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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Can I take this to court

52 replies

User2001 · 23/03/2025 21:57

Background: had a messy divorce and 1 year Non Molestation Order (NMO) against my ex after DV including sexual assault.

I now live in my own home as resident parent with DC, we have a Child Arrangement Order (CAO) and DC visits ex occasionally, usually alternate weekends for half a day and sometimes a midweek dinner after school.

Ex has to collect and drop back DC from my home, for reasons I won’t go into as I don’t want to be too outing. Needless to say, it’s part of the CAO for a good reason and can’t be changed.
The CAO reads that parents can alter the visitation times by mutual agreement, and only if DC is okay with it. Ex keeps changing it without notice or consultation with me first, resulting in DC often returning an hour or two late.

When Ex drops DC home or picks DC up, he often shouts for DC or holds conversation through the house at the front door, not shouting insults or aggressively, but nevertheless taking over the entire property with his booming voice. If you go as far back as the furthest, most distant room, it’s like he’s in the house!

He also knocks on windows when he’s rung the doorbell (it’s a ground floor property) and peers through them into the open plan living space and separately into the ground floor bedroom (though not my bedroom, thankfully). I have requested he stops this invasion of privacy, but “no” doesn’t mean “no” to him, and he does what he wants regardless of anyone else.

So I asked him to stop coming on the driveway or ringing the doorbell at all. This will solve the problem of him booming through the house and peering in through my home. I live on a road with loads of easy parking outside the driveway and when other people collect DC they often pull into the side of the road outside. It’s perfectly safe to do. I asked ex to do the same. But he doesn’t. He does what he wants and seems to take great pleasure in walking all over my request.

when I initially requested he doesn’t come onto the property (my friends had been telling me for ages I should stop him having access and I hadn’t dared to), I was surprised by how lighter I felt. I hadn’t realised I was carrying such a heavy load on my shoulders and it felt great that he wouldn’t be able to peer through my windows anymore. Of course this relief was short lived because he disregarded it and still does whatever he wants.

My question is, AIBU for wanting to get a new NMO prohibiting him from coming onto my property at all? Technically it’s trespass onto private property when someone has written asking you repeatedly not to. There is never a good reason to do this now DC’s maturity extends to walking out to the car (like I said, this is normal practice for other people). AIBU for even daring to think that I can stop somebody coming onto my property and peering in through my windows? Do I have to just put up with it and learn not to care?

I just feel a bit bad, as the first NMO was to protect me from physical harm and this would be to protect me psychologically by enforcing my boundary to keep a protected space from his micro-invasions. He’s not a physical risk to me anymore, which is what the first NMO was for. But I don’t know how else to stop him coming onto my property. Is there a different court order for this?

When the judge granted me an Occupation Order during the divorce, ex was prohibited from entering the driveway or family home without my written consent. The Occupation Order stopped the day I moved out, as I moved into my own home and he moved back into the old family home. As far as I understand it, I can’t apply for an Occupation Order again, since ex has never lived here and the divorce is done. I would want the same protection in my new home that the Occupation Order gave me in the old house, where Ex was barred, except by written consent agreement.

I hope I’m not being a snowflake here, please disagree kindly if you think I shouldn’t or can’t do this because a judge would not grant it.

OP posts:
FortyElephants · 24/03/2025 08:22

Titasaducksarse · 24/03/2025 06:49

Does the CAO have defined contact times? Mind you, age of child would mean court would expect flexibility but might be worth sticking to the Order if this helps and if DC is OK with that.
If ex won't then go to court...self apply for enforcement of current Order.

The current order is being adhered to. The XH is pushing the boundaries and behaving like a dick but he's adhering to the order. There's absolutely zero point in trying to go back to court to prevent him walking up her drive. Not going to happen.

Titasaducksarse · 24/03/2025 17:20

FortyElephants · 24/03/2025 08:22

The current order is being adhered to. The XH is pushing the boundaries and behaving like a dick but he's adhering to the order. There's absolutely zero point in trying to go back to court to prevent him walking up her drive. Not going to happen.

I don't think the Order is being adhered to. Orders are usually very specific re timing whereas part of the issue here is, the ex turning up whenever it suits. However if he had to stick to times then OP could close blinds, get relative to answer door etc to avoid ex. He's deliberately choosing random times.

