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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Or do we need new divorce laws

121 replies

Justforthisparticularrant · 26/02/2025 09:37

So I’ve been married for 16 years. Good stable career, pension for 30 years. DH has been self employed. He’s started around five different ventures, always promising he’d need to put work in up front for no or little financial gain. He does so much then it’s onto the new project. He’s not lazy but ineffective in what he does. The promises of his various ventures making money never materialised. He won’t take advice or direction. He’s now doing ok but only in the last five months or so.

My stable income paid the mortgage for a decade and other big costs for our entire marriage. It allowed him the freedom to try out these projects, fail, yet still live a secure comfortable life and raise DC.

Meanwhile, I have battled for the full 16 years for him to take on the domestic load in an equitable way. He’s always done childcare equally and cooking/washing up and laundry has been fairly equal. But everything else has been 90%me for the bulk of our marriage. It’s only the last couple of years it’s been equitable but I’ve had to really campaign and educate him to get there.

But generally speaking, with a bit of nuance, I have been both main breadwinner and main housekeeper with him ‘helping’ around the house rather than taking any initiative and in reality he made it harder for most of those years - creating mess and chaos, ruining things by not looking after them, avoiding planning, sand bagging my attempts to do my best to sort things out and organise them.

It’s improved - but me fighting for fairness in domestic tasks has caused arguments and he’s not happy about it. He martyrs himself a lot - ‘all this work I do…’ etc. He was only working two/three days about four years ago so I pushed him to do more domestic stuff The first couple of weeks of him doing a properly equitable split had him moaning about how exhausted he was, yet six or so years previously when I said the same he minimised it and mocked me given I was only ‘working’ part time at the time. I was actually working 24/7 just lots of it the unseen work of home making etc.

He gets disproportionately angry, verbally abusive and he’s impossible to work with. I’m divorcing him. I’ve had enough and in the last couple of years his behaviour towards the DC has worsened.

I got legal advice and he’s entitled to half my pension. Literally - it will be valued and then half will come out of my pension and a new pension created for him with that in it. ALL of it. Even the 10 years worth from before we met. So despite him not contributing equitably to home making and family raising for the bulk of our time and not being the main breadwinner, he gets half of my entire pension.

I get that this is to protect (largely female) homemakers who work hard at home to support the main breadwinner. But now it’s often women who are the main breadwinners AND the main homemaker.

It just feels so unfair. I’m gutted and feel like this is just another way women get screwed over by the patriarchy.

OP posts:
Justforthisparticularrant · 26/02/2025 18:39

theressomanytinafeysicouldbe · 26/02/2025 11:49

I think I might have got divorced wrong. We divorced due to irreconcilable differences. I worked part time around the 2 kids, I borrowed £12k off my parents and bought him out of the house. I know nothing about pensions but he was older than me and i know he had one 😱. He also had savings, should I have got some of that too? I feel so naive! We divorced 13 years ago.

Sorry, I have nothing to add to your OP but I genuinely didn't know this was a thing, i don't remember my solicitor ever mentioning it

It might be worth you getting legal
advice. It might not be too late depending on the financial settlement. The length of marriage makes a difference.

OP posts:
Justforthisparticularrant · 26/02/2025 19:10

TrainGame · 26/02/2025 13:57

I agree. The jobs that lead nowhere. The disorganisation. The sloppiness.

I was going to suggest it too but thought I’ll be screamed at for blaming a lazy male on ND.

OP have a watch of Roxy and see if anything rings true:

https://m.facebook.com/ADHDlovevids/

Do either of your kids show any difficulties with following verbal instructions, being late, getting organised? I mean that sounds like most kids, but with ADD/ADHD it’s on another level.

Well since I have started to talk about the idea of separation he now is holding down several very well paid jobs and is doing his share of the domestic. It’s been about 4 months and he seems to be doing well. Amazing what the threat of losing your cash cow does to your motivation. He ruins things all the time, doesn’t look after them. Except his expensive hobby stuff he manages to look after very well.

OP posts:
Justforthisparticularrant · 26/02/2025 19:11

justanothercrapbedtime · 26/02/2025 13:31

What's good for the goose is good for the gander and all that. We wanted equality. We got it. Plenty of men have been in your position and have just had to get on with it

FWIW I don't agree in it and I fought to keep my pension out my lazy ex husbands grasp - and ultimately won

How?

