and a follow up face to face doc app for me

Depending on what the need is , depends what options you have. So asap got back to me in 30m with a face to face app that am

Blood test was sent a link 5mins later to click and book a date and time that suited me

Follow up , same got sent a link 5mins later to book a face to face in a weeks time with days /times for me to choose

So yes I’ve had a very positive result this week needing it 3 times

I get for the elderly they may struggle , esp if no smart phone /laptop etx but the doctor staff are meant help them

so yes seems easier then ringing at 8am and hoping for a doc app that day

If the system is overwhelmed by midday, that means all the appointments they’re allowed to allocate are gone. What would be different if they went back to phone calls (or if they left the triage form open longer?). You’re either still going to get a no on the phone or you’ll still struggle to get an appointment because a huge backlog of calls/online requests from previous days.

The issue is the inability to meet increased patient demand, not the system they’re using to try and book appointments.

Give it time. Ours opened far better than it is now. Now unless you get on early to fill out a form you won’t be able to at all when it shuts down for long parts of the day so you wouldn’t have access to any of those things. It’s clearly no different to how it was before. Also if you’re non urgent which most will be there are limited appointments in the 2 week wait and if there are none available - you have to fill in another form all over again- if you can!

Apparently the system is closed because they are catching up with triaging. If it’s because there are no appointments either for emergency same day or 2 weeks in advance every day after the short amount of time open to fill out a form it’s very concerning and something needs to be done. It also needs to be owned by Wes Streeting instead of him saying he has fixed “the front door of the NHS”.

YANBU OP