To abandon the extension?

[Extendorsave]

Just after some opinions really as DH and I can't decide what to do and are after some Mumsnet wisdom.
We bought a 1930s semi 2 years ago with the intention of doing an extension. It's a 5 bed semi (2 rooms in the loft) but it needed loads of work. It currently has a small old kitchen and separate dining room, it feels small downstairs. Our plan was to knock through, get a new kitchen and build a utility on the side. We've been quoted about 50-60k for this. We borrowed the money as part of the initial mortgage, planning to do it quicky and have it in a high interest account.
We have 3 kids aged 8, 5 and 2, and planning one more possibly.

As time goes on I feel like we would be better off keeping this money. I imagine all the lovely holidays it would cover, and possibly helping the kids through expensive phases. We are not struggling for money, we can afford a basic holiday every year, but the extra money would mean nicer holidays, maybe extra trips, the ability to not worry about money and buy things we need. Or we could even pay off some of the 380k mortgage!
We also have an additional 30k in savings if that makes a difference, which is our back up money as DH is self employed, so it will remain untouched.

My DH thinks we should do the extension and prioritise making the house nice to live in, I am having doubts as I'm not sure a side utility will make a huge amount of difference to our lives but I do see how much nicer it would be to have an open plan space for having friends over and spending more time together as a family. I don't think it would add much value we there is a ceiling to houses in our road. We might not make it all back if we sold and ideally we don't want to move for a long time.

Anyone had a similar dilemma? What did you do?

It doesnt matter whether the interests rate are the same of the mortgage: it is money you do not own. If you are not going to use for an extension, you must pay it back.

whether or not you are making the money back is a moot point because 1) it would sell quicker and potentially people will bid against each other and 2) you said you dont want to move in a long time so if you move in say 15/20 yrs time when your kids are at university, then you would have made your money back. Investing in long term and investing in your everyday life is the best yoy can do. The returns are just not financials but also practicals.

spending money you do not have on holidays os a recipe for failure and really not financially savvy

£60k does seem cheap for all that.

We’ve been quoted £50k to knock through kitchen and dining room, build a downstairs loo and pantry some other works. Add onto that the cost of the kitchen and all the fittings, and it will be £80k without an extension.

We are in a Victorian terrace and would like to do the side return but it’s just unaffordable.

So something a bit like this along the short wall (depending how easy it is to get water/drainage). Hidden in low cupboards with a nice (not too kitcheny worktop above). I have lots of photos etc on the wooden top and chose doors which are more living than kitchen. https://www.digsdigs.com/how-to-hide-washing-machine/pictures/95984/

If you don't use the conservatory much you might as well put utility space in there but make it look nice so you can still have a chair etc to sit in. I much prefer being able to fold my washing on a sofa! We ditched a cramped utility to open up the space into a proper room because it was so small it was horrible and ruined the space next to it.

You just need 60cm of depth and a run of at least 120cm if you want a washer and a dryer.

The snug doesn't necessarily need to be separate but a corner of the family space with comfy chairs. Somewhere you can be when the kids have friends round and your TV has been taken over by Fortnite or monotone you tubers.

Going abroad with 4 would be eye watering which is partly why I feel we need the extra money 😂 but I appreciate that would be silly and we need to repay the mortgage and then save if we choose to do it that way.

I go round and round with indecision on this. Does anyone think it's better to just move somewhere that has a better floor plan?? 30k loss in stamp duty, but might find a more suitable layout without all the time and money and mess. I'm always looking on Rightmove but it feels like that extra step up is just a bit too far out of reach, or there are other compromises.

This is really helpful thank you! Great ideas for hiding the washing machine, I had never considered anything like that before!

Moving wouldn't guarantee you a brand new kitchen/the perfect space. Better to do it yourself, get the benefit of it being lovely and new, and configuring everything exactly how you'd want it. Plus it's an absolute nightmare to move, and you'd have other expenses to consider like legal fees and moving costs.

you'll appreciate a seperate laundry as your kids get older

I have a drier stacked above the washer to save space, and a shelf above that with the washing powder, dishwasher tablets etc., out of reach of small hands. Seriously OP, the extension would make such a difference to your lives

You are paying interest on that money why would you spend it on holidays? Either do the renovations or party it back off the mortgage

I think I've established now that we need to pay off some of the mortgage or do the renovations, so thank you.
Just to give a bit of background. We bought the house planning to do the work but there was so much other work that also needed doing. We had to rewire, replumb, plaster, new floors/carpets etc and we still haven't completed all that. We had a baby and a toddler and it nearly broke me. The dust!!! The tears! never again.
So when it came to the kitchen and actual building work I just said no more and we agreed to leave it temporarily and keep the money in high interest accounts (we were lucky that are mortgage rate was locked in just before the interest rate hikes) but now we are back to discussing it again as we desperately need a new kitchen.

Do the house. Or use the money for an investment property. I had a similar amount and blew it on holidays... now regret and wish we'd done the house.

