Lots of Landlords are selling up!!

[PassingStranger]

Where is everyone going to live who can't afford to buy?

Alot of landlords are selling. Can't be bothered with all the hassle now.
People aren't paying rent and also trashing houses when they do and costing the owners lots of money to put things right.
On TikTok people are being told to trash houses. [Society gone downhill]

I know there are good tenants, but there are alot of bad ones. Family member works for estate agent and says there are more bad tenants than landlords.

You can trash a house and walk away. Nobody ever gets done for criminal damage on private rents.
There is no register of bad tenants legally allowed either. It's all left to the landlord to sort out at their expense.

Where is all the housing going to come from?
The government donthave enough.
People who are trashing houses and not paying rent are actually spoiling it for everyone..
Alot of lls are selling up now.

We had similiar with my late aunts rental....A young couple with kids signed the contract, within days had sublet to heroin and crack dealers, house in a posh suburb...neighbours rang me constantly, police at house all the time etc...luckily we had rent insurance and eviction costs covered, took 6 months to get them out...they destroyed everything in the house...smashed up bathroom and kitchen..poured acid on carpets...cost was over 18k...worse was the walls...covered in blood where they missed a vein while shooting up !

and you were leading with your pre formed biases

No they will sell and gain the increase of the value market.

I know. That’s why I said it was 26 years ago.

Surely if there are more houses on the market the prices will drop and houses will become more affordable and more people will be able to buy their own homes?

OK, let’s discuss this, logically.

UK housing ‘starts’ i.e. houses being built, fell to their lowest level in six months - put simply, we are not building enough homes.

Secondly, one could argue that we are building the wrong type of homes, given demographic changes with people living solo and having less children etc.

Thirdly, net migration for the year to June last year was +728k people.

Fourth, borrowing costs - a 500k property with a 2% mortgage is going to be ‘cheaper’ than one with a 5% mortgage.

Fifth, the general COL increase impacting peoples ability to buy a house, service a mortgage.

Sixth, job security impacting peoples ability/willingness to take on a mortgage.

I could go on, but you get the point - its not simple S&D.

I’m a private ll and I’ve never had what I call a ‘bad tenant’, but at change over of tenants, the majority of tenants return the property a little dirty and with damage that has not been reported (not fair wear and tear).
Every tenant has lied to me even those I consider ‘good’ tenants (lied about damage, having pets, who is living in the property the most common reasons) and none are willing to take responsibility.
even with ‘good’ tenants the costs of a new tenant moving in includes £400 reference/finder fee, ~ £2k repairs, cleaning, decorating and new carpets.
if we have to put in a new kitchen £5-6k, new bathroom £3k.
So at the moment I can nearly earn the same money in a interest savings account with no risk rather than staying as a landlord, BUT interest rates go up and down SO I will remain ll as on balance it works for me BUT the renters reform bill is requiring me to put more money aside (less profit) if I need to evict a tenant. Additionally, I now have to take out insurance for my ‘riskier’ tenants….. which means……. Rents will have to go up to cover the extra costs. Thank the labour government for this. Don’t blame the ll. I don’t offer housing as a charity I have to make profit as my income and to make repairs to the houses.

Honestly disgusted by some of the underlying assumptions in this thread that people who can’t afford to rent are irresponsible and simply don’t care about something they don’t own. Almost everyone in thread is a LL. I can honestly say my experience of renting (whilst saving up to buy) I’ve had all sorts of LL. Some who have been considerate enough to see their asset is so my home (even if not forever) and asked for input on repairs and upgrades, maintained a friendly but not intrusive manner to inquire about maintenance (eg one who annually painted the property to freshen it up) and others who honestly couldn’t care less so long as you pay their mortgage and make them a tidy little profit / the property value increases. In the latter case failure to call out an emergency engine during covid to fix a broken boiler, failure to fix rusty broken nails in floorboards (despite a baby living there and learning to crawl) threatening us (her tenants ) when we got a quote and offered to fix it ourselves and fining us for repairing shutters in master bedroom without permission. Another tried to take deposit to repair a persistent plumbing issue which (after brining in my own plumber ) I was able to show was a design flaw and which their son (a friend of mine) had complained about when he lived there before me. A lot of the time owners have rose tinted spectacles on from decorating a flat and can’t see it’s been lived in not damaged. And even then accidents happen and that is what insurance is for. Sure there are bad tenants but I would wager there are many more bad landlords. I would recommend to check your prejudices before becoming a landlord as we don’t need more unscrupulous property owners collecting properties, pushing up prices and then complaining about their tushs when they are actively accumulating at the expense of their tenants.

