To wonder why screens aren’t investigated as a cause of childhood behaviour issues?

[Peony1897]

We now know that screens, and in particular tablets, have really horrific effects on young children and their emotional/social development - in particular speech, regulating anger, sensory issues and how they interact with their peers.

So why is it whenever we see a thread where a small child has some or all of the above issues, and the OP clearly mentions tablet use or ‘all they are interested in is screens’, the answer is nearly always an autism assessment rather than removal of screens?

Genuinely curious as to why such a clear risk factor is never picked up on.

Who? I’ve listened to everyone on here. The only poster I said that to was somebody waving the studies away even though as far as they said they’re not in any role relevant to this topic.

But you were talking about a child being in complete overwhelm just needing to remove themselves from the situation temporarily. Why would music not help them? What does the screen give that the music does not?

Oh hang on... The dopamine hit of the screen addiction. Do you not see that it's a self propagating cycle of addiction?!

My son is 5.5 and has never had a tablet or used our phone, except for when we're showing him photos or trying to explain something to him, like what some obscure animal he's asking about looks like or where we're going on holiday etc. It just didn't occur to us when he was small and as an older toddler it felt like "why add in another Thing to manage?" if that makes sense?

At cafes etc we'll people watch, chat, scribble and take him outside if needs be for some air. Yes we've had to ask for cake to go but that's just par for the course sometimes with little ones. We don't eat out much but he's usually ok when we do if it's quiet and we don't dawdle over the menu. We've never been on a plane with him yet but we've done longer car trips and it's fine, nowadays he listens to music and we play eye spye and he'll happily chill and look out the window "thinking" for a good while. When he was younger he'd nap and flip through little books and stuff.

He watches TV, but we all watch together in the living room and he doesn't know about YouTube/ticktock etc and he doesn't watch it after about 5pm ish unless we're having a film night. We're not perfect and he definitely watches too much some days, but others hardly any and he's pretty good when it goes off usually (obviously he has his moments, as all kids do)

All this being said... He's still autistic. So take from that what you will @Peony1897 🤷

😂😂😂😂

What did ND kids use to self regulate before screens?

Because whatever it was, it seemed to work better.

I think part of the problem is that parents are exhausted. There’s less allowing kids to play out now with friends (more cars and other dangers) so the alternative is to entertain them yourself. Doing that all day on your own as the only adult is tiring and so screens are very tempting. Also there is a lot of social intolerance for kids noise, lots of disapproving looks and comments if your child is running about playing in public and at least where I am a lot of child friendly places have shut down.

I read books 📕 obsessively. Like I would get through a 200+ page book in one day from about age eight. And I would sometimes get told off for reading too much and not interacting with other kids or adults enough.

So in short, no. You don’t have any experience of what I’m talking about so kindly take your condescending bullshit elsewhere.

Did you intend to some across incredibly condescending?

You literally said in your own post that your ND son is currently managing well without screens on holiday.

My girls are 8 and 11, so a little older now.

They didn’t have much screen time as toddlers. Tv, yes, but not tablets etc. They were never given them in buggies, restaurants etc but at that time they weren’t as prevalent as they are now.

They are polite, calm, well behaved children. However, about a year or so ago they did get into YouTube (new smart tv and they figured out how to use it). Started off with inoffensive stuff like Moriah Elizabeth but then they started watching what I can only describe as American families screaming at each other constantly. Ninja Kids, maybe?

Well - their behaviour went quite rapidly down hill. The screaming, drama and arguing sky rocketed. And wow, the utter desperation to watch it! It was awful and as clear as day to me. So we banned YouTube outright, maybe about 8 months ago now?

Their behaviour quickly returned to normal. And actually they didn’t even ask for YouTube after I came down hard about the ban. It will never darken our tv screen again.

They do like SumDog (for school) and DuoLingo on the iPad but they do also play some mindless crap too. They get some access to games on the iPad but it’s limited. They do not have phones - I am holding out as long as I can. I wish the schools would encourage less screen time.

Do you have any other ideas about why there is a clear positive correlation between numbers of children being labelled ND (whether officially diagnosed or not) and children having free access to screens?

Rather than an inverse correlation, which is what you would expect if screens actually helped.

Yes, I was very like that as a child as well. (I have ADHD apparently.)

@MissScarletInTheBallroom better understanding and diagnosis of neurodiversity is one possibility

A better understanding shouldn't lead to worse behaviour.

Probably because the setup and routine are completely different!? They won’t be facing all the day to day issues/demands they face at home when they’re on holiday?

I think it’s far too simplistic to blame screens entirely. I am not saying they cannot intensify symptoms but to lay all the blame on a screen doesn’t do us any favours.

https://plotlygraphs.medium.com/spurious-correlations-56752fcffb69

That's why I asked whether there's anything about what they are currently doing on holiday which could be replicated at home. I know it's not the same environment but sometimes being in a different environment prompts you to rethink your day to day routine.

It must be difficult to manage conditions like autism and then come and read things like this on top of it.

But we’re not saying there’s been a rise in screens AND SEMH behaviours.

We’re saying we now know one causes the other, it’s just to what extent it has caused what appears to be a crisis in kids SEMH and behaviour.

Unless you’re not willing to believe the following, or think they’ve misinterpreted their own studies?

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10353947/

too much time spent in front of a screen and multitasking with other media has been related to worse executive functioning and academic performance. As screen time reduces the amount and quality of interactions between children and their caregivers, it can also have an impact on language development. Contextual elements like co-viewing and topic appropriateness are key in determining how language development is impacted. Additionally, excessive screen usage has detrimental effects on social and emotional growth, including a rise in the likelihood of obesity, sleep disorders, and mental health conditions including depression and anxiety. It can obstruct the ability to interpret emotions, fuel aggressive conduct, and harm one's psychological health in general.

I feel like if this were anything other than screen time, the results of numerous studies wouldn’t be treated with such contempt and suspicion. Mumsnet is generally very hot on evidence, there are reams of it here yet a handful of posters seem desperate not to believe it.

It is. Lots of us already torture ourselves about whether it was something we did as parents or not.

As someone said upthread, this is just a rehashing of the refrigerator mother theory.

Those that they're not talking about the REAL autism cases is also contributing to the stigma and shame.

Well I suppose what you’re essentially doing is laying some/all blame for diagnosable behaviours at the feet of the parents. I don’t know if you’re right or wrong, but it’s naive to think there isn’t going to be some pushback on that…