AIBU to still feel guilty over DD lumbar puncture?

[RainbowUnicorse]

When DD was a 4 month old baby she developed a fever,not bad fever tbh around 38. We took her to the hospital and they went all panic on her, she was a reflux baby but until then no one believed how much she cried. In hospital they said she sounded very upset and I told them that it’s her usual cry. They argued with me and insisted that she needs a lumbar puncture. Long story short she was ok, right as rain in 2 days. However I still cry when I think about the fact that they do that procedure without any anaesthetic. They said we’ll just have to pin her down so she doesn’t move. And after the procedure they said it’s important to keep her lying horizontally but they themselves brought her out upright. I suppose it doesn’t help that she’s a very shy girl now that she’s 7, has many anxieties and her main one is that me or my husband are not near her. I cannot help but think that I should have better advocated for her and that her fear of people is partially due to that very traumatic experience….

AIBU?

Kindly but you are being very unreasonable

My daughter had one at 10 months old, they advised me not to stay with her due to how bad the positioning looks but assured me it looks much worse than it was

It didn't seem to have any negative impact on her whatsoever ever. She's a bubbly normal 4 year old now

My baby had this at about 5 weeks old. They asked me to wait outside and I’m glad I did. They then pumped her full of the meningitis medicines for 2 days. Then the results came back to explain it was viral meningitis not bacterial so much less sinister and we went home. I’ve never felt the test had any adverse impact. But if she hadn’t had the LP as you suggest, in the example above, we’d have stayed in hospital, having drugs she didn’t need, always thinking she’d had bacterial meningitis.

it's not a procedure that needs general anaesthetic. In adults we do use local anaesthetic to the skin...not sure what the paediatricians get up to. There actually isn't that much sensory innervation once you're through the skin and local anaesthetic injections can smart pretty sharply too so perhaps they don't use it. In a real hurry on labour ward when we're trying to get a spinal in quickly and you've only got one shot before converting to a GA (a spinal anaesthetic is exactly the same as a lumbar puncture) there isn't much time for lots of local and once the introducer needle's in I'm not sure people feel that much of the needling if you are in the midline.

The idea of 'just treat them without doing the test' is really poor medicine - without cultures/sensitivities you don't know which bug you're aiming for or indeed whether it is a bacterial infection or one of the more off piste diagnoses.

I think you did advocate for her very well. You were concerned about her being ill, you got her help, you listened to the experts and she had a horrible test, luckily she was ok and now she has grown up healthy and lovely. I think you would probably do the same again. It’s a tough choice but you made it in her best interests and you should do the same next time.

My son has had two lumbar punctures in his life - one at a couple of days old, and one when he was around a year. Hideous for us as parents and I still feel guilty that I didn’t insist on being in the room. He also underwent a variety of other horrendous treatments/tests. However he doesn’t remember any of it and is a very confident child. Obviously every child is different but I very much doubt that one medical procedure would cause ongoing anxiety issues.

My child had a lumbar puncture at 2 weeks old. We weren’t allowed in the room because it’s so horrific. In our case they caught a virus that would have killed my baby otherwise. They don’t do them for no reason.

In the kindest possible way - and I do understand as I carry considerable trauma myself from my baby’s time in NICU - it has passed, you cannot change it, even if that procedure had fed into your dds current anxiety there is nothing that can be done about it having been done so try to focus on helping her now, in whatever ways you can.

Again - I know that parental guilt is inevitable and hard to let go of, but it serves no purpose and can hold you back. Try to move on from it.

God, I hear you OP. DS has to have one at 2 months old and I asked to be with him and they said no, and I said I insist and they told me I'd be an infection risk and would be endangering him if I went with him. I sobbed the second they took him. It still makes me cry.

DD needed one at 3 weeks old and they had no issue with me being there. Makes me so bloody angry for DS.

They are a horrible procedure but very, very quick and anesthetic carries risks. I'd not put my baby under anaesthetic for that.

