To put foot down at DH's spendyness and ask how he can afford it?

[gotbillstopay]

Nearly three years ago my husband gave up a job with an £120k a year salary.
At the time I was self employed earning around £30-40k but I didn't work full time. Both our daughters are still young and still at school.
My DH is in IT while I'm a journalist. I simply can't earn £120k a year and I can't transition to PR because I don't have those soft skills. He said he hated his boss and his job had changed which I did get at them time.
We were in our early 50s. So fast forward three years and I've had to take out a £35K loan and I'm roughly in debt with credit cards of 8K.
I'm not struggling to make the repayments that's not the problem because I'm in a staff job which pays around £50k.
My husband is doing further study and when he gave up his job he told me there would be no money worries. He manages an Airbnb that we run in our extension. It's lovely self contained area (I didn't want that to happen but he and his mum my MIL and his sister convinced me) So that makes about £30k a year before tax. He also does some other stuff including driving et cetera. Now the year he gave up his job he booked an exotic rather expensive holiday. I did push back but he paid for it. I had to pay all the spending money which probably have was about £1500. The following year we were talking about getting a campervan but just talking then he got it into his head that he wanted to buy mini bus and convert it. I wasn't convinced either but he just wet and bought an old mini bus for £3K out of our emergency savings and we have been on holiday on it a couple of times. Both times I chipped in with spending money although it has to goon credit.
He seems to be able to afford things but I'm worried about money.
Now my argument is and I'm getting quite annoyed is that I've just had to pay the gas and electricity bill out of some of the loan money which I've kept in an account for emergencies & i'm getting more and more angry and frustrated when my husband says he's going book a holiday to Wales this year and he's gonna go on it anyway. How do I convince my husband that we are a team and that the money that he has spent isn't just his money and the money I spent isn't just my money. I've probably spent thousands of pounds on my children's clothes on clubs including like expensive swimming Piano and tuition. These are things my husband doesn't normally pay for he pays for the mortgage out of the Airbnb money. But the way I see it is that Airbnb money it's a joint family asset. He says it's his salary. And that I need to start paying my share of the mortgage. I do pay all the other bills for example I've just paid £800 quarterly gas and electricity. i've just paid £600 for the water bill. So I am paying for things. I also pay for life insurance and various insurances although he pays for the home contents and buildings insurance and that probably is about £250 a month that covers the mortgage and if we get sick or die. I am paying my share but we keep arguing about this time and time again am I being unreasonable to say that the Airbnb money should be the mortgage money and that that is a joint family asset or is my husband ferreting some money away somewhere because he's always saying he's got no cash.
We did have emergency savings but only he has access to them and every time I ask they appear to dwindling.
What do I do?
I feel he should be paying some more money into a pension.
He's also going on about us moving to France so we can pay off our mortgage even though our children have 6 years of school left and we live in an area with good schools.
I live him but this is affecting all areas of our marriage.

You have to have a complete overhaul of your finances. Everything on the table to the last penny. Then it will very quickly become apparent who pays for what and how much of the "family money" there is to play with.
What's the situation with Airbnb? If it is his property, then I suppose it would be his "salary". If I were to leave/lose my job my Airbnb would be my income and I would be expected to contribute my share out of it. Which is what your husband is doing. That, in itself, is not a problem. The problem is lack of clarity around your monthly expenses and how you run your finances. It appears that he wants to both split it and pool it whichever works best for him in the moment.

First post nails it. Totally unacceptable you've been accruing debt like this OP- time to be really assertive with him!

Separate finances. Split 50/50 the emergency fund. You each get half.

He gets paid an hourly wage for managing the Airbnb (I did and didn't spend more than an hour a day, 3 if I needed to clean).

Everything above the hourly wage gets split 50/50 as it is profit made on a joint asset.

Then all bills split 50/50, the funds put into a joint account each month so DDs can come out.

It will become very clear that he is only working a few hours a week and spending your savings like crazy.

I wouldn't be bailing him out with your half of the emergency savings, I woukd be saving them for a deposit which you will need when you leave him.

It's our property - part of our house. He set the Airbnb business to pay our mortgage.