That's a massive mortgage for that income and still paying nursery fees, especially if you're planning more kids. You need to look at this as a longer term cash flow question and work out when you need the money for what. You'll have some key things you want to achieve so this is about having the cash needed to hit those goals when you need it.

Personally I'd look at putting in a garden room with some of the money then putting it on Airbnb using the separate entrance (if you can). Put that extra income into savings or use to overpay the mortgage dependent on rates. Knock together the rooms in the current house rather than extending to save money and add the balance to the savings pile. In a few years time you'll have a bigger living space needed from the garden room and the mortgage won't be so bad so you can put surplus towards holidays.

It sounds like you are worried about spending so much on the house because maybe you are worried that you still won't like it after?
I think if you don't want to spend on the house, you pay the money back towards the mortgage and then save the money that the payment is reduced by to spend on holidays. That way, you're only spending your own money on holidays, not money that you actually owe towards your house long term.
For me, I had a few (minor) things I didn't love about our home that made me want to move. I looked online to see what was actually out there, and I realized that it wasn't worth moving for, nothing is perfect and what we have is the best option. So then I decided that instead of disliking our home, I needed to do what I can to make it work the best it could for us, and make it a home for my children rather than just a house.
Looking at your floorplan, I'd definitely want to at least open the kitchen into the dining, but I think more living space would be amazing especially if you go for 4 children. We have 4 and that wouldn't be enough space for us in terms of living areas.

Do you mean more living space in terms of creating a utility?
I am concerned that it won't be big enough for 4 children as they grow, but I do still really want 4.
My DH currently uses one of the bedrooms as an office. It we stay long term and have a 4th, we would build a garden room and use that as an office for him/chill out area for older children at weekends, and then each child could have a bedroom.

You are totally right that I'm worried about putting more money into the wrong house. We rushed into buying when the market was crazy. The following year the market fell and my ideal house was on the market and we could have afforded it. I don't want to put 60k in and still want to move. But we couldn't sell with it as it is. Noone would pay a decent price right now in it's half done state!

@Extendorsave if you want 4 children then don’t underestimate the added value of a downstairs toilet! Worth its weight in gold as they grow up and hog the bathroom. It will also appeal to future buyers.

I completely understand your worry about feeling trapped if you've put the money into the extension and then still don't really like the house. In your position, I would be inclined to have a couple of estate agents in to value the house with and without the extension. If they are in agreement that you would easily get your money back from the work you plan to do, then go ahead and do it and enjoy it for as long as you're there. It will make your life easier on a day-to-day basis. But you won't have that feeling you can't move in the future because you have put yourself into negative equity with the extension.

I’d definitely do the extension

We also borrowed extra on the mortgage to get an extension to give us a kitchen/diner/family room and a utility. It was a hard six months but soooo worth it! We got it done as soon as we could to get our moneys worth out of it! It’s made such a difference to the house and to our lives. I would also look into getting a downstairs bathroom like others have said. But if not, knocking through the kitchen and diner and having a utility would make so much difference. Don’t just spend all that money on holidays. If you have 4 kids you will definitely want a utility and a bigger living/eating space

I am ridiculously in love with my utility room. It is so amazing for have my washing machine and tumble dryer out of the kitchen. all my coats and shoes. Lots of storage for vacuum cleaners and even Christmas decorations! And a sink for the messy stuff. Oh and the cat litter out of sight.

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Hi all, just to clarify we do have a downstairs toilet, and we also have a bathroom on the second floor, so plenty of toilets. It might not be that clear from the drawing I posted as it was a bit blurry.

Why not just do the work that you need to do in order to sell your house, and then move to a place you like better OP. It doesn't sound like you'll ever be happy where you are, so get in a couple of estate agents, ask them what you need to do to make it sell for the price you need it to go for, then just get that work done. While they are there, you can also ask them if building the extension or whatever you are debating doing will be worth it, or take you over the ceiling price for your area. This way, you will actually have all the information you need to make an educated decision.

Glad to read that we have managed to talk you out of blowing that money on holidays, etc. which would have been a really silly move to make.

@Extendorsave you only have 2 bathrooms though for 5 bedrooms!! nightmare fighting for the shower in the morning. you really need another shower room!

2 bathrooms and a toilet. Isn't that quite normal?

I’d look to get 2 quotes:
1 - to extend out very slightly across the back. On my as far as your conservatory goes so that you’re just squaring off the space. With also the kitchen wall knocked down and a stud wall going up to make a interior utility.

2 - just knocking the kitchen wall down and building up a stud wall for utility but with a lightweight roof on the conservatory.

in both scenarios I’d keep the kitchen where it is and have a table over looking the garden and a seating area along the new stud wall.

Would be lovely and if you do sell at some point, would be a big tick for buyers

Knock through between the kitchen and dining room, and extend the downstairs toilet to create a small utility with a dryer stacked on top of a washing machine. Remove the conservatory and put bi-folds there. You don’t need to extend.

Remember, one of you could get ill, lose your job or interest rates can double. I’d prioritise repaying the mortgage.