Nobody is allowed to choose not to work. Fed up of hearing this expression.

[girlfriend44]

I keep hearing people say people who choose not to work. Target them.
Nobody is allowed to choose not to work. I wonder if some people actually know what they are talking about?

Nobody is allowed to just lounge around and not look for work.

Able bodied people on UC who don't have a paid job are harassed all the time.
They will probably be attending interviews at the jobcentre once a week, where they have to provide evidence they are jobsearching 35 hours a week.

They can be sanctioned over any little thing.
They have to attend any courses they are sent on, even if they are useless courses. Non attendance will end in a sanction.

The staff can arrange interviews on their behalf if the employer has a tie up with the jobcentre which some do.
If it's deemed you didn't try hard enough at the interview, the employer can discuss this with the staff,and you'll be hauled up and sanctioned for not trying.

Those who think people choose not to work please be educated.
It's a hostile environment for anyone out of work.
Not every able bodied person can find employment.
Your not just allowed to sit at home and choose not to work though.

You'll have a claimant commitment and you have to provide evidence of jobsearching. 35 hours too.

I think alot of people who comment don't really know. Everyone is under pressure.
The days of just signing on once a fortnight and not having to.prove your doing everything you can have long gone.

Agreed. There are so many sites etc that detail what you need to say to be awarded pip etc.
Hardly a good system when there are cheat sheets to be awarded.

Amen

If the government is going to spend (our) money on either public sector salaries or benefits, I'd rather they gave more to the actual working employees yes

I live somewhere with seasonal work, they can literally just walk into these jobs and some of them have before. They just have to email and ask when they can start. Some of them have said they don't want to work there this summer but if they don't find anything else, tough, they'll have to.

My siblings choose not to work, they havent done so for over 20 years. They sabotage all interviews, so they are never offered a job. They love being on benefits, as they are exempt from council tax and claim dla for a minor disability. They openly brag about it, and say they feel sorry for me working! I am not kidding! There are people out there that enjoy benefits as a lifestyle. Disability can be a big additional income, there is NO incentive for them to work!

and frequently (not always) also supported by benefits.

Precisely. Really, why would people slave away at a job that barely pays the bills if they can do better being on benefits? Folks say that work is fulfilling etc...some work is fulfilling, but there are jobs that are just unrelenting, repetitive, dull, and physically arduous. Stacking boxes, checkout work, cleaning houses comes to mind. Those who get by without work and say people are mugs for doing it kind of have a point. People are more than tax payers, work slaves and/or consumers, much as governments wish they weren't. Most governments wants as much tax revenue as possible, for women to reproduce to produce more workers for tax revenue, for the citizens to be obedient and do as they are told, and for the elite to enrich itself at most people's expense. Some are more overt about it than others.

A consumerist social hierarchy is promoted so people compete for better houses, status symbols, etc. It is risible. People will work all hours for a designer bag with a label, or a house in a certain neighbourhood, or a certain car. And then advertise it on social media. What a trap. Even education which is supposed to be about self development is all now about employability to make as much money as possible to have these status symbols.

I retired early as soon as I could. I'm precisely that type of person in their 50s that the government is trying to encourage to go back to work to plug a skills shortage, or I suppose they want me to volunteer my time. Nope. I have enough money, don't take benefits, and happy enough to have my time to myself and enjoy life, far from the madding crowd.

I think the anger against those on benefits is because people know the above deep down, and they don't like the fact some folks figured out how to escape.

so seasonal - not year round. Minimum wage, 0 hour contracts, by any chance? So no actual guarentee of work?

please report them! you can do it anonymously

Sites that people on MN seem perfectly aware of when someone asks for help with their PIP application but conveniently forget the exist of when someone says there might be people taking the piss...?

In the transition from feudalism to capitalism, if you were found not working you could get tied to a cartwheel and whipped. Seems harsh really, having been kicked off the land and had your ability to house and feed yourself removed and then forced to sell your labour.

