STOP calling people "a Karen"

[PaperwhiteTheFriendlyGhost]

Why are people so lazy and ignorant? Ironically they use it in some instances to berate someone for a perceived insult. Maybe this should be on Pedants' Corner, I don't know.

Calling someone 'entitled' or 'very rude' is a better way, I agree that such behaviour is completely unacceptable.

All the women called Karen I have ever known are pleasant people.

I agree. I thought people were stopping this on here though. MN do class it as a personal insult and will delete any post that calls anyone this. So if you see anyone calling you - or someone else - a 'KAREN' please report it. It is demeaning and misogynistic, and as has been said, designed to shut women down who DARE to speak out about anything.

And who the actual F uses 'Daren' for men? (As a pp @MixedBananas suggested?) That's not a thing, and is not a demeaning insult.

The equivalent for a man (of a 'Karen') would be 'gammon,' which is also offensive, and borderline racist.

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It's funny how not long after 'me too' society came up with an insult for women who speak out about things. Focusing on older women is nothing new. They say it because they aren't allowed to say "shut up old woman" which is what they mean.

I think my fat thumbs voted the wrong way. I’m so sorry - you are unquestionably Not being unreasonable!
This is a lazy & insulting trope & more people should call it out. Horrible.

Except I've been told before that it's fine because men are called 'Kevin'......

I had to point out it was misogynistic on a thread just a few minutes ago. Nobody on there was raging at a public service worker, they were suggesting that vaping might not be ideal if you're pregnant.

So it should bother people because it has become a word just to insult women and try to shut them up - even by other women.

Hate it. I am on the facebook pages of villages and communities close to me and this insult appears regularly. Shameful. And yes, it is used to shame and silence women.

i said above that the Karen's I know couldn't be further from the stereotype but actually one is now in her 60s/70s and a brave lady who will stand up and intervene when she sees bad behaviour in public. She has intervened when hearing people insulting vulnerable people in public, and stepped in to save schoolchildren being bullied on their way home from school. Both things could well be called out as 'Karen' behaviour, but actually took a huge amount of courage and aided others who were in need of help. If we start attempting to silence/stop all 'busybody' behaviour, communities and individuals will suffer.

I judge people who use the term Karen as it's often used by people (men and women) who can't see another point of view and who can't articulate themselves well. I believe the original use has been lost and basically is now used to tell someone to 'shut up'.

Firstly, its labelling the woman, not the behaviour. Its designed to make women fearful of asserting boundaries as they are scared of being labelled a ' Karen'. There have been posts on here where women have reasonable complaints (noisy neighbours) but say they are reluctant to complain as they don't want to be called a Karen. That is exactly what the term ' Karen' is intended to do. Make women scared of asserting themselves.

Secondly, its used ubiquitously for any woman trying to assert a boundary, not matter what that is. I see it all the time on village posts if women post about any issue, fly tipping, aggressive dogs - doesn't matter. ' Shut up Karen' ' Okay Karen' , will come the insults.

There is no male equivalent, however much people try to pretend there is.

I am sick of the 'label and dismiss' culture. If you have an issue with someone, address what it is in clear terms. Don't label someone and think that means you have 'won'.

@goodforher excellent post 👌

I hate it too! Such an idiotic thing to say.

I have never heard the 'Daren' thing in the UK.

Sorry, what?

No. Nor me. Then again, it's ok for men of all ages to be assertive.

It is misogynistic and idiotic. It also makes the people who use that term sound really uneducated - which they usually are.

Yes. This. It is fine for all men, young or old to speak up. But women over a certain age? Shut up or you will be publicly ridiculed until you submit to meekness.

I was livid when I heard my 8yo use the term Karen. It's clearly from YouTube videos or friends because I don't use it. I had to have some words and hopefully that will be the end of it.

I find it a misogynistic and ageist term. Karen was a very popular name in the fifties and sixties and l know several older ladies with the name. I dislike its lazy usage to put down the opinions of older women. I can think of no equivalent for men of any age.

These threads always get hijacked by the vocal few banging on about racists in America.

i will say the same as I say on every thread about this subject

its an ageist, misogynistic term used to shut women up. Those using it are thick, lazy and uneducated.

Are you forgetting that this term happens to be the actual first name of many women?
How would you feel if your own name replaced this ‘term’ next?

There are many adjectives and nouns in the English language, why trash a person’s name?

It’s horrible ageism and misogyny. I hate it.

I think it comes from a deep sense of self-loathing and lashing out as a way of deflecting their own feelings of inadequacy.

It's clearly misogynistic.
Also, asking to speak to the manager usually means wanting to have a discussion with someone who has the authority to use their discretion, rather than someone who is blindly and often unhelpfully applying rules. How is that wrong? I'm sure we can all give examples of when that would be appropriate. The issue is that many businesses can't be bothered to listen to or interact with their paying customers and put low-paid workers with no authority on the front line to deal with customers who are rightly frustrated. The frontline workers are told to follow the company rules to the letter or risk losing their jobs.
There are many retailers now where you can't contact the store direct whether by email or phone to make enquiries.. they have decided that it's not worth employing sufficient staff to interact with the public.( Sainsburys, I'm looking at you specifically).

Aside from all the very good points being made here is the fact that asking to speak to the manager is sometimes the right thing to do. If there’s a problem that the front line person can’t deal with and doesn’t understand, should you

a) walk away and forget that you’re out of pocket?
b) argue fruitlessly with the poor person stuck at the desk who isn’t paid enough for this shit?
c) ask to speak to someone who is in a position of responsibility?