Stop 13 yr old from seeing friends?

[Fleckle]

My DD’s friends have started drinking and a lot of them vape. They are 13/14. My DD has tried vaping because she felt peer pressured. We have talked about it and she promises she hasn’t done it since.

AIBU to stop her seeing them? They are meeting today and I’m sure there will be alcohol. These are friends she’s had for a while.

We talked about her hanging around with them and the peer pressure. He position was that these have been her friends for years and just because they vape/drink, doesn’t mean she will.

AIBU to stop her hanging out with them? She’s fairly sensible but I don’t trust her not to get swayed as she’s so worried about fitting in. I also worry about being too strict and then she pulls away and stops talking to me about this kind of stuff. I’m at a loss what to do for the best.

FWIW, I totally disagree with getting involved in policing this group, reporting to the school etc. There are kids like this in every year group, and the school will be well aware of who they are. It’s hardly spiralling into a major safeguarding issue at present - especially if, as you say, their parents are more liberal and relaxed, and are probably loosely aware of what their kids are up to.

The school can’t do much, few parents - if any - will thank you for making a report, and if by some chance it’s traced back to you, your daughter will bear the brunt of the fallout, which will make her school life absolutely miserable.

I do get this, totally. And I’d be mortified if it was traced back to me.

On the other hand, these kids are so young to be getting mixed up in all of this. I’m finding it really hard to know this is going on and not try to do something about it. Telling the school means they can decide if and how they want to deal with it.

It doesn’t feel like there’s a win-win situation in any of this.

@Fleckle, trust me, this is the exact age a lot of kids start this kind of experimentation. It is very young, of course, but there’s also a big spectrum of physical and emotional maturity amongst young teens, with some still very childlike in their interests, and others itching to grow up and try out forbidden things in pursuit of coolness or popularity.

It’s what most often causes division and implodes friendship groups, and causes such a lot of hurt and turmoil for the less mature ones (using ‘mature’ loosely here in relation to all teens, obviously!), who may not be comfortable being involved but certainly don’t want to be completely excluded.

IME this is true across the board, regardless of type of school, income levels, social background, etc. And as I said, most schools will be completely aware that this is starting to go on amongst certain groups at this age.

However, if you feel you need to say something (and I’m not saying that’s a bad thing, it’s lovely you’re concerned about DD’s friends), please make sure the school protects your and your daughter’s anonymity.

Interesting to see the poll. For those that disagree with me stoping DD from seeing her friends, can I ask what you think the alternative is? I want to make sure I have a balanced view.

13 is quite young nowadays I think for this sort of thing. Of course back in our days it wasnt but we also could go to the pub and clubbing at age 16 which is pretty impossible nowadays.

I would worry that if they are drinking now, they have a lot of years left before they are 18 and able to go 'out' so that drinking in the park will get boring and they will look for more 'buzz'. Vaping should be completely banned, we do not have the long term research data to understand the true horrible long term effects but it doesnt look good.

I think for you the main thing is that these kids don't seem very nice. DD is 16 in 6th form and she drinks occasionaly eg maybe once or twice a month there will be a gathering where they drink. BUT she has a lovely group of friends, they all make sure each other get home ok etc and they have fun without drinking the rest of the time, in fact there are several in the group who don't drink at all. of course there are the occasional friendship squabbles but soon sorted so the drinking doesn't concern me but if her friends were vaping/drugs and putting pressure on people then I would try to steer her towards a different group.

