Is our town a shithole..

[FroggletTowers]

Or is this happening anywhere else?

I have been discussing this with friends, family and colleagues recently so won't name our town for privacy reasons, but it is a regular, large town in England, UK.
Nothing particularly special or awful about it, previously.

Since the pandemic, the entire vibe has changed. Almost unrecognisable.
Yes, we have some heavy shop closures like many towns, but the council kept it looking decent as much as it could. Some nice buildings and nature areas, etc.

What stands out most, apart from the general vandalism and dog shit is the weird accumulation of male groups hanging around boozing in public.

So far they have taken over the local park, river walks and nature reserves. They often cluster beneath bridges or across paths where people like to run, cycle walk dogs or take children, making it less safe and filling these areas with waste. Off road bikes have ruined the nature reserves, so less people visit

Sadly the authorities don't seem to be doing much about it, it is as if these people don't have to abide by laws that the rest of us have to. Some buildings adjacent to these areas have windows put through on a regular basis, even in what you'd call 'nice' areas.
Many of them cluster at river bridges and block the path for others, most are very drunk or out of generally.
It isn't unusual to see a large man passed out across the pathway, blocking anyone getting past. If you had a pram or bike it would be really uncomfortable to have to rouse a large drunk at 2pm in the afternoon. Most are local men, with a growing amount of middle eastern men. The vast majority of them are unstable.

We see less women out cycling, walking or exercising now, and this encompasses both MC and WC areas. These people seem to have just multiplied and spread across the entire borough and have taken over all public space.
We live in a decent area that is now seeming to go downhill.
It isn't unusual to see day drinkers sat alone, surrounded by cans on a quiet residential street. And they won't move to let you past.

It's really depressing.

My town has actually got better over the years, some really quite nice improvements.

@lifeonmars100 clearly Nottingham - so sad -

The agency here that works with and houses homeless people many of whom have multiple complex needs had around 44% of its projects, hostels and supported accomodation in my area, It is a poor and deprived area and it makes it worse to have so many people with high levels of need in such a small area. Drug dealers work like any business, they go to where the custom is so we have open drug dealing out on the streets, men who are pissed up outside the many off licenses and beggars by the cash point, I really believe in helping homeless people but I think that all areas should take a share but of course a "better" area ofen organises opposition to a hostel being built. There is a supported house on my street and the dealing there used to be wild, people coming and going at all hours, fighting in the street, threats to kill, you get the picture! All of us who live close by had to keep a diary of the many events and the tenants did get kicked out in the end but I think many MNs would have had an attack of the vapours coping with such events

Well aware of why there is always an excuse especially at this time of the year to riot. Our town is full of tension right now, and it won't take much to ignite.

The reason you're seeing more marginalised people on the streets - and that's what you're seeing - is the accumulated effect of years and years of cuts to addiction services and the near collapse of community mental health services.

I live in a very poor area. The council places many of its most vulnerable residents in HMO's near me - there are two HMO's in my road, and a number of hostels nearby. Many of the people you see on the streets are estranged from family members, because of mental illness and substance abuse. They're often destitute, spending all their benefits money on alcohol and weed to get them through the day.

The reason why people gather in groups is because they're human, and one of the few things that gives comfort and pleasure to these folks living on the margins, is human contact with other people.

I'm sorry you're offended by the sight of them. Just try to remember, these are someone's brother, son, nephew. Imagine someone you love leading that sort of life.

Goodness me, popped out for dinner and came back to more pages than I can find the energy to catch up on this eve.

We have had a good chat with regards to moving, or at least bringing the date closer, tonight.

I will try to catch up tomorrow, as need to do a few things before bed. Thanks for sharing your personal stories and thoughts on the matter.

I lived in a hamlet where that happened. Park up in field gateway, admiring the bright yellow Rape field. Chuck the MacDonald detritus and leave.
The logic of it puzzled me. Then I realised it was a finger up to those who were able to live there.

