To be conflicted about sleep training

[Megank1989]

I’m in a really weird state emotionally about this. DD is nearly 8 months and she’s not been able to sleep independently for more than 30min since just before she turned 7 months. I’d been getting her down in the cot for 2-3 and even 4 hour stretches before coming to bed and bringing her in with me when she woke (which I was totally fine with).

But for the past almost 2 months it’s been a case of having her asleep on one of us downstairs before we go to bed as she just snaps awake as soon as she goes back down after her first very short stretch.

DH is now pushing for sleep training. I am absolutely against CIO so that leaves pick up put down. The issue is I’m not sure how DH will take the week plus it will be to get this working if it does at all. He’s been working crazy hours, taking calls at 10pm, and slotting in exercise for his MH which often interferes with bed time. So I’m very anxious around it all falling on me.

I’m also just genuinely wobbly about sleep training at all. I’m very happy cosleeping most of the night but this loss of an evening is undeniably trying. I’ve got 3 months left of maternity leave and can feel the clock ticking on my time with her. She’s our first and only so I’m also generally more relaxed about soaking in this time where she’s tiny and needs me as i’ll never live this again.

Ideally, I’d want her to go back to her longer stretch, then in for cuddles with me, with the time she stays in her cot just getting longer naturally. But she’s just not snapping out of this 30min block so I feel pushed into a corner a bit. Several of the antenatal mums have now done various forms of sleep training and I’ve got a real sense of guilt that I’m resisting it.

For background, I feed to sleep if she’s on/next to me but not as part of bedtime routine. She is also learning to crawl.

I have no advice but I’m in a similar position. DD is 8 months and her sleep is shite.

I’m following as I’m in exactly the same boat with my 6 month old. He’s our second and last… very different kettle of fish to our first. First was formula fed so was used to being fed and put down in her next to me. We used the Ferber Method and she was trained in 2 nights. Didn’t cry for more than 5 minutes over those two nights. This one is breast fed, and for my sanity, I co-slept… now I can’t get him out the bed - even without me for longer than 40 minutes. As soon as he knows I’m not there he screams bloody murder. I tried Ferber and he was so distressed immediately that he threw up. It felt horrendous so I’m now working on getting him back into his next to me… then I’m planning to move it away from the bed further and further. Until he is used to sleeping separately.

I feel conflicted as I desperately want a solid nights sleep but I also want to soak up him being little and needing me so much. It’s hard.

Sorry I haven’t got any sage advice but I wanted you to know that you have my Solidarity!

I couldn’t do CIO either, I did ‘vanishing chair’ when my DS was about 7 months old. I read a book called the baby sleep solution by Lucy Wolfe which really helped - it has sample schedules in so you can get the basics right and eliminate things that might be leading to short interrupted sleep. I’m not going to lie, the first two nights of not picking him up were awful, but we sat by his side for hours comforting him and supporting him and now he sleeps in his cot for 10 hours at a time. He’s an early waker and sometimes needs his dummy putting in 1-2 times a night but it does get better (except for teething, illness and sleep regressions). The Huckleberry app is also really good for sample schedules and help improving sleep. I hope you find a solution that works for you.

I don’t think CIO and pick up put down are your only options. You could choose other ways to soothe than picking up and putting down, you could stay in the room with her, put your hand on her chest, I think it’s worth researching more possible techniques.

I think it’s reasonable to try something. And insist your husband doesn’t get to slot in exercise for his mental health as you need to slot in techniques to help her sleep as part of your mental health so he needs to give up the exercise for a few weeks.

I’m a bit lost as to what it is she/you are currently doing. So she feeds to sleep most of the time other than when you first put her down to sleep at night? How does she settle then? But then you say she’s asleep on you at the beginning of the night? What happens for her naps? What does her whole sleep schedule look like?

Essentially she needs to learn to self settle, nap times and at night. She’s waking up in between sleep cycles and needs to learn to bridge them. It isn’t a choice of CIO or pick up put down, there are loads of different iterations of sleep training. You need to pick a settling method and stick with the same one day and night (not feeding, probably too late to introduce dummy, she’ll soon be too heavy to rock, so I’d go with pat and shh personally.

You need to get her daytime sleep on track as well as night time (if it isn’t already) and she needs a consistent routine working to roughly the same timings each day. I don’t know what you’re currently doing but at 8 months you’re usually looking at 2 naps of 1.5 ish hours with around 2.5-3 hour wake windows in between, or a shorter nap first then a longer one second. Is she doing this or is she having lots of 30 minute naps? If the latter, I’d work on that first. Make sure she’s being put down for all her naps and when you know she’s on the point of stirring (25 mins ish mark perhaps) go in and gently start shhing and patting her bottom to help her re settle for another cycle. It won’t always work and may take some practise but she should get the hang of it and eventually be able to extend her sleep herself.

