Are there any parents out there who support smartphones in schools?

[LadyJos]

Just curious as all the dialogue out there seems to be about banning them.

I think Apple are pretty smart and would have banned them by now if they were dangerous

This has got to be a wind-up 😂

How did kids used to be able to cope without them tho?

Dealing with all those things you mentioned helped previous generations build resilience and self reliance.

The fact that they can't contact you at any point is part of growing up and learning to cope.

I feel sorry for kids these days, they've less chance of learning these lessons now. Which I honestly believe leads to worse mental health outcomes than ever.

Use phones that have useful apps that can't access porn, strangers, and people urging you to kill yourself.

That's basically the ethos behind "banning" smartphones, but of course all the people who don't understand the effects of unbridled internet use on children can't comprehend that, so it's all "they want to ban work and fun and safety and I know at least 18 kids that turned out fine so that's statistics for you"

I completely agree that the idea that children need to be able to contact a parent at all times is very damaging to their independence and confidence. Children and young people need to learn to cope by themselves, that means having experience of resolving minor problems by seeking help from school staff and strangers . I know 18 year olds who are scared to walk to town without mum, or who storm out of class when their behaviour is challenged to ring their mum, and expect their mum to tell the staff off!

I agree with the ban. Lots of new evidence is coming out about how smartphones, excessive screen use can be to developing brains. They are literally addictive. Apple etc are not going to stop making them because that's been proven - they were deliberately designed that way. Making independence for teens dependent on using a smartphone for school life and bus passes etc is a huge mistake.

Watch the video posted above, Jonathan Haidt's book The Anxious Generation is a good one, Google smartphone free childhood.

I think off and in bag is fine.

I think they should not be allowed in breaks/lunch as it stops the students developing real life communication and supports bullying.

Use in lessons when permitted.

But so many pupils don't follow the rules and are then supported by parents in this, I can see why schools have gone for complete bans.

No, I just think that obviously there are a lot of people working there, a lot of really smart people, a lot of people in the world have one. Like cigarettes etc this would surely have been flagged and raised ages ago if it was actually dangerous. Sorry. Maybe I'm missing something.

It's very naive to think that Apple wouldn't make iPhones if they were bad for us. We don't really know how smartphones affect us. There's certainly been a decline in mental health since they were commonly used.

I would like a phone that will send messages, have music, satnav and take photos but nothing more. Unfortunately that doesn't seem to exist. I tried an old school dumbphone for my daughter but they are not easy to use - texting is very clunky.

I would support a ban in school - handing them in on arrival would be ideal. My kids use ipads at school so they can take photos/ access resources etc but school can disable certain features. Children contacting parents via phones to sort out their problems for them is not doing them any favours in the long run.

Its a no from me.

I mean we have plenty of things that are made and sold that are not good for us, and are actively harmful, so the 'if they were bad for us they wouldn't be allowed to be made/sold' seems like a very naive argument.

It is fine to have a little scroll for downtime. But for most of us adults we know that it's not a little scroll, that many of us spend hours on it, and it is not good for us, and it is not good for them. It isn't just about the physical world, children should get bored, they need to get bored. It is fine if they are not occupied every single waking hour. This is how our imagination develops.

Also, a smartphone by itself is not a problem. It is how much unlimited usage a child has on it. You can closely monitor your child's use and have a number of safeguards.

And @LadyJos here is the material on tech pioneers, Silicon Valley and phone usage:
https://www.brightcanary.io/tech-ceos-screen-time-for-kids/#:~:text=In%20fact%2C%20a%20survey%20conducted,police%20their%20children's%20screen%20time.

https://daddysdigest.com/silicon-valley-billionaires-say-no-to-screen-time-for-kids/

And a longer deep dive by the New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/26/style/phones-children-silicon-valley.html

And more on this:

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/may/23/screen-time-v-play-time-what-tech-leaders-wont-let-their-own-kids-do

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-us-canada-48533999

This a PDF version of the NYT article: https://www.casaverams.com/public/articles/stories/Valley-converted.pdf

When I was in school, we’d sneak into the ICT suite and email home to ask for lunch to be brought in or tell our mums who was going to whose house after school.

I wouldn’t put my child in any other situation with unknown adults and peers without any means of communication, and school is no different.