OP posts:
bakedFishandChips · 26/02/2025 19:14

The law if fine , why not
It is you who have been actively choosing to live with him even seeing how he is

cadburyegg · 26/02/2025 21:27

*This.

It seems that getting a financial settlement via the court is optional:

Money and property when you divorce or separate: Get the court to decide - GOV.UK

Perhaps you could get divorced but tell your solicitor that you don't want a legal financial settlement, and hope that your STB ex-DH gets a crap solicitor.

However, it seems to say there is no time limit, so he could come back years after the divorce and go for your pension then - you would have the worry hanging over you.*

The financial remedy order and financial disclosure are two different things. You don't have to have either but it's advised to have both.

Financial disclosure is when both parties declare their assets, savings, income, pensions. They are legally obliged to be honest about this. We didn't do this because I knew it wouldn't be in my interests.

You can have a financial remedy order which details how assets will be split. Any ongoing financial ties are detailed in this with the exception of child maintenance which is dealt with by the CMS. So things like spousal maintenance, if one party has to transfer money to the other. We did a clean break which means that if either one of us wins the lottery post divorce (for example) then the other one cannot claim.

So we didn't do the full financial disclosure but we still got a financial remedy order.

Nanny0gg · 27/02/2025 10:32

JHound · 26/02/2025 15:24

It is fair.

If the genders were reversed and everything else about the scenario unchanged the same split would be achieved.

Equality is equality.

Marriage implies two become one unit with equal access to marital assets.

Why do people enter into a marriage contract then complain about the terms of the contract?

Don’t like it don’t marry.

Edited

No, It's fair that if the father is the SAHP and he follows the agreement and picks up the domestic load then he is absolutely equal financially as well

That is not the case here He has reneged on the deal

ThymeScent · 27/02/2025 10:36

My exh took the view that OP had /pointlessly refused to accept the legalities and so we ended up each spending over 200k on legal fees - and the judge awarded me the same my solicitors requested initially.

TrainGame · 27/02/2025 20:18

Justforthisparticularrant · 26/02/2025 19:10

Well since I have started to talk about the idea of separation he now is holding down several very well paid jobs and is doing his share of the domestic. It’s been about 4 months and he seems to be doing well. Amazing what the threat of losing your cash cow does to your motivation. He ruins things all the time, doesn’t look after them. Except his expensive hobby stuff he manages to look after very well.

Ruining things again is very ADHD. Special interests are ring-fenced. Again another marker. Also many can’t seem to motivate themselves without pressure or external threat which is why perhaps suddenly he’s switched on.

Anyway it sounds like you’ve had enough. Completely fair. I know that repetitive poor behaviour can grind a person down. I hope you find peace and happiness on the other side of this.

BattIestar · 27/02/2025 20:22

I have urged my children not to get married. Unless the partner is vastly wealthier than them. I too got royally screwed in my divorce, and I will never recover financially from that at my age. Biggest mistake of my life. Oh, well, and choosing him as the father of my kids too.

Justforthisparticularrant · 27/02/2025 20:40

TrainGame · 27/02/2025 20:18

Ruining things again is very ADHD. Special interests are ring-fenced. Again another marker. Also many can’t seem to motivate themselves without pressure or external threat which is why perhaps suddenly he’s switched on.

Anyway it sounds like you’ve had enough. Completely fair. I know that repetitive poor behaviour can grind a person down. I hope you find peace and happiness on the other side of this.

He might meet criteria but it won’t change him and verbal abuse and disproportionate anger are not tolerable for me and toxic for DC so I have no choice.

OP posts:
Talonz · 27/02/2025 20:45

AnneLovesGilbert · 26/02/2025 10:05

Flogging a dead horse, however optimistically, for 16 years, is why you’re here. He wasn’t going to change. Sorry it sucks.

If the horse has been flogged to death, then it sounds as if the stable income, ie the livery side of the finances, has probably come to an end.

Arrivals4lucky · 27/02/2025 20:50

How little he did or do not so, unfortunately for you, is irrelevant. You married, you had a joint life together, therefore your finances are linked and yes as you separate you have to split everything.