In terms of night time settling, I would start consistently settling in her cot. Agree a rock solid bedtime routine that you do every night, exactly the same. Aim to get her to bed roughly the same time every night. Stop having her fall asleep on you, that isn’t setting you up well for a night of self settling. I would bath, feed, stories then settle in cot. We sleep trained around the same age and went in every 2 mins to give her a gentle pat and say ‘it’s time to sleep’, until she was asleep. It took about 20 mins of on/off crying the first night, about 5 mins the second and she was fine from then on bar the odd blip when we repeated the process. It only ever took one night after the first time. It wasn’t fun, but it wasn’t horrendous, and we were all much better off having done it. There are loads of different ways to work towards the same outcome, this is just what worked for us. Staying in the room with her didn’t work at all, she got really frustrated, and picking her up seemed counter intuitive to wanting her to settle as it didn’t calm her down.

It’s a good age to start tackling it I think. Work out a method you’re comfortable with and then stick with it.

Imo, as a former sleep-treainer nurse, as well as a mum, sleep-training is worth a try. As a nurse, I saw some great results in a week of consistent sleep training. As a mum, one of my children did not respond well at all, and as a young teen has a diagnosis of Adhd and autism. Hope this gives some clarity

Where does she nap? I started with the naps and it in turn helped with the overnight. You can change things gradually and really gently so no huge sleep training programme necessary. It’s crazy how quickly they can turn things around.
inwould work on an independent nap first before doing anything at bed time or overnight.

We’ve had a solid bedtime routine since she was very little. She gets a bottle and then has been rocked to sleep and put in the cot since we moved her from our room. Perhaps selfishly, I contact nap as I quick enjoy it. She’s on 2 solid naps of 1-1.5, she has napped in her cot plenty in the past though. Currently 2 hours into trying to get her down and currently sat in the hallway with ear pods in to try and have a break. This isn’t working and she’s completely hysterical.

And I know she can connect sleep cycles as she’s done massive stretches post 4 month regression. But the last month she’s just entirely lost it.

Sleep training is perfectly fine to do and works well for most children. There are multiple options, not only cry it out and pick up/put down.

Whether you want to do it or not is just personal preference. It won't do your baby any harm to be sleep trained. It won't do her any harm to not be sleep trained at this age.

Ah, I've got a non sleeping 10 month old. Her sleep also went to shit around the time she started getting separation anxiety/excited about crawling and standing. I'm also not planning to do any sleep training but definitely get the temptation, my main reason for not trying it is that she gets massively distressed and shaky within seconds of not being picked up when she calls out in the night. If she was a calmer baby I'd probably be more inclined to give it a go (although a calmer baby probably would've been more inclined to sleep in the first place!)

Whatever you decide OP will be fine, but don't feel pressured to do the sleep training alone because your DH prioritises the gym over implementing his own initiative- he needs to be just as involved as you in this process. Good luck

To be honest the idea that they "outgrow" it on their own or just gradually stay longer and longer in a cot - well maybe if you are willing to wait until they are about 6.

I think gradual methods work well, vanishing chair etc.

So the contact naps need to stop. You can’t do that and then expect her to self settle overnight. There are lots of ups and downs with sleep. What they can do one month they stop doing another month. You just have to keep consistent with your routines and methods to settle and accept the ups and downs are normal.

Go in and get her now if you haven’t already. I wouldn’t just launch into attempting sleep training spontaneously or without a plan - that’s certain to fail. It is difficult and exhausting, and it’s hard to know what to do at times. But it is all normal and it will get better. I’d work on your naps, get her doing those independently, and work on your bedtimes to start with. The wakings through the night should hopefully reduce in turn or you then use the same strategies to tackle those.

Argh sorry you’re having a tough time.

I have a 7 month old and we feed to sleep / contact nap / bedshare - makes life easy as luckily for me she just wakes a few times overnight and goes back to sleep on the boob. No experience of sleep training and no plans to do it here - I just wanted to say I don’t think it’s selfish that you enjoy contact napping / snuggling with your baby, I’d say it’s pretty normal and lovely!

Can baby fall asleep in a carrier while you/DH walk around? That works well for ours. I’m wondering if she just isn’t tired enough when you’re trying to put her to bed? Sorry very basic and I’m sure you’ve thought of that!