I don’t believe in forcing independence but in building confidence until children become independent on their own. I am very independent and resilient due to abuse as a child, but that obviously doesn’t mean it’s what I want for my children. I’d rather they learn those skills in their own time and with my support- and it works for us.

Yes I think children should have graduated access to smartphones so they can learn to handle them, just the same approach as I think they need with money so they learn to budget etc responsibly. I'm a former teacher and I vehemently oppose a blanket ban, it's not going to stand them in good stead as adults if they first get access to a smartphone at an age when there's no one to say "put it away now and listen".

There are a number of smartwatch options now for kids at differing price points which are standalone (so have their own sim and no need for a phone. Most of them have phone calls and GPS tracker. Some others have additional features too. But no social media or media text messaging (ie. Dick pics/ WhatsApp.)

No, I just think that obviously there are a lot of people working there, a lot of really smart people, a lot of people in the world have one. Like cigarettes etc this would surely have been flagged and raised ages ago if it was actually dangerous. Sorry. Maybe I'm missing something.

@LadyJos , it's pretty well documented via interviews with Steve Jobs, Bill Gates, heavily restricting their children's access to the technology they created. You sound very trusting of big business but unfortunately they do not have your kids' interests at heart. They want to make money from them and if you think, the phone companies get huge amounts of information about your children, what they watch, what they buy, and they use that to market products to them. This includes deliberately addictive strategies (they have employed psychologists to help make phones and apps as addictive as possible) to make more money. All at the expense of your kids' mental heath.

Very akin to your example of tobacco. The tobacco companies knew that cigarettes were harmful and trying to cover this up long before bans came into place. They even used similar strategies of how to market to kids to get them hooked on brands early, using playful jingles etc. All this info is out there. Also about food companies too.

Big business wants money. Not heathy children.

There are phones out there, like The Balance Phone. Also you can use apps that block access to all but the useful apps you mention - like BePresent

Switched off and in the bottom of bag or kept in locker.
Which is pretty much the rules for most workplaces (unless you have an official work phone).
If caught using it on school grounds during the school day without permission then a punishment system can be in place which starts low but moves up if a repeat offender.
For example -
Warning
Confiscated until end of the lesson
Confiscated until the end of the day
Confiscated and parents have to come and collect it
Suspension
and so on.

The issue I can see is that too many parents will argue that rules in school should have exceptions that apply to their child. Far beyond the example of someone with special needs whose support is limited and/or inadequate.

Probably some of those who think it's OK to park across a drive of a house near to a school.

I was happy for my DD to have a smartphone and take it to school. Her school quite often got the kids to use their phones during lessons.
This is fine if you have a well behaved and mostly compliant student cohort.
I can see why schools would benefit from a blanket ban. I'd imagine these devices cause a lot of mischief and disruption.
In fairness we all managed well enough before smart phones were commonplace.

My son has a phone for his glucose monitor. It has "medical device" plastered all over it, he knows it is only for monitoring his levels and it is given to the teacher and kept on the teachers desks at all times.
I certainly wouldn't like his medical condition to be used as a reason why other children could use phones - I realise that's not what you're saying.

Phones off and in bags are absolutely fine. I wouldn't allow them at all through the school day. Our kids' school has that rule and I think it's fair.

I don't object to a total ban but that means schools will have to step up the communication. Often kids are told after school clubs are cancelled when they get there, meaning someone has to contact parents, and that's 40 kids in reception asking for help if they don't have phones with them.

We didn't have phones growing up but we also had payphones around for emergencies.

I have genuinely had a bit of a skim of some of these. It's really interesting but I'm just not sure I'm massively convinced. There's so much good that phones do (like the glucose monitor mentioned on this thread) and it's so good for my kids in feeling connected to their friends. Positives and negatives maybe?

Why do they need to feel connected to their friends IN SCHOOL via a smartphone??

I'm all for that connection outside of school, but this isn't an argument for phones in school as far as I can see.
And if your child doesn't have friends in their school, then this is an issue to be addressed separately

But how did we all manage before smartphones? We still had friends, we still had medical support. We also had, as a society, much more robust mental health.

Sure, you say a smartphone can be fun for scrolling through TikTok - is that really worth all the risks?

They're not always in the same class as their friends. My daughter doesn't have her main subjects with her best friend and the smartphone is the one thing that makes her feel secure and connected during that time,