Arrivals4lucky · 27/02/2025 21:21

If you’re suggesting that the laws are changed so that the parent who’s earned less, often because they’re doing the majority or more child care & contributing to the family in other ways, gets screwed financially in a divorce… it’s not going to happen

Rollercoaster1920 · 27/02/2025 23:29

I do think that assets pre marriage should be allowed to be be retained after divorce. Most notably pensions for most people, especially older folks. But could be house ownership, inheritance, shares etc.

Assets built up during marriage should be 50 50.

minipie · 28/02/2025 10:16

Rollercoaster1920 · 27/02/2025 23:29

I do think that assets pre marriage should be allowed to be be retained after divorce. Most notably pensions for most people, especially older folks. But could be house ownership, inheritance, shares etc.

Assets built up during marriage should be 50 50.

I agree in theory but the problem is that pre marriage assets aren’t usually neatly ringfenced off - they get invested and spent during the marriage (eg previous property gets sold to fund a joint one). And if we created a rule like this then people may be more likely to start ringfencing their pre marriage assets and not put them towards joint investments which isn’t very healthy.

TempestTost · 28/02/2025 10:31

That stinks, OP. I agree with others, it's not the law, it's your dh.

There are men who feel the same and sometimes they are also correct, they have been used by their wife as a moneybags. Some people are just exploters and grifters.

The concept though I think is fair, because it acknowledges that in a household, you are partners and the contribution isn't only financial - you build the household together and are responsible for each other when one really can't contribute. The law can't go so far as to define what that looks like, it's up to the spouses.

I do agree a huge reason for the development of these kinds of divorce laws is the fact that women usually were taking on the childcare work, and that is significant and important. Where you have no kids or both partners are working and childcare is paid for, it doesn't make as much sense. But I am not convinced there is a better way to manage it other than maybe not getting married. But that can lead to one person being exploited in other ways.

Worldgonecrazy · 28/02/2025 10:37

UnderHisEeyore · 26/02/2025 10:19

Women always think it will get better and waste more years with manchildren. We need to educate women to get out as soon as it is clear they aren't being supported/ being abused etc.

This. I wish I had learned this earlier. Maybe men would make improvements if we stopped tolerating the bullshit.

OP it does seem unfair that your pension from before you met is part of the settlement. Is it worth proposing that portion is not split and seeing if the judge will accept that? 50/50 is a starting point, not a final position. My pension was not split during my divorce as I was taking on school fees and not asking for maintenance. There may be an alternative option for you too?

ThymeScent · 28/02/2025 12:58

Worldgonecrazy · 28/02/2025 10:37

This. I wish I had learned this earlier. Maybe men would make improvements if we stopped tolerating the bullshit.

OP it does seem unfair that your pension from before you met is part of the settlement. Is it worth proposing that portion is not split and seeing if the judge will accept that? 50/50 is a starting point, not a final position. My pension was not split during my divorce as I was taking on school fees and not asking for maintenance. There may be an alternative option for you too?

If you in front of a judge it will cost ££££ in costs and each side pays their own, so make sure the it is worth it hit the amount you hope to gain from litigation.

FrangipaniBlue · 28/02/2025 13:38

I'm with you OP.

My advice to any young woman would be this:

If you want to be a SAHM or homemaker, get married first.

If you want to have a career and be a main earner, DONT get married at all!

Worldgonecrazy · 28/02/2025 13:58

ThymeScent · 28/02/2025 12:58

If you in front of a judge it will cost ££££ in costs and each side pays their own, so make sure the it is worth it hit the amount you hope to gain from litigation.

It is not necessary to sit in front of a judge. If you can agree the financial split, and provide evidence why you believed it to be fair to both parties, the judge signs it off without requiring either party to attend the court. It is not expensive either, though you do need a legally qualified person to submit the documents. I used one of those online companies and it cost a few hundred, not £££££s.

ThymeScent · 28/02/2025 14:46

Worldgonecrazy · 28/02/2025 13:58

It is not necessary to sit in front of a judge. If you can agree the financial split, and provide evidence why you believed it to be fair to both parties, the judge signs it off without requiring either party to attend the court. It is not expensive either, though you do need a legally qualified person to submit the documents. I used one of those online companies and it cost a few hundred, not £££££s.

The key words are ‘if you agree’!
My ex didn’t agree with splitting the assets 50/50 and seems like the OP doesn’t either.

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