Sounds interesting and timely. It is something I often ponder on as what I see in my city is replicated to a greater and lesser extent throughout the country. Of course there are many reasons and I think that Covid accelerated the changes brough about by online shopping, people going into town less, city centres needing to reasses what their purpose is now that in-person shopping is not the thing is used to be or will ever be againl Good luck and now get back to work! 😅

This has nothing to do with poverty. I call people like this scrubbers. It’s a choice. You choose to throw your rubbish on the floor. You choose to shout and swear in public. You choose to dress like a tramp- yes it is cheaper to buy smart looking clothes than branded trainers and branded sportswear.
It is awful to see this behaviour. Close to where I live they are demolishing several flats. It’s already made the area better. No idea where the residents have gone but the number of men roaming around town drinking, shoplifting and generally not adding any positivity to the place has decreased.

Thanks for sharing this perspective.
Only please also understand that if a group of drunken men are blocking the passage under a bridge, a small woman with or without children might feel uncomfortable or afraid, especially if they are aggressive towards each other.

it is an unfortunate situation, whatever the cause.

I am not offended by people who are troubled, I just wish our public areas felt safe. I wish that I could fix things for all of us, but I can't.

I also think we live in a society that hands too much out for free.
My parents always said it’s easy to spend someone else’s money. If you have to work hard for what you have you respect it more.
Lots of people don’t take personal responsibility. There isn’t a sense of pride for some people. They have zero sense of occasion. They don’t even parent their own children. They expect someone else will do it. They expect the tax payer to provide them with a free home and furnish it.

I live in an ex industrial area of the North East and see nothing like this...infact I think where I am things are getting better in terms of cleanliness local facilities etc...slowly but when I think back to the grimey town centre of my formative years DC definitely have a better deal.

rby. Many of the people you see on the streets are estranged from family members, because of mental illness and substance abuse. They're often destitute, spending all their benefits money on alcohol and weed to get them through the day.

Im sure nowadays many of these people could be helped with medication but probably no one advocates for them.

I’ve lived in the ME, plenty get half cut 🙄

Excellent geographical point - rivers tend to flow into the sea.

But I'm guessing the OP isn't talking about, say, Sidmouth.

No doubt I’m the voice of doom (I’m ok with that) but nothing will be done however much people try to campaign, nobody is listening. If I said why I believed this is all deliberate I’d be called a fantasist or something.

I used to have hope once.

Of course it's an over simplification; this is an online discussion forum.
Minimum wage is not why companies make profits; that's ignoring those that pay well and make billions.
At no point did I suggest they were 'evil', not that private care homes are 'saintly'; far from it.
My point was in regard to failing, dismal town centres blighted by anti social behaviour.

Well, you only have to read a few threads on here to realise how many people think the solution is just to take more money off the rich and distribute it rather than encourage personal accountability and ambition. Obv some people don't have capacity or are genuinely struggling, but there are also plenty that would rather just get a handout.

The post the OP is referring to was deleted by MN admin.

I agree that nothing will be done. I think everything has irrevocably changed, for the worse.

In Sidmouth it's the gangs of old people you have to watch out for! They'll shake their walking sticks at you and lounge around in cafes drinking tea while staring menacingly at anyone under 70.

Then pop to lye …..

Ipswich has gone the same way, my older family members are too afraid to go into the town centre because it feels very rough compared to 10 years ago (I moved away in 2018 and it seemed OK then), not that there's any decent shopping left in town anymore.

Moved to shropshire and our local small town and Shrewsbury feel very different, particularly Shrewsbury, lots of independent shops alongside the brand names and just an overall much nicer vibe

My 28yo workmate is the only person in his family to have worked during his lifetime. His parents kicked him out as soon as they weren't able to claim benefits on his behalf and he was living in hostels/HMOs. He was cycling about 15 miles a day to a shit job for ages to save the money to get his driving licence and eventually had to lie and convince the authorities that he was too volatile to be housed with other people as in his words he was "repeatedly housed with scumbags that would nick his stuff when he was at work". He said his bike was repeatedly nicked which made it really hard to get to work.

He's now on £45k as a truck driver at 28yo and has cut ties with his entire family as he said they only ever want money from him. One of his main priorities seems to be instilling a good work ethic in his two kids.

@Slatterndisgrace why do you think it’s deliberate? Not goady just interested to hear your opinion. I travel alot around the uk for work mainly affluent areas but up until last few years I would of said Cheltenham was really smart now not so much