It doesn't really make sense to he upset she was better a couple of days later. I mean, yes, ultimately the lumbar puncture wasn't needed/helpful, but you didn't know that at the time and if she did have meningitis, she'd have needed lifesaving treatment to start quickly.

I don't think in any way, shape or form that this has contributed to anxiety. It would be like saying anxiety is caused by getting stung by a bee or catching your skin in a zip. A quick but painful thing - forgotten about by baby within minutes.

I've had a lumbar puncture - it's not that painful. My son also needed to have one at 12 weeks old. They don't let parents in the room because of how they have to hold the baby - squoosh them into a position where they have a rounded spine and can't move a muscle. Babies obviously don't like being held like this so they cry a lot. It's also a really delicate procedure, and what they don't want is parents in the room being distracting. They just need to get in and get it done.

I don't have one teeny regret about my son having the procedure, even though he didn't have meningitis (though he did have a systemic infection). They can't just randomly prescribe antibiotics without knowing what the infection is either. My son is probably autistic (undergoing diagnosis) but this is unrelated.

We are so incredibly lucky to live in an era where these options exist. You did the right thing by agreeing to the test.

In another parallel universe you could have thought you were 'advocating' for her by refusing the test, and it turned out she really did need it. You did advocate for her that day - the experts felt that the test was required, they wouldn't have done it otherwise, therefore you advocated for her beautifully by making the right logical decision with the info that was available to everyone.

My baby slept through his at a few days old. He had an 8 week NICU stay and is a typical teenager now.
I think her anxiety is because of something else entirely!?

DS had 3 at around a week old as they were all inconclusive and he was extremely poorly. The lumbar puncture eventually came back clear but it could have led to a diagnosis when everything else came back clear so was absolutely necessary.
I had previous experience of lumbar puncture in adults so asked if I would be in the room. The lovely doctor said absolutely not, I had enough trauma from the previous 2 days and as a post partum mum I would not be welcome in the room and to leave it to the picu nurses to look after him.
He came to get me before the procedure and plonked me in the room furthest away from DS with a cup of tea every time.
DS is now a happy and cheeky 4 year old with no memory of any of that time and I still think of that doctor who took care of me as well as DS

Why would this have anything to do with a lumbar puncture at 4 months old? You still cry about this? I think it’s likely you have some other anxiety issues going on in the house that have contributed to her attachment issues. And I say that kindly as someone with anxiety issues which have definitely had an impact on my kids (even with the best of intentions it’s hard to not have anxieties filter out to wider family).

ps medics reeeeeally don’t do lumbar punctures for no reason. If they felt it was bad enough to do that they definitely wouldn’t have been dissuaded by you shouting a little louder.

Isn’t a lumbar puncture a spinal tap? I’ve had two of those with my sections, they didn’t hurt imo

OP, I say this with huge kindness, but it’s time to stop feeling guilty and trying to find reasons for her anxiety and personality. One of my 4 fell ill at 3 months old and also had a lumbar puncture in emergency. I’m a bit surprised about the stories of parents being sent out of the room, they asked me if I could stay and help hold him and talk through the procedure so he knew I was there. They may do an assessment of parent coping though before deciding.

I actually disagree that the procedure is one that is always traumatic and painful. I’ve had 2 as an adult (plus 2 epidurals) and I was anxious for pain that never eventuated. It was really no worse than a blood test with a bit of pressure. My DS started crying when he was being held in place, long before someone touched him. His crying didn’t escalate really with the procedure, i think the source of his distress was more around the restraint.

