Surprised with the quality of some council houses

[LydieL]

Hi all, so I recently moved to a town in the north west, very low income area, the town is as you’d expect a sea of terrace houses that open to the street with concrete yards, some of the nicer parts have gardens but for the most part that’s not the case. There are also some newer estates.

Anyway I work for a charity, we support families where a parent or sibling has passed away. As part of my job I’ve seen a lot of council houses, in this area it’s mostly the terraces which are small or post war builds which are bigger but these tend to be “rougher” areas to live.

Lately I’ve been working with a family, mums been offered a council house and today I went with her to just go over a list of what she needs to do to get out of temporary accommodation asap and into it. I’ll be honest I’m a little stunned at the quality, it’s a 3 bed terrace, small front garden, mid size back garden (more than most around here), large kitchen, bay window. Council have fitted a new kitchen and bathroom and re-plastered the whole house.

It’s also in a “nicer” area. For the amount this place would sell for, you could probably buy 2 cheaper 3 bed terraces and considering the shortage of council housing stock I’m surprised that hasn’t happened! She will be paying about a little Over half what it would go for on the rental market.

Now I know this is the exception rather than the norm but AIBU to be surprised councils are holding onto higher value properties like this rather than selling them and either getting 2 houses (so 2 families can be housed) or putting the profit into the local area?

I am aware this is far from the norm but after talking to colleagues the council seems to have several properties in this little area, this mum has also got very lucky with her housing situation as she’s only been in temporary accommodation for a couple of months.

Omg, what if she sees this and figures out its about her based on the things youve said and area etc 😱
You shouldn't be in the job you have, you're meant to be for those you're supporting and it sounds like she isnt particularly lucky as you say either given that shes accessing your services because shes lost her partner or her child.
Get a job helping to pull the purse strings in the council because you don't have the right attitude to work in a charitable/supportive role.

I'm amazed that you've managed to live this long, not realised that a lot of council housing is of incredibly good quality, poorer these days but I'd say that's true of house building in general, and when you see something nice you think that it should be sold for two worse quality homes as some sort of solution to the housing crisis, which, surprise, it wouldn't be?!

From the age of about 9, my family moved into council rental after private rental. This was back in the seventies and both qualities were reasonable with council being better and completely secure. It was understood that we shouldn't accept subpar quality just because our housing was social. There was nothing to be ashamed of about living in social housing. The notion that people should suffer a little bit because they dared to live in social housing would have been ridiculous but we were definitely approaching your sort of opinion which became more of a thing when council housing was being sold off. It wasn't in the seventies. It was seen as what it was supposed to be. A home. The majority of us living in social housing back then were working families. Either one or both parents working.

Things have changed a lot in the last fifty years but the increasing idea that because you're not doing as well as others means you should be grateful for every last penny you get and that you don't really deserve any benefits, anything nice, and should live in houses that are not quite as nice, don't actually fit your family needs or whatever foolish notions you have about solving a problem that is far bigger than "you could sell that one and build two." is pretty depressing, definitely unreasonable, but unfortunately pretty normal because so many people are arseholes.

yes I realise all that. Biologically women are the ones who are pregnant and society holds the expectation that they will be the ones to give up paid work to care for the children ( in the main) and fit their work around the children's care needs so women often the ones who work part time and if their NI wasn't paid for by the government during those years there would be even more women in poverty in older age than there are now. I think you are splitting hairs. I'm the main, state pension is a contributory benefit and is only paid out if there are enough contributions on your record. Yes ten years is the minimum amount of years in order to claim but you wouldn't get much in state pension for that, unfortunately. And at the other end you have many people paying way more years in NI than the 35 required but they get no more in state pension than those who have paid the 35 years. The point is, state pension is a contributory benefit and if you haven't contributed one way or another then you have to claim non contributory benefits in order to subsist. That's all. 👍

Threads like this really irritate me. The OP is making a point about how an expensive house could be sold to buy 2 cheaper houses and therefore house 2 families instead of 1, thus reducing the waiting list. People are willfully ignoring this point just to jump on the OP and attribute words and opinions that haven't been said.

"You think council tenants are scum!" "You think people should live in shitholes!" "Your attitude is awful and you shouldn't have your job!"

Stop rushing to be offended and focus on the point being made. Is it objectively better to house 2 families than 1? Yes. Should councils review their stock and try to maximise what they have? Yes, probably. It doesn't mean you hate council tenants to question this.

No, OP is making the point that she does not think people in council houses should be in "nice" house or areas. Have you read the rest of her post? She doesn't think a returning ex-pat should be able to be housed... after a bereavement and coming back to her home country because she hasn't "contributed anything".

Following OP's logic, why not let the council sell off the shitty houses too. Tents are fine, yes? Can house more people then.

You’re completely ignoring that the eligibility is based on qualifying years which can be obtained in three ways of which contributions from pay is just one. This is like trying to play chess with a pigeon.

