AIBU to apply for hybrid roles even though I'm nowhere near the workplace?

[Isitameproblem]

Hello ladies!

Some of you might or might not remember that I was made redundant after 8 months. In the end it was mutual but that's by the by.

I live in deep west country and have always had remote jobs for the past 14 years this November. Unfortunately, it seems like most of the jobs in my field these days ( client relationship management) are hybrid. I have never really applied for hybrid roles apart from 2 times and both told me I simply lived too far away and I needed to relocate. (Bristol and Plymouth so not the other side of the country!)

I'm happy to pay my own travel/lodging expenses, but had anybody been successful to get an offer with my current situation? (Living too far away to commute but committing to travel)
TIA

Interesting, so maybe best to put London, UK? I mean the office for one was in Liverpool, and the current one is either Guildford or Gloucester.... Which I don't think is very helpful

She's looking to travel to Bristol or Plymouth, not London. You can't compare London's travel infrastructure to that of Bristol and Plymouth.

No, I'm actually looking to travel into London. 90% of my roles in my sector are there.

This!

There are many biases in recruiting. Does the person write well? Do you think they'll fit in with the team? Do you feel they'll show up on time and be available where you need them and when?

None of these are protected characteristics. They're all perfectly legitimate things for an employer to investigate when selecting.

I disagree, unless it can be shown it is a proxy for stopping people from applying based on other reasons.

Employers have a duty of care, and if someone is travelling long distances, it will affect their health and chance of a road crash brought on by tiredness. Never mind inability because of bad weather to get to their employer's premises.

I do however think that far too many employers insist on a certain number of days for the wrong reasons. Not dealing with poor performers, for example.

What does your own current location say on there though? Or do you not say? I agree that being upfront about location and addressing it from the start may be helpful if it's turning out to be a problem down the line.

I think it depends on the industry. In my industry and hour commute is standard 1.5+h not uncommon even before COVID and we were in person 5 days a week. There's a small pool of people qualified for the jobs and a small number of companies hiring the roles so it's always to be expected that you might end up with a long commute or paying for overnight accommodation in the short or long term.
When I first got my job I was 2-2.5h drive in non rush hour traffic away for the first year. I had family in the area so I stayed with them during the week. I would have got a room in a house share otherwise. My work only cared about me being on site 40h a week covering the core hours of 10-4 each day. It was my business how I managed my life. I had done this previously in another role but that was just a 3 month position

My CV doesn't actually say! (Just realised) But I have a UK mobile number, and all of my roles are UK based.

Also, most applications ask if I have right to work (which I do, I'm a citizen!)

But your home city/town? Most people have that on their profiles.

What, on LinkedIn? It just says United Kingdom my CV doesn't mention my location at all

When we have a very large surplus of good candidates I would not take forward ones who don’t live a sensible commutable distance. If for technical specialist or senior roles with few good candidates in the market I would be more flexible. But even then I would be wary of how well it would work out for a variety of reasons.

That said a good friend has recently taken a hybrid job where he stays away 2 night per week by his employer’s office. Importantly though this seems to be quite a standard arrangement for many people for this company as where the people with the specialist skills they need can be recruited from are rarely close to where this organisation is based. If it is the norm it will be much easier.

We’re mandated to do two days in the office(central London). Had a candidate who lived in a village not particularly close to Portsmouth. At the shortlisting stage we emphasised the in-office requirement.

No problem at all, said the candidate, he’s very keen to come to London twice a week.

Day before the interview (panel obviously a nightmare to set up in terms of dates/availability) candidate says actually could his interview be virtual.

Two hours after interview, candidate say’s actually they’ve he’s just secured a job in Portsmouth.

At the top, in the banner bit, it often says the city where you're based. I think it's pretty usual.

I've got:
Name
Current role and organisation
University
Home city

I didn't do that deliberately - I think it's the default as my entire profile is the default option.

Employers have a duty of care, and if someone is travelling long distances, it will affect their health and chance of a road crash brought on by tiredness.

That is categorically not the reason why employers find themselves concerned over long-distance travel or insist on making it their business where potential employees live – as is evidence on this thread, it's the assumption that they will have poor attendance, lacking work ethic and a tendency to 'grumble' about commuting.

Never mind inability because of bad weather to get to their employer's premises.

Bad weather – such as high winds ice or snow – prohibits most people from travelling, regardless of location.

Nope, it just says United Kingdom

My DH has recently started a hybrid role in London. We’re 3-4 hours away. He does 3 days per fortnight. The higher London salary covers travel and hotel. His job is very niche though. Luckily kids are teens now. He wouldn’t have done it when they were small. Going well so far. He enjoys the change of scene being in central London. Drinks after work etc.