Now, the descendents of those forced into selling their labour see it as the natural order and some wouldn't be averse to bringing the practice back.

op - How can anyone be proactively looking for work for 35 hours a week? That seems completely bonkers. Even someone relatively looking for work will only depend an
hour a day surely checking for new roles listed, interviewing etc. no one can make looking for a job a full time job.

It's called benefit fraud and it's a HUGE problem.

I know someone who hasn't worked for over a decade. Had a business that failed and just decided he couldn't be bothered.

Has been on UC for ages and is now early 60s. He did go to the Job Centre once a fortnight and was given jobs to apply for, applied for one perhaps two I think, but that's it. Won't apply for many as he doesn't want them. Rents privately,whinges about money a lot.

@9fthighfence I totally agree with the you re the lady who was raging-

MIL chooses not to work and hasn’t for the past 10 years.

She gets PIP for anxiety and mental health problems. She is perfectly able to work (or was when she stopped, maybe not so much now but she’s still only 60)

@Patterncarmen I definitely agree that we need to work on entry level jobs so that have a purpose or a progress trajectory or people can see what else they can go into.

But I pity people who choose not to work because they have no pride in providing for themselves and their families + they've never found something that they love to do that they also get paid for. Everyone should have the chance of that.

A lifetime of filling out paperwork and attending pointless appointments to jump through hoops and tick boxes for a very small amount of money to scrimp by sounds depressing. People starting out in low paid jobs progress if they want to so are in a much better position further down the line.

I don't see it as beating the system at all, I see it as settling for the bare minimum. I have a friend who I consider beating the system who only works a few hours a week in a public sector job because his investments pay him enough to live on. There are things like that that are definitely beating the system, benefits isn't one of them.

While I agree with almost everything you've said, I do think people fail to see that they can gain a level of satisfaction and mental wellbeing from doing jobs that aren't necessarily dynamic or glamorous. Not everyone is going to be capable of getting a fabulous, exciting and highly paid job but too many people seem to think that's a good enough reason to opt out of life and not bother with anything at all.

You absolutely can feel better about yourself and your life by doing fairly humdrum jobs and doing them well and with a smile. It gets you out of the house, it gets you socialising and contributing to society, if it involves moving around or being on your feet all day then yes it's tiring, but you'll lose weight and stay more mobile and you'll sleep far better after a day's honest work than you will after a day slumped on the sofa in your PJs watching shite on telly and feeling a bit more anxious and useless than you did the day before, filling the massive void in your life with junk food or cannabis.

The trouble is, we've enabled this warped mindset of entitlement and infantilisation, mixed with fear and helplessness for so long it's almost impossible to turn the container ship around in time to avert a massive existential crisis for our country as we know it.

I know people who worked their ass off when they lost their job and were absolutely hounded by the Job Centre. Told they needed to apply for supermarket work etc, which they were wildly overqualified for. Should they take a NMW job would lose their modest house as their income would barely cover mortgage and bills with a newborn.

Then there's the benefit fraud lifers who haven't worked in years, claim carers allowance for people who definitely don't need care, and live a comfortable life with ease.

System is messed up

Easily, if you are motivated. Applying for a job probably takes half a day if you fill in the questionnaires carefully etc. Then preparing for an interview can take a few hours, then if there are second interviews, they require prep.

Why are you putting all this negativity on a student summer job? These are perfect jobs for my kids over the summer. Would you put all this negativity on your kids getting these jobs? That they might as well stay in bed? Actually, if you are claiming benefits yourselves I could see how a student summer job might mess things up for you and not be worth working. I'm not claiming any benefits though and my kids absolutely will be 100% getting up off their backsides and getting a job in the summer whether they like it or not. Your kids can just stay in bed if they want, not my business.

The majority of my family- 5 uncles, my dad, numerous cousins- have all chosen not to work.
It is absolutely possible.

@LifeIsBadEnoughAlreadyWithoutThis why are you saying it’s you fucked though- I’m truly sorry things are really shitty for you but if you are that ill - and you say terminal- then you won’t be affected , so I dont understand your outpouring of rage .

Could you share the statistics on this?

Which people all over the world manage to do while holding down full time jobs. How do you think people change jobs?