Zero notice of annual leave at work

[Perimenoanti]

It happens frequently that I am supposed to cover for a couple of co-workers during their annual leave but I would have no notice of it. I would find out on their first day of leave for example that I am supposed to step in. It has also happened that I was waiting for a piece of work, then chase it in the afternoon and I get 'sorry I am off today, will send over later today'. No out of office notification and it would be for work that's due on that day and could not wait.

A few times I raised it with my boss and she acts like I am the problem. Tbh she is one of the culprits too. She'd be on a business trip Mo-Fri, but will tell me Thursday night or Friday morning to cover for her on the Friday as she will be mid-air. She would have known at the start of the week or even weeks before and could have given me heads up. This is important as I am busy myself, some work can wait and other work cannot and I would plan work differently had I known.

I also feel totally disrespected when they do that and it stresses me out as it's like a bomb is dropping and something urgent is popping up that doesn't need to be urgent.

Do they have Outlook calendars that they keep up-to-date? That's a good way of keeping tabs on colleagues who don't tell you when they will be off (though obviously they should).

It’s hard to say. I work at a place with a very free-rolling structure. No one really covers for me if I am out, unless it is an emergency. I try to inform anyone who is likely to care I will be out, but since our teams form and reform, I can’t really predict that someone I haven’t spoken to in 3 years will decide that a particular day they must talk to me because they have a deadline that day. That is their problem, not mine.

What do you do differently when you go on leave? If you communicate what needs to be done and what will and won’t be available well in advance? If yes, make the suggestion to your boss that everyone does the same outlining how it is helpful and the disadvantages of not doing it.

To be honest though, some people don’t do this stuff because they are quite happy to cope under pressure in the reverse situation.

I don't know. Would I be expected to check every week or even every day if someone will be out tomorrow? I don't really want to do that. Fuck knows when they input their annual leave.

If I will be out and require cover I let the person covering for me know.

My boss pulls she same shit. How am I supposed to know she will be mid air when X needs doing. X would take half a day. It's not like I am sitting around have nothing to do half a day so I can jump in for her. It causes a massive issue for me which she won't acknowledge. She acts like it isn't a big deal, but if it isn't a big deal why does she need cover to begin with?

It only really works for disorganised people who don't want to think of anyone but themselves.

Op, do you like working as part of a team?

It is quite normal to keep an eye on your close colleagues calendars, it is only a quick job.

Just like it's a quick job to speak to your coworker to to say you'll be out week X and then do a handover. I don't get a handover either but have to scrape stuff together and do a lot of guesswork. I let people know and also send a few handover notes. Now who doesn't like working as part of team?

I think some businesses work like this tbh. If your boss doesn't get much notice about needing to travel (normal in my work), then you won't get much notice about cover either. Sounds like you need to work out whether you can cope with this work environment or not, as you're unlikely to change everyone else's behaviour

Oh she has plenty of notice. She would know today that she will be at X event in 6 months time. She just cba to think of anything beyond the next 5 minutes. I think I am just venting as I know I am not unreasonable. I might just say in the future 'sorry, didn't know cover is needed and have already allocated all my time' and let things fall through the cracks. I know then I will be the problem too.

Plenty of other colleagues actually say in team meetings 'just to remind I will be out on xyz'. Unfortunately I don't work closely with those and we aren't stepping in for one another.

Well, you're the one complaining no one tells you. Here is an opportunity to find out without being told.

If you can't be bothered to check then you're not going to take advantage of this (possible) opportunity to make your life easier. Personally I like keep tabs on this sort of thing because I can plan.

On our team, when we put leave on our calendars we do it as a meeting & invite whoever needs to know - usually line manager & whoever will be covering. It works well & takes minimal effort.

Checking peoples' calendar every night to see if they'll be out tomorrow is just adding another job for me. Tbh I feel overwhelmed just thinking about ticking yet another box and having to remember that. It doesn't feel like it's easier for me. I wish it would.

I think it's all just part of a bigger issue that I don't feel I matter. I just am a machine to them. If coworker fucks up I fix it and work overtime, while he disappears during the day, finishes early etc. I feel I compensate a lot and get zero support when I need help to make my life a bit easier sometimes, such as letting me know you'll be off. So I have to add another job for myself and check their calendars. I know it shouldn't feel overwhelming but it does.

Yeah exactly this. Suggesting it's up to.the OP to frequently browse other people's calendars is mad. It's up to the person taking leave to let others know and add it to their calendars.

"I can't accomodate being your cover as you've not given me enough notice. You've not let me know what you want me to do, for how long, what exceptions etc. You'll have to manage this yourself or make your excuses. Next time if you need me to cover anything, you will need to organise an hour with me the week before so i know what's required and I can ask any questions before I agree to be your cover. If you don't, then i will not cover anything for you."

repeat infinity. Don't cover anything for anyone.