“Luckily that’s not allowed”

Untrue and depends on the employer and role.

Highly niche examples aren'y relevant.

Exactly. I'm not niche, I can be "niche" which is rare but does happen. When that happens I'm always shortlisted as there's maybe 20 of us at most that can do it at that level and fluent in that language.

However, as those roles only appear like 4/6 times a year, I become part of the "masses" and there's plenty of us, with many more wanting to pivot to this type of role

Reading this thread with interest, both as an employee and hiring manager.

As an employee I took on my current role a couple of years ago knowing it would mean a significant commute by train (roughly two hours each way). It wouldn’t be my first choice but there are many advantages to my role which outweigh the, at times tiring, commute. I’m mid-40s and have never commuted more than about 45 minutes before so it was an adjustment. Part of the reason I accepted the role is that my company are very, very understanding and flexible. We are expected to be in two days a week but depending on the needs of the business you could be in three days one week and a single day the next. My company understands that life sometimes happens and are willing to adapt things as long as the service we are paid to offer is provided to an agreed standard. I choose to take an earlier train and arrive at the office roughly 30 minutes before my official start time. It helps that, depending on my schedule, I can leave slightly earlier and work from the train on certain tasks meaning a better balance.

As a hiring manager this does sometimes influence my thinking but more in the informal chats I’ll have with prospective candidates. We get applications for roles from around the country as we are seen as a prestigious place to work. We are based in London and have colleagues who commute from Yorkshire and Wales and stay over so it’s doable with proper planning. During Covid the company made the decision to focus on recruiting the right talent above any other factor as hybrid became the norm.

When I get approached about roles from people who would have a long commute I’m always upfront with them because even four hours a day can be a bit of a slog. I’m clear about the in-office expectation and that although unlikely it could increase. It’s up to them if they apply but they know what they’re signing up for. As a commuter who makes the effort to get to the office on time I expect the same from others, especially as the workplace is so flexible about things. Any hint of taking the piss would and has been swiftly clamped down on but I don’t overly focus on this when hiring as it’s about the right person for the role.

In my large organisation we’ve had several people who lived very far away and it rarely worked out. We need someone in every day for operational reasons.
Whining about extra training days in the office, can’t come in due to various motorway issues or snow or storms or strikes or something else. Can’t be called on last minute when we need someone in.
Always late. Increased sickness because they can’t manage the commute on top of a working day.

Of course it’s not unreasonable to apply. Go for it!

I advise you to have a practical plan you can describe in the interview, as part of your pitch.

Eg you will stay overnight (or two nights as you need a night train) - so describe how you’ll work from home Monday, catch the train on Monday evening and then what your accommodation will be in the city (hotel, friend, Airbnb etc) and then that you’ll do two full days in the office, taking the teain home at X time on Wednesday night, then working from home Thursday and Friday.

Even mention how much this will cost you if per week and that you’ve factored that into the salary level and take home pay, and you still think the job is financially and professionally worthwhile for you despite these costs.

Note that you’ll be consistently available to work late or do work social activities on the Tuesday night (eg dinner with clients) and also do an early office start Wednesday morning (eg for in person client breakfast meetings) - whatever is applicable to your job.

Finally emphasise your flexibility- eg if you’re occasionally required to come to the office on other days, or for an offsite etc.

If you make a strong pitch that shows a well thought out and costed plan, and do a strong interview, then you certainly had a good chance.

Employee issue, not a location issue.

Yet one avoided by hiring those people who don't live very far away. Funny that.

Look the perfect employee will be perfect from down the road or across the country. A motivated, hard working person will make all sorts of things work. My dad had a 4 hour commute for two years as he was unemployed for a while (massive layoffs so a saturated market) and they didn't want us to change our high schools. It was terrible but he did it and he was never late. He just didn't sleep a lot. So of course people can do lots of hard things.

BUT... it's also totally true that post-covid assumptions about office attendance are very, very different for any sort of office-based job and if you go in with a set of expectations, there is going to be movement from there. And every manager I know has a handful of people who just don't want to go in so will have 1000 reasons why (plumbers, deliveries, childcare failures, pets, broken car, broken bus, etc etc etc etc). So if you have that sort of person 'plus' a long commute you will end up with someone with many extra reasons to have an excuse than others and it's a headache.

Where I work it's almost impossible to fire anyone so whoever you hire is there for potentially a very long time. So it's important to consider the entire picture when you make your choice - and answers to 'how will you make this work from a distance' and 'how flexible can you be for last minute demands' and 'we anticipate everyone is in for 3-5 days a week but it will shift around priorities' can absolutely be considered when deciding who to hire.