She wants to be part of this group because in the social hierarchy at school they will be the "popular" group. Contrary to adult understanding 'popular' in teen lingo doesn't mean well liked by lots of people (although some in this cohort are) it means well known notorious Teen girls in these grips are 'popular' because they have lots of stories and gossip to share. Who knows what/when about all the latest drama has immense social cachet. If you're part of the in crowd you get a line to all the drama about drunken parties, escapades with boys, who vapes, smokes weed, takes ketamin (in a yr or so) etc etc. Your DD will know this. Talk to her about social dynamics and what is and isn't important to the grp and her. Ask her who are the 'popular' girls and whose not. Honestly she'll know (she'll give you a stratified answer) ask her why too. Ask her about other groups in her yr. There will be a moderately popular grp who are a bit less at the centre and more sensible. Friendship groups are very fluid in these years and can get really nasty. She needs to navigate a course between popular and on a path to trouble..
You'll need to help her make good choices by holding some boundaries (on behaviour, so any whiff of vaping/drinking looses trust and privileges) and supporting/coaching her too. Other parents are not your yardstick. Too many check out and abdicate responsibility at this age because it's hard work. Effectively their teens bring themselves up (and that doesn't usually end well)
Developing good relationship boundaries is so important, how people treat you and how you respond isn't something you just get. You'll need to coach, role play and be curious. If you're a bit unsure, this is quite a good book (American and over the top in some areas but lots of applicable points)

Book review queen bees sorry forgot link

‘She wants to be part of this group because in the social hierarchy at school they will be the "popular" group.’

This seems so right. She’s said to me before that she wishes she chose nice friends rather than being with the popular group. This was when they were intentionally excluding her. Even when they have treated her so badly, she still wants to be part of this friend group. So sad :(

We’re arranging a sleepover with some other friends (not part of this group).

Any other ways I can steer her away from this group without her resenting me?

Well as I said "steering her away" is a complicated slowly slowly thing. My opinion...Don't go in hard and fast unless you are really worried/it escalates. She talk to you. This is good, try and maintain this.
Don't try and talk about this grp or specific girls but more generally about popularity and good friend behaviour. Try and keep conversation brief ISH but frequent

My advice would be to be open with her and really talk about it. Ask her questions and let her explain the whole situation. You explain your side, why you are worried, why what they are doing is silly and expensive and how most kids won't be doing that and she might regret it etc. All you can really do is arm her with facts and show her you love her and let her make her own choices. It's all part of growing up. If you try to stop her without any love or explanation she will just do it behind your back.

This is good advice. Talk to her about where they are sourcing alcohol - this doesn’t sound like “mum & dad let us have an alcopop at Christmas / at a party” it’s drinking in a park or whatever - so someone is providing that drink and their intentions are unlikely to be good.

I just tried to talk to her and she just got cross. She denied that they are drinking even though I know they are (I can’t show her the proof though as it was shared in confidence and could just push her more to these friends).

Her other friends aren’t around today and she’s begging me to let her see her friends :(

You crowd them out. Get her busy doing family stuff/visiting family, things with other friends, helping you out etc. And you use car journey time to drip feed little nuggets of information, discuss her values and who she wants to be as a person, aspirations etc. Talking to her specifically about these people is too difficult for her by the sound of it and may send her in the opposite direction. The good thing in her angry reaction to you is that you know she’s not a people pleaser and less likely to go along with things.

@BrieAndChilliits far from impossible to be out clubbing at 16. There is some amazing make up and very mature looking teens and some really really good fake ID’s out there!

To be honest I don't know how I could stop my daughter from hanging out people just because I asked her to - she's in high school, she's going to do things that I know nothing about anyway.

My mom came down 'hard' on me from around this age as I was getting involved in all sorts of things. It totally backfired as I just became a better liar and then I never went to her when things did go badly. I don't have a great answer, but I think it's important to work out what your most ideal scenario is here. If you push her too hard, she'll just run in the opposite direction and you'll have less and less control the older she gets.

My daughter is 12 now and I'm keeping her very, very busy. She dances several times a week, we do family things on the weekends, she has chores and responsibilities. So she has time with her friends but not endless amounts of it and I think genuinely being tired after a long day dancing is the best distraction of all.