But if your boss has made it clear that you need to do X, which will take half a day, then surely that it is what you need to do? If that means something else gets dropped then so be it. Similarly, who is telling you you need to cover for the colleagues who are on leave - is it the boss? If so, then, fine, that's your new priority and that means you can't do whatever else you planned for that time. If the boss then criticises what you haven't done I think that is then when you point out that she asked you to do this, so you did.

I do think they should be more courteous, but I also think that it sounds like you're being very rigid. In some roles you just can't decide weeks ahead exactly what you will be doing on a given day because you have to adapt to priorities as they come. Your boss might have known that she would be away six months ago, but did she really know that she'd need X doing on that very same day?

It's also a quick thing to have a shared calender or a wall chart with dates on? Why should she have to monitor other people's calendars on the off chance they might be away!

Piss up and brewery springs to mind with your boss op. I would have to be firmer and say sorry no I can't cover...If I had warning I'd be more than happy but i.am too busy.

No, she means X on top of everything else. We work to deadlines and she asks me to do X as it needs doing that day. I get how you think I just drop something, but I would have client meetings arranged (I have a lot of them) and I won't just drop them with zero notice because it's client work. I could move some meetings to another day if I KNEW X needed doing, not all but some, but I won't cancel half a day of meetings because of her. I also have other deadlines for other things so no, I can't miss them. Because we work to deadlines she actually knows that X also needs doing on a Wednesday in six months time because it is every Wednesday.

I would accommodate all this in case of illness/emergency, but not because someone repeatedly doesn't have her act together.

I like how you call me rigid because I am sure that's what these people think when I say I won't accommodate you at zero notice over and over again. I would say they are disorganised to the extreme and it works for them because people like me exist who get a lot done because they are organised.

we have a weekly team meeting and spend a few minutes most weeks checking we have proper cover for holidays and time off. we all book our holidays into outlook and send this round to the entire team so you can see at a glance every morning who's out. when there's unexpected absence / an extra task / a problem we call a brief immediate team chat to work out how to manage it and who does what by when. we deprioritise some pieces of work if necessary too, and let seniors know what we've decided, they usually get onboard straight away but we take their views into consideration. sounds like you need to adopt some of this type of policy where you work. my team are generally happy and we help each other out. if it's impossible because of rubbish management, you have my sympathy and perhaps you need to think about moving jobs.

So what does she say when you say, 'I can't, I have client meetings all day'? What actually happened on that day - what did you do?

I agree that it sounds completely unreasonable. If there are multiple people doing this, including the boss, then I think it sounds ingrained in the culture and I would be looking for a new job.

Sounds a nightmare. My boss similar. Is it a worth an email on a Friday ‘are you here next week’?

Sounds like you do a lot to cover, can you cut that back? What happens if you cancel a client meeting?

That would drive me bonkers. Can you raise it in a team meeting? And propose the solution?

@MoreDangerousThanAWomanScorned A range of scenarios have happened. At first I mentioned that I have had no notice and I don't know how to do it all as my day is already full. Then she tried to 'talk to me' about how to organise it like I needed help to see that it's all possible and nothing to worry about and I really did not like that as I was already overworked and tried to set some boundaries. I am senior, I organise my own schedule and in the end she squeezed it in herself.

You'd think this would have been the end of it, but no, these things kept happening. An 'about to board the plane, are you ok to handle X?' here or 'sorry, poor wifi, can you handle X' there. Or I chase X and get a 'I'm off today, are you ok to handle X? If not I will'. I pull her up on her offers as much as possible but I also feel awful as she can't see my side and how these things mess me about. I skipped breaks, just worked faster than I already do and stayed late. What if my wifi broke down etc. It's just a shit excuse. She could wait 30 mins or move to a different location. I'm sure it wouldn't be accepted if I shipped off my work to someone 'because of wifi'. In the end I just felt she thought I am at her disposal at any minute.

We have a rota. It is everyone's responsibility to check it. We have to cover our service between particular hours, but we do not all work the same hours, so if Sam and Alex are both out, we need to agree who else is coming in early to cover that end, and likewise, someone else might need to stay late if Chris is out.

It should be in the rota, but it is nice to remind people you're not hoping to be in, rather than just assume someone is covering. If it's short notice, e.g. a funeral, that shoukd definitely be notified separately- I might know Alex is on holiday the last week of May, and have adjusted my timings accordingly, but if he's out on Wednesday, that might need more shuffling, if someone has a doctor's appointment because it's usually a day they start late, for example.

If there are particular tasks that need picking up on, I would communicate that separately, to give whoever will be picking it up a chance to ask questions while I'm still there. Some people update their email signature to warn about upcoming leave, as well as setting an out of office message - but if you are covering for someone, you should be aware of it before you get an OOO.

I am responsible for a business area. I can cancel (rather postpone) a client meeting sometimes, but ultimately I'd be doing my job less well if I did it a lot. I don't like messing people about and prefer to only do it in case of illness, technical issues or on the rare occasion I forgot I had a meeting. I don't want to make it a habit because if I do it twice my boss thinks I can do it all the time. She's a mess and doesn't remember what happend 5 minutes ago. People like that need firm boundaries. I cannot give them an inch because they will take it al.