Really? Funny I have found it very different but then I suppose a family of four from abroad are more needy than my friends who work and children.

The family in the OP are not the "boat people" FFS... she is a Brit ex-pat who is coming back with her kids after her DP died.
She can be housed as she has connections here. She is not working as she literally just came here. I hope the security of a house will help her move on.
Be happy for her. Jealousy is the thief of joy.

I secretly laugh at people who are annoyed that poor people aren’t being forced to live in sheds.

Were not in a Catherine Cookson novel, what did you expect it to be like?

If the council has £900,000 to spend on council houses, and there's over 100 families on the waiting list....... wwyd?.🤷🏼‍♀️

Council houses around us deprived ex mining area (what's left of them) are lovely. Semi detached, driveways (added after) large rooms, nice gardens.

I don't know why anyone would assume that they would be shit holes.

Your comments about this woman's circumstances are awful.
You would be entitled to the same support if it happened to you.
She will now probably spend a lifetime contributing once she is back on her feet.

In fact your post detailing this woman's personal circumstances is unprofessional.

Exactly. If your poor apparently you don't deserve nice things and what we're thinking not making her wait years for a home. Tsk Tsk.

I think you should keep in mind that anyone can fall on hard times - even you. We are all only one accident/illness away from living very different lives.
You might not think it, but one day you could be that woman and if for no other reason than that, you should be glad that decent council housing exists!

Dear god, did I say otherwise? I was sympathising that’s others get prioritised before ones like your friend that need it. Learn to read before ffs-ing

I’m actually really pleased that the lady has a nice council house.

we rent a HA house and know how lucky we are, both work, I’m a nurse and our house is awful, no money to upgrade the kitchen or bathroom that is falling to bits, rough casting missing massive chunks, won’t replace fences that blew down in the storm. Thankfully DH can sort the fence. It’s a bit of a kick in the teeth when they are building lovely new homes which is great for stock numbers but allowing their older properties to
rot, it’s at this point that I argue with myself that they should sell the older properties if they don’t want to or can’t keep them in good condition

How it should be, years ago when most people lived in council housing they had to be at a good standard.
I'm pleased for the lady not having to be stuck in a small tatty house in a shit area.

Why have you posted this? What responses are you expecting?

So we can all complain about the feckless poor and call for the return of workhouses and the concept of less eligibility, of course.

You work for a charity? That’s a pretty bad fit, isn’t it? Never mind, you can make sure she only gets furniture suited to her station.

This is a really icky take.
At the end of the day, a British citizen found herself in a horrible situation, needed help and received said help from her home country when she needed it. Which is exactly the purpose of our welfare system. It's a safety net to fall back on.

Rather than judge her for the fact that for once our welfare system has actually worked in the way it's intended to, maybe you should be judging our governments (past and present), for not providing ALL of us with adequate support to live comfortably. It's not your clients fault that wages are too low, or that cost of living is too high. It's not her fault that mortgage limits don't reflect current wages or house prices, it's not her fault private rent prices are out of control. It's not her fault that the current financial limits for claiming benefits don't reflect the impact of the cost of living crisis. You're placing your frustration on the wrong group of people.

People like your client don't make the rules. She's just letting the rules work for her so she can have some security for her family.

Be honest with yourself... If you were in her situation you would take the help you're judging her for accepting. You wouldn't refuse it on the basis that someone who has lived here for years needs it. You would prioritise your children's safety and make sure they had a safe home.

Yes, the posts discussing the trade offs are the helpful ones. They are far outnumbered by posts insulting the OP and telling her she must hate poor people, or that she is unfit for her job.

It’s an unhelpful way to think about policy. Like the people who dismiss any socialist proposal as being driven by spite or envy. Not helpful, imo.

Why should council tenants not live in nice houses in nice areas?
Also, council houses afaik can only be sold to sitting tenants and at a helfty discount (so not market value) and the money raised cannot (or at least could not when the policy was incepted by Thatcher) be used to buy or build more social housing - so the council cannot do what you suggest even if they wanted.

Houses built in the 60s and 70s are larger than later ones, as they had to be build to the Parker Morris standards which gave minimum sizes for rooms so. e.g. the third bedroom had to hold a single bed and a wardrobe and chest. Thatcher repealed Parker Morris and later housings is much smaller (and less well-built) and third bedrooms are often 'cot rooms' or 'box rooms', so not much use for a family with 2/3 DC.

Late Victorian terraces were also build to minimum standards set out by law in the 1870s (Prince Albert was an advocate for decent, hygeinic housing for the poor, too) and also had minimum room sizes etc which is why a large terrace is frequently a better buy than a modern semi - or even a semi built in the 20s/30s.

OP, the bottom line is, that you are a tad jealous of this persons property and how they acquired it, yes?

Why do you think all social housing should be crap? I’ve lived in social housing since the 70’s and never lived in crap housing. 🤷‍♀️