To think we need to prioritise defence/Ukraine spending?

[Wildflowers99]

I’ll admit I had no idea how depleted our military has become until a few weeks ago. I was absolutely staggered to read we now spend more on PIP and DLA than our entire military.

I feel like slowly all of our public spending has been funnelled into health, benefits and social care, leaving everything else in a very poor state. Any time anyone has suggested spending money on anything apart from ‘freezing pensioners, the homeless or disabled’ they get shouted down (I am disabled btw, so I do understand the need).

AIBU to think we need to urgently address our spending priorities and as a nation wake up to the fact we’ve been overspending on the above for too long?

There's a huge difference between people with serious, life limiting or terminal illness and someone with anxiety getting PIP/DLA.

Yes I know mental health is a serious issue but anxiety can be treated, fund therapy and whatever else people need to get their lives back together. It's cheaper and ultimately better for people to recover and be in work.

Some people can't use buses due to trauma too. Or ND/sensory issues.
Parents of ND kids use DLA to get taxis so their kids can actually get to school. They are not phobic, they simply can not cope with buses.

A matter for the individual. I feel it’s turning into a soft form of societal blackmail - ‘pay for every aspect of my life or I will cost you even more’. It cannot continue. The very notion of mental health taxis would’ve seemed ridiculous only 20 years ago, like a Daily Mail headline.

No one said anxiety. Why do people assume it is always anxiety? I have an anxiety disorder, but it is not my primary diagnosis.

But then they will have a diagnosis of ASD and the anxiety related to that condition..

It is not blackmail, it is putting people that are disabled by their MH on an even keel with people who are of able body/mind. That is what PIP is for... to put them on a level playing field.
If you take away my "mental health taxis", then I can't go to appointments, my support groups, things like out of town shops, the vets for my dog etc.
Taking that away will not improve your own lot in life.

They can get DLA without a diagnosis. It is awarded based on needs, not what your diagnosis is.

But very few people would describe themselves as ‘able of body/mind’, that’s the issue. Basically everyone has shit MH on some level. Virtually everyone I know is on SSRIs, has ‘bad patches’ or has some kind of diagnosis. We all just have to cobble it together and keep going. If every person downed tools and declared themselves unfit for work, and in need of PIP, we would be in big trouble.

And some people have more severe MH issues, which I do.
I am not in the "mild anxiety/depression" group, and we need to stop this misconception that anyone on UC/PIP is in that group. They are not.
My own MH team, GP, and the DWP assessed me as not fit to work. I didn't even have much input as my CPN filled in the forms.

MH is all based on self reporting. If I told my GP I was depressed and/or suicidal; how do they disprove that? They can’t. The sharp uptick in claims has mostly been down to MH conditions. This is why people are becoming increasingly frustrated.

I have spent too much of my adult life in hospital, and was observed. Or are you saying I was putting it on to get my benefits? My CPN filled in all the forms I have needed for benefits. I don't even know what was put on on them, as they considered it a risk to me to read about myself.

No one gets PIP for telling their GP they are depressed/suicidal. You can't even apply unless you have been affected for 3 months, and it will go on for another 9 months. And you will need evidence of that.

There are plenty of threads on here where people have been awarded PIP under less-than-extreme MH circumstances.

The bottom line is we cannot afford it. I just saw Labour have increased their saving from 3 billion to 5 billion, so I’m guessing they agree.

Good for them. If they get awarded then I hope it helps them.
Whether you think they are worthy or not... that does not matter. I can only hope that you are not ever in the position where you are not looking to claim... or get called a liar for being suicidal.

You’re saying it doesn’t matter because ultimately you don’t provide the money they’re being awarded. Like I said it’s easy to say what you should all be getting when you’re not earning it. Sorry to be brutal but it’s true.

Ideally nobody would cut anything and we could just spend what we wanted, but that’s not real life of course. Unfortunately further borrowing or higher taxes would be like robbing Peter to pay Paul.

I am utterly ashamed to be on benefits. I was brought up with a strong work ethic. So don't give me all that guff about me just putting my hand out with no thought to it.
Wave a magic wand, and make me able to cope with life, let alone a job. Until you can do that, I try and get by the best I can on the little I get. It is not a great life, but I have a roof over my head and food on the table. I know that is better than a lot of other people in the world, but in the UK, that should be the minimum. We look after the vulnerable... but you want the vulnerable to suffer more in the name of a war no one wants.

Raise taxes.

Putin wants it.

We cut it off when we stop disadvantaging people with disabilities (mental, physical or otherwise). When we have proper social structures that support education and vocational training. When we have flexible employers who are open-minded and whom you don't have to fight tooth and nail for every reasonable adjustment. When we make society so that every disabled person can function and compete on the same level as a non-disabled individual, then there will be no need for payments.
Social model of disability is something I would advise you to familiarise yourself with if you really want some tangible ideas about ways to reduce costs of disability.
I am glad your disability costs you £20 a month. For many people it's far from their daily reality. I am currently working with someone who nearly died when their partner (their sole carer) was hospitalized for three weeks leaving them unable to wash, feed themselves and attend to their basic needs. Their PIP was insufficient to cover emergency assistance. They were hospitalised with malnourishment as a result of that costing NHS many thousands in hospital care and follow up. It doesn't save anybody any money to cut support for people with disabilities.

Our society is more disability and ND friendly than it has ever been, and yet we seem to be told it’s going ever further in the opposite direction. I feel like you’re all waiting for a hypothetical society that can never exist, some kind of utopia. Sadly we live in the real world and have to act accordingly. This is not the only area in need of spending. This thread is primarily about Ukraine - which is a much more important issue.

But the OP is suggesting cutting funding for healthcare. Given that there are waiting list of 18+ months already, I doubt access to therapy will be improved if we divert funding from health and social care to buy a few fighter jets for Ukraine.
We may collectively win the war but I highly doubt any of us would find it the life worth living given that we already struggle to get access to the most basic healthcare/dental care.
In fact the OP may welcome Putin's rule over the UK. Russians are not known for their generous social security payments. Plus, I believe, the retirement age is still set at 50. What's not to like, eh?

I abhor Putin and the war is a huge concern to me which is why I feel we should be doing more.

Saying wishy washy things about ‘not wanting war’ to dodge the very obvious issue of our defence spending is just maddeningly immature.

Climate change spending, it's ridiculous, get rid IMO

You still haven't come up with a definitive figure that you think will be required to end this war.

You haven’t come up with a definitive figure which you think is reasonable for total welfare spending?