in Scotland we have an independent arbitrator who holds deposits to ensure fairness in deposit conclusions (thank goodness or I would have been in no position to challenge these landlords above). If you look at Airbnb data and local housing data for Edinburgh (where I live) the accumulation of multiple properties as investments to benefit those individual owners has had a disasterous effect upon local housing data- pricing entire sectors out of the reach of many local people.

Interesting comment about referencing. New tenants often say they have not rented before and are staying with ‘aunt, mum, dad’ etc to avoid the bad reference. Also agents representing landlords will often only give a reference of late rent payments but not on the deposit withholding due to damage. As the tenant is still in the property and they don’t want to piss the tenant off. They just want them gone and technically they have not made a deposit withholding until after they leave.

The previous government came to the conclusion that the only way to build enough housing was to draw in institutional investors such as the pension funds that require long term cash returns.

The pension funds refused to invest on the basis that they 'couldn't compete' with small scale private landlords - i.e. private landlords would always accept lower rents to ensure their properties weren't vacant.

Government policy is now forcing private landlords out of the market to clear the way for the pension funds to build and make profits.

Rents are going to go up.
Background checks will become stricter.
Non-payment of rent will result in corporate law departments jumping into action and evicting tenants.

If you don't have a household income over £60k I think you'll start to find it impossible to rent in London.

My wife owns a 2 bedroom flat in Zone 2 London. We rent it out as a 1 bedroom flat for slightly under market rent. The past two times we've advertised it for rent, we've had to remove the advert within 24 hours due to the avalanche of applications. We created a spreadsheet to filter out the best applicants:

* Full-time job on PAYE.
* Joint income over £60k.
* No pets.
* No kids.
* No DSS

That filtering reduced it down to 6-8 applicants for viewings.

We then went with our gut and probing questions to choose our potential tenants. Anybody that seemed like they might be a pain in the arse or flakey was dropped. Finally credit and background checks to make sure they could afford the rent.

If you're anything less than a perfect applicant, you're going to be in a lot of trouble.

in Scotland we have an independent arbitrator who holds deposits to ensure fairness in deposit conclusions

Thanks for that @Loulouboho I needed a good laugh this morning.

Sounds similar to me @Another2356 I don't have a horror story to tell but landlords expectations of tenants are now so low that what are really 'bad' tenants are considered 'good'.
As I've said, I've had some great ones. I once turned up at the flat to do a check out and to do a deep clean for the next tenancy. There was nothing to do. They had left it spotless. I was astonished. They'd been good tenants in fairness but as I say expectations are low these days.

Landlord references are pretty worthless @Twiglets1
Landlords give tenants good references just to get them gone.
It's pretty clear why you shouldn't do this but you can also see why landlords do it.
I think deposits need to be much higher and the deposit companies need a massive overhaul but that won't happen as part of the reason for setting up the scheme was to make being a landlord less attractive. They are heavily biased towards the tenant.

I have to deal with a lot of LL's for work and they are a mixed bunch, I work at the higher end so I don't really see the cheapest part of the market.
However, the ones who own just 1 or 2 properties and manage it themselves tend to be the easiest, they are the most responsive to issues and are more personally invested in the property.
The ones who have a larger portfolio and bought the properties purely for commercial reasons rather than inherited it or used to live there or similar can be more difficult, much more cut throat and use Agents, adding an additional layer.
Its the latter who will be hanging onto their properties not the former and I know who I would rather rent from.

That may be so but what does it suggest when tenants cannot provide a LL reference at all despite it normally being as you suggest, pretty easy to get one.

The post I was replying to was about tenants who trash the place before moving out so they have already left the property hence no need for the LL to write them a reference just to get rid of them.

In what circumstance would they not be able to get one that they couldn't explain and back up and would give the landlord cause for concern?

I rent out one property to a family member, i charge a rent around 200 less than market and make a decent enough profit, she wins i win... but no way would i ever borrow over 25 years to do this.