It all sounds a bit of a mess, although he has done well to get the AirBnB up and running.
Could he expand upon this by taking on the management of another holiday property locally? It could easily become a proper business.

What about a joint account where all bills come from and to which you each contribute a certain amount each month?

Surely you need to be paying equitably into a joint account from which all joint expenses are paid (not on your credit cards). What he spends buying shite from his own personal money that is left over is up to him. If he was paying enough to cover household expenses, it wouldn’t matter what else he was being spendy with. Airbnb needs to be run like a business so there is sufficient cash flow available for maintenance, etc. It needs its own account, which he manages. If he’s the one doing it, yes, he should pay himself for his time, but it’s not his personal spending money. It’s a business.

Household expenses from one pot that you both contribute to , he wants solo holidays etc he pays for them and any purchases outside of bills are agreed by both parties and equally funded - this would be a non negotiable for me but I’ve kept my finances separate from DH since we started to live together.

It all sounds rather chaotic. The easiest thing would be to work out all the regular outgoings for which you should be jointly responsible in a spreadsheet. Open an joint account and transfer all DDs etc to it- the banks can usually do it themselves these days. Then you both pay in by standing order each month to cover it. We do it according to salaries.

He’s not going to be able to ‘move to France’ unless he is an EU citizen. If he isn’t , you will both have to pass some fairly rigorous language and residency conditions ( insurance etc) to live there. Property is cheaper, but only in rural locations, so not too easy to make a living.

He seems to have completely lost any sense of reality, and I’m afraid you are propping him up, which can’t go on for ever.. 💐

In that case it's a profit from a joint asset and I don't see nay other option but to merge your finances. This does, unfortunately mean that you will continue to subsidise your husband as he is currently not earning but it also means that any large purchases which are outside of his personal "allowance" need to be discussed and agreed by both of you.
He is not going to like it, is he?

You need to do a complete financial review. All your incomes, savings, bills and debt on the table. Work out monthly costs, split in half and you each pay into a joint account to cover. Decide on an amount of personal spending money and joint savings - he can spend his without question but bigger spends are a joint decision. I couldn’t be living with £40k+ in debt with no transparency about or access to family savings.

The AirB&B is a family asset, not his personal salary - he could draw an amount for running it but the rest goes into a joint account to cover repairs etc. He’s being an arse - you don’t give up a six figure salary without a clear, jointly agreed plan for your financial future.

The moving to France idea to pay off your mortgage makes absolutely no sense when you have a job, kids in secondary school and an AirB&B to manage. Unless of course he has a job lined up in France that will cover all that and more and will sponsor a work visa.

Sounds more like running away...

Why have you taken out a 35k loan? And 8k on ccs?

Your dc are doing multiple expensive hobbies - it really doesn't sound like the household can afford to live like this so why are you?

Firstly, the part of the house that is used for Airbnb is a joint asset unless he also considers your house to be his house and sees you as one of those Airbnb tenants. Therefore, the money you get from that is not his income. It's a joint income. Based on that "his" half in that is 15k.

If you both accepted that he wouldn't work after he gave up his job, then you both have to live the lifestyle that the lowest paid person in the household can contribute to. In his case, that's based on whatever contribution he can make from "his income" of 15k.

Secondly, this situation requires an open and honest discussion about the state of your finances, the debts etc. Before you go into that discussion, I encourage you to think carefully about what you are prepared to do if he is either unable or unwilling to hear you because you will have to be ready to tell him what the consequences will be if he continues doing what he is doing and you need to be prepared to go through with those consequences.

I don't know how far things have gone and how long this has been going on but as a minimum you should stop going on holidays you can't afford. If he wants to go ahead anyway, let him and see if that might wake him up. I think you also need to split all things 50/50 rather than pay for all bills or take on some other expense in full. This, I hope will make him more aware of the costs of everything. Water, electricity etc are ongoing costs and where insurances are fixed for a year, water and electricity bills aren't and you don't always get to control what they will be. For example, if the weather happens to be particularly cold and you have to turn your heating up, you will be paying more unless you want to sit in the cold and let your kids freeze too. If you are responsible for the kids' hobbies, the piano tutor can also increase prices with inflation whereas insurance costs are quoted for the year in advance and he knows exactly what it is and doesn't have to worry about things like that. He also can't take money from the emergency fund on to spend on something that isn't an emergency. If he wants to continue, you will have to start keeping a separate emergency fund that is just for your emergencies and he will have to keep his own etc. If there are house emergencies or another kind that needs a joint contribution, you will need to discuss that as and when that occurs. You need to separate your finances as much as you can before you get into a deeper and deeper hole.