User2001 · 24/03/2025 18:52

thank you all for your valued comments. I would quote and reply individually if some people hadn’t already quoted and you can’t quote twice. So I will try to remember each of the points raised above. I’m sorry they’re not as personal a reply.

I would quote and reply individually if some people hadn’t already quoted and you can’t quote twice. So I will try to remember each of the points raised above. I’m sorry they’re not as personal a reply by doing it this way.

@TheHillsIsLonely- you mentioned that his worsening behaviour is what concerns you and funnily enough as I was typing the words that “he’s ramping it”, I thought to myself: that is going to ring alarm bells and I wonder why it doesn’t with me. I think it’s because, I consider ‘ramping something up’ to be escalating to a larger scale, that involves dangerous risk. He seems to keep it small scale and difficult for me but not dangerous. Even the sexual assaults could be considered not dangerous in some strange way because we had been in a relationship at the time and it was very hard to report that to the police when there had been times I had consented. We have children together for the sake! It can be still difficult to get my head around the fact I accuse him of rape. But he definitely did, and it definitely was, and when it happens to you, you know that twisted feeling in your gut. It is unmistakeable. Does it make him dangerous to me now? I don’t think so. If I were still in a relationship with him, I believe he would continue to do what he wants regardless of what I am able to do or I want to do. But I’m not, and that distance protects me. This is silly mind games which is psychologically difficult and it has been previously coercive and controlling, so to see me living away from him and doing well is probably killing him, but it’s not making him dangerous to disregard my wishes to come on the property or look into my.windows when I ask him not to. It’s intrusive and it’s not right, and, especially when he has a history of pushing past my ‘no’, but I don’t think he’s going to stab me on the front driveway or at the front door or anything like that. Having said that, all the time it happened I didn’t seek professional help at the time and I probably should have, because I do have a tendency to play these things down and so I will seek support. I’m currently off ill with the sick bug so can’t be dealing with this professionally, but I will do as soon as I’m back on my feet.

@unsync- you also say you have seen that I am minimising and not wanting to antagonise him and you are right. It can be easy to slip back into that. I’ve got some events coming up where I can’t escape being in the same room as him and I suppose there is a part of me dreading it and wanting to keep things calm. But he always used to make me doubt my own reality and if he minimised something then I did too. I think I might be doing the same here, but I will seek professional advice over it though.
I do have a door cam and he can access a massive window at the front door, shows through to an open plan lounge, diner and kitchen. That’s the whole of downstairs apart from the toilet really. There is also a bedroom window but it’s not my bedroom.

I like the idea of the motorised blinds controlled by an app! I’m quite an APP-y kind of a person and I like the idea that I wouldn’t have to keep running up and down to put blinds on and off. Unfortunately, I spent all my house money when we moved in on installing blinds at the window and won’t be able to afford to switch them out at this point in time, but it could be something I would consider in the future.

@Keepingthingsinteresting- I also don’t believe police would be keen to help because they weren’t when I reported much worse things in the past. They were fine when I reported it, but as soon as it went to higher levels, it fizzled out.
Thank you for sending the link, but I don’t think I would want something that obscures the view because it’s such a nice view and because it’s an open plan set up, any room downstairs is the view that I would have out of that massive front window. It’s a really nice view and I would miss it terribly if I had to cover it up.

@businessflop25- outside the front window are lots of plant pots and car parking spaces. Funnily enough I do have roses and prickly plants but he still managed to get close, unscathed. If I make it wider, I wouldn’t be able to fit my car there so that would be a bit of a problem. But I do appreciate you thinking of different ideas to help me out.

@sel2223- I agree. Which is why I did nothing about it at all. It is totally a power and control thing and that’s why I dislike it so much. I’ve been controlled by him for so long. It’s lovely to feel my freedom and I hate the idea that he would be sticking his head in and looking at me all the time like that. What happens actually, is that I have to hide in my bedroom or the bathroom, but he can be there a long time and it feels like the kind of situation that is not a healthy one for me to live in.

@Apreslapluielesoleil- I do have a door cam with sound and so it will always be picked up when he raises his voice at the door. However, I don’t think anybody would be interested if I showed it to them because he’s not angry shouting and being aggressive or making threats. I completely agree a secondary age child does not need escorting to the door and I’ve raised that with him, but he just will not stop.