I’m really not being unkind when I say it’s far more likely your DD has a genetic predisposition to being quite an anxious person, and there is likely to be an element of her getting her cues from you, and your own anxieties come across pretty heavily in your posts. You are a kind and loving mum who went with a recommendation from a medical professional. I disagree also with a PP who suggested people could bypass it by just getting the strong dose of antibiotics they would have given with meningitis anyway. I’ve actually had one of my children go down this route twice before they were 1, as they became very seriously ill very quickly, and the hospital thought they could turn critical. In those circumstances I was asked for consent to start treating meningitis and sepsis immediately, rather than having a lumbar puncture, as there was no time to wait for the results. While he never had a lumbar puncture, the amount of antibiotics he understandably received was significant both times. The second time it took 48 hours for swabs to come back to show he had a rarer but more severe strain of influenza (he was about 5 months old then) and they stopped the antibiotic drip immediately. Many professionals would see strong doses of unnecessary antibiotics as carrying more consequences than a quick diagnostic procedure, even if it did briefly hurt when the needle was in.

Children often feel anxious when they can tell that a parent is - which is a natural reaction, as they're being told through body language, expression and words that there is something to be worried about.

She isn't going to remember a time when she had a test that could have saved her life and/or little limbs. At four months old, it's just not possible.

DD1 had sepsis as a newborn (23hrs old) and had a lumbar puncture at 2days old to rule out meningitis as well. The doctors specifically told us not to be there and if I remember rightly, I think they were going to do it overnight anyway. I was too unwell to really appreciate what was going on, but i know my DH found it very hard.

I have always worried about the effect of her being separated from me in the NICU and being so ill. Shes nearly 4yo now. She can be a bit shy but is getting better. I'm just doing my best to build her confidence and give her lots of support and encouragement, just as I will for my youngest who didn't have that experience. Hopefully it's enough ❤️

My eldest had 2 lumbar punctures at a week old during to severe infection. He's perfectly fine outgoing strapping teen

She is not shy and anxious because she had a lumbar puncture at four months old. She is shy and anxious because that’s her personality.

Millions of babies have one-off painful procedures. They don’t remember them and it doesn’t affect their personality when they’re older. You have nothing to worry about.

The one who has been traumatised by the lumbar puncture is you, not your daughter. You’re projecting your own feelings.

It’s completely understandable that this is bothering you. I think most parents are very upset by having to experience a tiny baby undergoing something like that. But you did nothing wrong and you have nothing to feel guilty for. Your daughter is fine and you’re a great mum.

Both my kids have had this and in my eldest case it saved her life. Was it nice no, but I would do it again. Eldest was 4 and youngest was 6 weeks old. Yes they are horrible but at times it's the only way to tell what it is.

Thanks for this. My baby had one 2 weeks ago at 3 weeks old. It was presented to us as though it was no more painful than the routine vaccinations, but we were asked to leave the room while they did it, so I was worried they were playing it down to reassure us

Thanks everyone for replying! It does help to get a perspective rather than keep it all in. I’m sorry to hear so many parents went though similar/ feel the same way 💐
Also thanks for those who shared experience of lumbar puncture as an adult, it’s very comforting.
I had an awful PNA when DD was born but it wasn’t something I realised until I came out of it. Maybe I haven’t fully.

The only thing that hurt at all was the insertion of the needle. A bit like the feeling you get when they are taking blood - a scratch, rather than a prick. But after that it feels a bit weird, but really not painful at all.

This is about your frightening experience, not hers. Kindly, go through it with a counsellor. I've had it as an adult and it's weird but bearable. I wasn't in any pain afterwards, or during really, just the needle which took a few tries as it was a new junior Dr. I certainly wasnt traumatised by it.

I'm sure it was unpleasant for the baby but so is birth and she won't be scarred by either. It could have shown up meningitis.

My baby had one too at about 2 weeks old :(. It's horrible to watch your baby/child in pain and you feel as mummy you should not have put them through that. However the staff must have felt it was necessary and thankfully she was OK. You did the right thing for your baby as horrible as it was at the time. Thankfully all was clear , but let's say it wasn't and you decided not to go for the procedure and she came seriously ill. These checks can be life saving