Just some non-sleep-training solidarity, if it’s helpful (as you said you’re feeling pressure to sleep train), and I hope things settle for you!

Sleep is so important for a child’s development, not to mention the parents’ health (mental and physical). There are other methods of sleep training behind CIO and pick up, put down. You could try Ferber or something else.

OP, it sounds like you don’t want to sleep train. So, don’t.

I have two DDs. The first would only sleep on me unless in the pram/car for naps for the first 7 months of her life. She always needed to be fed to sleep which we did until nearly 2 and sometimes it took ages. But she started sleeping through, inconsistently from 11 months then nearly all the time from 15 months. My younger, self settled for naps from day 1, but now, at 16 months, won’t sleep longer than 2 hours independently. She will sleep longer if cosleeping but still wakes regularly.

She falls asleep more easily and it doesn’t matter if she self soothes or is fed or rocked to sleep. She just loves a cuddle.

All babies are different. Sleep training may work, it may not. But ultimately you need to trust your judgement and do what is right for you. It doesn’t last forever and now with my last baby I am just soaking it up because it goes by in heartbeat. My elder is nearly 4 and still takes more effort to go to bed but has happily slept in her own room since a little babe.

Are you coping? Are you getting enough sleep to function?

Do what is right for you. If that’s cosleeping, great, if it’s sleep training, great.

The baby will be getting plenty of sleep either way. That’s not the issue!

Is that normal for 7 month olds to wake " a few times," during the night still?

One of mine was an absolute bugger for getting to sleep but generally only woke once during nighttime.

Have 2 young GC. 5 month old is asleep by 10 wakes at 5 for a bottle then sleeps till about 8

3 month old one is fed twice in night

I'm so glad that none of mine were awake a " few" assuming 3 plus times a night.

Or maybe we were a bit keener on sleep training as had to be back at work sooner. Although the 5 month olds mum is now back working full time

https://sleepsense.net/ This worked really well for us. We’ve got 2 fantastic sleepers now (5&7) who average 10/11 hours of really good sleep every night. They love their own beds and sleeping. Hope it helps. It really was a ray of light when we’d hit rock bottom with sleep deprivation and all the anxieties that can bring. Good luck! X

It’s normal for children to wake regularly during the night for the first 2 years and beyond. Sleep training doesn’t teach them to sleep through, it teaches them not to call for you when they wake. All babies are different!

Hey just wanted to chip in, I've had 2, very different but didn't sleep train either - didn't feel right for me. They both slept independently in their own time (and no, didn't need to wait until they were 6...)

Your little one IS little, and I know in the thick of it can feel like it won't change but it will.

Do what's right for you, there's so much noise on the internet and I think it makes us question our own instinct and drown our inner voice.

There are other things you can do such as looking at sleep hygiene etc... littlenestsleep is great on IG. A non judgemental realistic baby / toddler sleep resource.

Soak up those cuddles, it's not selfish. It's biologically normal. My youngest loved a contact nap, and one day she just stopped. At night she would be rocked to sleep, and not long after she turned one she preferred to fall asleep on the bed. Not everyone's cup of tea, but it was ours.

Every circumstance is different, every baby a different temperament, you know your baby best. But yes, defo look up that sleep account, some useful things to think about.

Seems far more common to have kids waking every hour or 2 now it seems. Or maybe not settling themselves back to sleep

Wonder if it's due to keeping babies in your room much longer these days

I also read the Lucy Wolfe book and it's great got some great techniques in and helps you understand sleep cycles and sleep needs for different ages etc

Or is it just that we know? My daughter was in her room at 6 months old and slept longer and longer stretches from 9 months old aside from the occasional regression. She generally woke only once or twice a night and then slept through from 15 months. She always has and always will take longer to fall asleep than my younger and wants me there. My younger can already self soothe and did so from birth. She wakes for a different reason. It’s not that more babies wake it’s that we know they wake and more people are admitting to cosleeping and responsive parenting. It’s always happened there was just more stigma. It’s the biological norm and always has been.

My now 10 year old was a dream baby til she turned 2 years so it never occurred to me to me to sleep train her. But from 2 years she was a nightmare. Now at 10 years she is still hard work but way too old for CIO.

My now 7 year old was sleep trained at about 10 months due to his older sisters shenanigans and after 2 nights of crying for 40 mins max he’s still a dream at bed time.

i feel like ive failed my daughter and done her a massive disservice by not being on top of it when she was a toddler. anecdotal for sure but wanted to share my experience.