@Titasaducksarse- it does have defined contact times but they are flexible because they are dependent on whether DC wishes to or not. The way it’s worded is that the parents can agree different times but the child has to be okay with it. What he’s actually doing is deciding unilaterally to bring them home when he wants and the parents aren’t deciding together in any way shape or form. That part isn’t according to the court order. So effectively you’ve got the resident parent (me) not knowing when DC will return, Which as they get older and want to leave Dad’s house to go out independently, could become more of a problem. The court order defines return time on a school night as the same at the weekend but I am happy for later weekend returns, though not as keen on the school night because they do get more tired and it has a knock on effect with their homework et cetera. He sometimes unilaterally decides to.being them home way past the court stiplulated time without consulting me.

@FortyElephants it does concern me that there would be zero points in trying to go back to court to prevent him coming onto my property when I’ve asked him not to, because there is no reason for him to, and especially because he yells through the house and peers through the window windows the way he does. I suppose that’s why I started the thread, to put the feelers out as to whether there’s any point.

OP posts:
HAF1119 · 24/03/2025 19:00

Can you get a small battery window alarm? It would react if someone knocked on your window. You can switch it off except for the day of contact but they make one hell of a lot of noise and may deter :)

Dollshousedolly · 24/03/2025 19:09

If you see him peering through your windows, go over and close the curtains/blinds straight away. Don’t make eye contact with him in any way,

Titasaducksarse · 24/03/2025 19:09

Amendments to Orders have to be made jointly not unilaterally so, on that basis you could go for either enforcement or amendment. However as your child is older I'd suggest a safe independent place for drop off/handovers.

User2001 · 24/03/2025 19:28

HAF1119 · 24/03/2025 19:00

Can you get a small battery window alarm? It would react if someone knocked on your window. You can switch it off except for the day of contact but they make one hell of a lot of noise and may deter :)

I didn’t know such thing existed! I’ll have to Google that one.

OP posts:
User2001 · 24/03/2025 19:30

Dollshousedolly · 24/03/2025 19:09

If you see him peering through your windows, go over and close the curtains/blinds straight away. Don’t make eye contact with him in any way,

Yes, this would be a potential strategy if I'm in the right room. Finally, the end of the last time it happened it was the bedroom that got knocked and I was in the other room. However, most of the time it is the main open plan room that is looked into.

OP posts:
User2001 · 24/03/2025 19:33

Titasaducksarse · 24/03/2025 19:09

Amendments to Orders have to be made jointly not unilaterally so, on that basis you could go for either enforcement or amendment. However as your child is older I'd suggest a safe independent place for drop off/handovers.

The ideal thing would be in a neutral space but, for reasons I can’t go into here as it will be too outing (if it isn’t already!), I’m not able to do that. My ability to drive varies and I could not be relied upon and neither could any of my family or friends. As a one-off maybe, but not regularly.

OP posts:
annoyedandbored · 24/03/2025 19:43

User2001 · 24/03/2025 19:33

The ideal thing would be in a neutral space but, for reasons I can’t go into here as it will be too outing (if it isn’t already!), I’m not able to do that. My ability to drive varies and I could not be relied upon and neither could any of my family or friends. As a one-off maybe, but not regularly.

Surely if the child is a teen then they can get themselves on a bus into town or something to meet dad if he wants?

User2001 · 24/03/2025 19:46

Not possible at the moment, again, for a good reason, but would be too outing to give all the details.

OP posts:
RandomMess · 24/03/2025 20:31

If he is repeatedly not sticking to the order just don’t let your DC go?

FortyElephants · 24/03/2025 21:24

RandomMess · 24/03/2025 20:31

If he is repeatedly not sticking to the order just don’t let your DC go?

This isn't good advice. If she stopped contact and he took it back to court she would look really obstructive to have stopped it because he won't stick to an exact time or because he comes up to the window instead of waiting at the street.

Mumofteenandtween · 24/03/2025 21:53

Where does he stand to look in the windows? You mentioned roses. I have a feeling that horse manure is good for roses. Perhaps a great big pile of horse manure. For your roses.