Now the rub is... if Labour introduce higher EPC standards, i wont be able to help out this person, its a EPC D at the moment, its warm and cosy and bills are reasonable & she is very happy.. but to get it up to a C and with the changes in how this is calculated, i would need a Heat Pump and wall & floor insulation, its around 15 to 20 k.
She also used to live in a property with an ASHP, electricity bill was high plus it made a low level hum, which was annoying.

I cannot afford all of this with a significant rent rise, probably an extra £300pm, its a worry for us both, as she cannot afford that, so the alternative is i sell and she is homeless, thanks Labour!!

There is also talk of tenants being able to demand a new kitchen and bathroom, if their existing one is old/tired.
Fair enough if falling to bits but just because its not fashionable?

There is also supposed to be grants for LLs but who is going to pay for this? the country has no money.

Like the circumstances listed previously on this thread where tenants smeared excrement on the walls or poured concrete into the loo. If they behave like that then presumably they haven't rented anywhere where they behaved like good tenants.

If they are beyond their 20s then I think a new LL would want to know where they have been living and why they can't provide a reference. I guess they could lie and say they have never rented but if I was a LL I would prefer someone with a track record of renting and able to provide a reference.

You've hit the nail on the head @Twiglets1 They lie.
References only help build a picture of a tenant. They help but there are no guarantees. They can't predict future behaviour unfortunately.

He should rent a room out on a lodger contract so easy to get rid and he can corn and go from there house as he pleases to keep checks on it

That’s the principle of business isn’t it?

Do you expect Tesco to sell you food at a loss? Or Zara to sell you clothes at a loss. Or ‘pick a car manufacturer’ at a loss?

We are a democratic country. Why when it comes to housing we turn into the socialist republic state of the UK?

I have had tenants who expect full service down to an electrician to replace a light bulb. Some people aren’t ready for the responsibility of homeownership even if they could afford to buy.

The must buy and own is a Thatcherite dream (do all your labour luvvies not know recent history?). It was to turn more of the electorate into voting Tory.

when I grew up in the 70’s/80’s even two income families rented and didn’t own their own home. Getting mortgages was difficult and you needed a high deposit.

Landlords are presented as the cause of the housing crisis. We aren’t.

1. cheap credit and relaxation of lending rules allowed people to borrow more and more- went from 2.5x single income in the 80’s to 5x joint in the noughties- 2 decades ( never mind women now being able to buy…)
2. sell off of council housing. No justification at all why a tenant who had paid cheap discounted rent for 10-20 years should then be able to buy the same property for 60% discount
3. govt decision not to replace that same housing stock
4. inequitable land stocking by housing developers- who fund political parties and scam the system in their favour
5. inequitable power which means local councils can’t afford to fight to enforce affordable housing provisions in planning consents with the same scamming developers
6. A rigged financial system that allowed wide boys in the city to bring the global banking system to its knees and pathetic political leaders who bailed out the shareholders rather than letting them go under then buy and invest the next day. To huge cost to us all with the country in huge debt and weak economy to the point salary growth has stalled for almost 2 decades
7. I am sure there are more

But no its private landlords owning 1-3 flats who are to blame. And they can’t even offset a legitimate business expense such as borrowing costs or furnishings.

Also @Twiglets1 some landlords make it difficult for others. I was on another site once having a moan about being a landlord!
One guy was telling about his tenants who had moved out, left it filthy, caused non wear-and-tear damage had kept a motorbike in the lounge, which he'd seen during an inspection, leaving oil stains on the carpet...
He said he returned their full deposit? Why? Just why? It gives the message that this is what landlords should put up with and they should absolutely not.

This x 1000

Plus how convenient for the government to have brought in these new rules for landlords which mean many small landlords are dropping out, only to have the properties bought up by huge companies. I wonder who that benefits?

We are finding much of the new housing being built locally is being snapped up by landlords. By which I mean buying multiple units from the developer, no doubt at a discount not available to private buyers.

I do believe developers should be limited in the number of properties on an estate which can be sold to landlords, so that there is availability of housing to buy.

There also needs to be a review of affordability tests for people seeking a mortgage. Many people are actually paying more in rent than they are deemed to be able to afford when applying for a mortgage.

@jasflowers it’s for new tenancies, not existing (from what I understand).

How would a developer know if a landlord is buying a house?