Personally I don't think you're unreasonable to ask her to consider all of the important things people have raised, but you'd be unreasonable to assume this would work. I always want to always know my daughter would call me if something gets out of control instead of being worried about my reaction. I remind her all the time that she can come to me if she finds herself somewhere and doesn't want to be there and I will always, always come for her. I remind her that I did all sorts of silly things as a teenager and give her examples of when things did get scary / unsafe / etc. so she knows where she should consider drawing some lines. I talk a lot about her kind and lovely friends, and keep them at the forefront of her mind - remind her to text them and have a total open house policy to her having friends round when she is free. I really hope this at least gives her a decent chance of staying safe.

I thought things had settled down but they haven’t. My DD has now asked to go to a sleepover over the weekend with these friends. I felt like she was lying to me about something when she was talking about it out and turns they are planning on drinking.

I’m feeling really desperate. I had to check her phone to find out. It’s broken any trust. I don’t want to stop her going out but I can’t trust DD to make the right decisions. I need to speak to her but really not feeling strong :(

Good advice!

This is not about trust @Fleckle. It is about her being a child and you being the adult. Of course she’ll make bad decisions - she’s only 13! She shouldn’t be expected to be making any decisions apart from what movie to watch on Friday. You’re expecting far too much of her.

And you are absolutely entitled to check her phone whenever you like - you’re paying for it.

Your dd is 13 years old. That’s still an age, where you should have a lot of parental control and leverage. It is important to get this under control now otherwise you’re going to have a hell of a difficult time when she hits 14/15/16. And this is all in the lead up to GCSEs.

Parenting teens as they move through the years is more and more by consent. However, you have to have the basics right before you loosens the reins. You are not your dd’s friend. You are her mother. It is your responsibility to tell your dd that you know she / her friends are planning on drinking. And that she will not be going on the sleepover. You tell her she is a child and it is your job to keep her safe and that you are doing this because you love her.

Let her shout and wail and scream or sulk if she’s less vocal. That’s fine. You have to be the strong one. You can do this.

Exactly. Too much freedom is not good for a young teen. They don’t know what to do with it. They still often don’t at 16 coming on 17 like my dd. Teens need a lot of parenting.

Well, it's a tricky one!

I was the friend that went drinking cider at the park and smoking (no vapes back then!) from 13.

Even though I was only 13/14, I had my head screwed on. I could tell the kids that were messed up and those that would be ok in the future. I could go so far, then stop. I didn't get up to mischief really, always knew when to leave it. Was always polite to adults that approached us to ask us to move along etc.. (and didn't tell them to fuck off like some kids I hung about with). I was a good kid really, just wanted to have fun. My mum didn't know that much about what went on.

I've turned out just fine! Went to uni, did my MSc and PhD, have a good job, husband, children, house etc.. am happy!

I know some of those kids I hung out with didn't fair so well but you kind of knew they wouldnt back then. It wasn't the drinking in the park or vaping that messed them up. It was their families and situations and reasons for their drinking that was the problem. I'm sure your daughter will b just fine. Keep talking to her and let her experiment a bit.

A friend was banned from hanging out with me when I was about 14! She rebelled against her strict parents and ran away at 16.

It's a tough one because I have a 13 yr old. Luckily he's quite geeky and strongly disapproves that I could possibly have drunk alcohol at 13!! But they change so much I don't know what he'll b like next year and in your shoes I don't know what I'd do. I guess I'll cross that bridge as and when..

Good luck

Best thing is you two are communicating well! Keep up with that!

I don’t think it’s tricky. Just because I was doing things, which were not age appropriate but many of us were doing at the time because we didn’t know better, it doesn’t mean I want my teen dd doing them as well. In fact I’ve gone out of my way to parent my dd very differently from my parenting. I’m actually teaching her things rather than leaving her to learn the hard way by experimentation.

Of course there’s a fine balance. But no one should be leaving their 13/14 yo dc to go on a sleepover knowing that they will be drinking. That’s a recipe for disaster, especially if the parents of that friend are lax. Teens do not have the foresight or capacity to understand the dangers of drinking. They have little concept of how alcohol reacts in their body and how much it takes before drinking to excess can be extremely dangerous.

My dd has looked after her friend, who regularly vomits at parties. The girl was 15 when this started,16 now.