PeriPeriMam · 24/03/2025 22:26

@User2001 I'm sorry you're going through all of this. I think you need to pause and look at just how much you are minimizing his current and past behavior and the effect on you, even down to questioning yourself if you were really raped. I'm sure it's a survival mechanism, but survival mechanisms need reviewing from time to time.

I'm struggling to understand some of the replies here. If we imagine for a moment any man - let alone one you have previously been raped by - repeatedly comes onto your property, looks in the windows, shouts at you, ignores requests not to do this, this is harassment. It is designed to intimidate you, and it's working. Personally I would be scared if any man kept doing this to me in my home - he has no respect for boundaries on any level. I don't fully understand why you wouldn't report this to the police or at very least speak to Women's Aid - I know it's very hard and you might feel dragged back to a place you don't want to be, but where is this going to stop otherwise? My understanding is a NMO is a civil order. This is possibly no longer a civil offence, but you need to take advice on that.

Easterbunnygettingsorted · 24/03/2025 22:34

Absolutely a solicitor will write any old shite. Ime
They are getting paid..
I had a new dc with a new dp. Exh had that newborn added to his contact request!! Obviously not you absolute idiot... Got very very stupid the entire case....

seven201 · 25/03/2025 01:00

Can you ask DC to tell him not to? Your child must have noticed you doing the blinds a lot and not being happy about it. I do get that it's very tricky and you don't want to bring them into it, but they might listen to them. A simple "mum doesn't like you peering into the house, so please stay in the car and I'll come to you"

FortyElephants · 25/03/2025 07:10

seven201 · 25/03/2025 01:00

Can you ask DC to tell him not to? Your child must have noticed you doing the blinds a lot and not being happy about it. I do get that it's very tricky and you don't want to bring them into it, but they might listen to them. A simple "mum doesn't like you peering into the house, so please stay in the car and I'll come to you"

It's not fair to ask a child to manage the abusive behaviour of his father

SauvignonBlonk · 25/03/2025 07:44

In an ideal world you need a solution that means he doesn’t come to your house, do you have a relative that DS could go to for handover or a neutral public location for handovers?
Looking through windows won’t meet the threshold for a NMO but I totally understand how threatening it is.

romdowa · 25/03/2025 07:51

Can your child text you to let you know that they are on the way so you can close the blinds and not have to have them closed all day?

Sharptonguedwoman · 25/03/2025 08:34

I know you wouldn't want to get your DC involved but could they text you when they leave his house?

AuntAgathaGregson · 25/03/2025 08:46

I suspect you could get an order quite separately from the non-mol order based simply on the fact that you have withdrawn permission for him to come onto your property and he is habitually ignoring that. However, it would be quite expensive, and even more expensive to enforce it as you would probably have to go back to court for contempt a few times before the courts took it really seriously and started imposing serious penalties.

I'd be tempted to wind him up by leaving men's PJs prominently on view in your bedroom, or putting a picture of someone very large and muscly by your bedside where he can see it through the window.

FortyElephants · 25/03/2025 08:50

AuntAgathaGregson · 25/03/2025 08:46

I suspect you could get an order quite separately from the non-mol order based simply on the fact that you have withdrawn permission for him to come onto your property and he is habitually ignoring that. However, it would be quite expensive, and even more expensive to enforce it as you would probably have to go back to court for contempt a few times before the courts took it really seriously and started imposing serious penalties.

I'd be tempted to wind him up by leaving men's PJs prominently on view in your bedroom, or putting a picture of someone very large and muscly by your bedside where he can see it through the window.

What kind of order do you think she could get? A restrictive legal order MUST be proportionate. I can only think of a prohibited steps order and there is no way this would be deemed a proportionate justification for a restrictive order. It would be considered a waste of court time to even read the application. Not every facet of unreasonable or abusive behaviour can be prevented by a court application.

TheWonderhorse · 25/03/2025 09:00

I don't know about the legalities, but does your DC have a phone? Could you have him let you know when they're on the way home? Or ask DC to share a location on Whatsapp? Just so you know when to expect them?

Thelnebriati · 25/03/2025 09:57

What he's doing is harassment. Its not ok to go up to repeatedly go up to someone's house and peer in through the windows, especially when you already have a non molestation order against you.
In your shoes I'd phone the local police station and ask to speak to the domestic abuse team.