Has he always been acting like he is now or is this a sudden change?

Is the loan and debt just in your name? What was it for? Is your DH aware? If it was to cover the shortfall in mortgage and bills etc then he really needs to help you with that.

So many problems on Mumsnet stem from seperate finances. You are jointly responsible for raising and financing your family. Your salary, his salary (fair enough to take a salary from the Air BnB but how much time can it possibly take?) and the profits from the Air BNB are all family money. If that isn’t enough to sustain your outgoings - clearly not since you are £40k plus in debt - then he doesn’t have the luxury of pratting about doing a bit of driving, he needs to get some well paid work. What was the plan when he resigned? Surely not to do nothing for several years? You together make sure all the important bills are covered and then if there is money left it’s joint savings and equal personal spends.
As it stands it seems to be YOUR debt propping up the family, HIS savings to spend on his own jolly projects, YOUR hard work bringing in most of the money, HIM laying sole claim to your joint assets. Wise up and read him the riot act!

I've had to take out a £35K loan and I'm roughly in debt with credit cards of 8K.

While you were married? Paying for household stuff? What was this debt for - not actual, was it for household stuff of self??

If its not self, it's a household bill. You're married. This idea of his money and your money, in a divorce court it'd be matrimonial assets.

I agree with pp saying that if he wants to go on holiday - let him. He'll have to pay his own expenses then and you can save money. But I'd worry about his mental state atm, he seems to be spending as though he's loaded but where's it all coming from?

He’s being an arse - you don’t give up a six figure salary without a clear, jointly agreed plan for your financial future.

It's either he is being an arse or I don't know if he just lost it. Six figure jobs usually come with considerable amount of pressure and responsibility, which is why they are paid so well. If he's always been a bit irresponsible with money, that's one thing. However if it's sudden change, I don't know if just cope with the job and now continues to run away from everything.

OP: did you talk about the finances and how you were going to manage without his salary when he said he was going to quit the job? I know you said he told you there would be no money struggles but how was he so sure?

The left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing or has - complete overhaul and transparency of finances and working it all out whst is coming inand going out

For a start stop taking out loans and get the credit cards paid off. I’d be drawing a hard line in the sand on that.

It does sound all a bit chaotic. And no way would I put up with my partner having sole access to joint spending.

I do agree that this should really all have been discussed before he gave his job up. It also sounds as though he’s basically keeping up his own lifestyle without the income to support it (or expecting you to get into horrible levels of debt).

I agree you need to sit down and work out a monthly income/ expenses plan. This should cover current day-to-day costs but also how you plan to cover things in the future, like potentially putting the kids through uni, pensions, new cars etc.

If he’s genuinely not going to go back to a career, just include the Airbnb.

This might land the point to him that there could be difficult decisions ahead, like downsizing the house, limiting extra curricular activities, limited choice of unis (ones where DCs can live at home), working for longer etc.

If you can’t even get him to discuss this I would be setting myself up financially and dividing everything on a 50/50 basis.

Get half the emergency funds out now and put them somewhere DH can't access. Then what others have said, really, complete financial overhaul.

Some of it paid for household renovations - our bathroom was flooding so we paid £2k for that. The first year he gave up his job I took out the loan
My daughters no longer have expensive hobbies.
We set up a Monzo joint account a few months ago - today (after posting this!) I've moved all the joint direct debits to that account

Did you post about this a couple of years ago OP? The Airbnb set up in the house seems familiar. If so he was an idiot then and still remains one.

The first year he gave up his job I took out the loan

@gotbillstopay what did he say about that given that he said there would be no money issues related to his giving up his job?