Employers hell bent on working in the office full time

[NewDayNewLife25]

Anyone else currently job searching and noticed the same thing?

I'm utterly miserable in my current role which is unfortunate as I've been there for 4 years and use to love it, but a new manager has changed things. I've always worked from home.

Anyway, I've been applying for jobs, mainly remote/hybrid working but also a few office based roles. I always state in my cover letter what I'm looking for, and my address is on my CV too.

A few employers have contacted me, saying that I'm perfect for the role, have all the experience/skills that's required and that they think I would make a great addition to the team. But as soon as I've asked about the working set up, that's it, done. They won't entertain it and decline my application.

I just think it's a shame. I know that they probably have plenty of applications, but surely it's more important to hire the right person, with the right skills and experience. Not just because that person happens to live near the office. Half the time they can't even explain why they need the person in the office. Is it control?

I'm fed up already!

I specialise in a niche field and am sometimes approached by recruiters. The first question I ask is what the hybrid working arrangements are. Any more than 3 days in the office I immediately say no. I work that now and it's ok, but ideally I want total wfh. I see absolutely no point in going into an office. I do my job perfectly well at home.

I'm contracted to FT WFH. We are a small operation growing nationally. There is a requirement - to make the organisation viable & effective - for most people to travel quite extensively each month, often involving overnights. This model would have been Impossible for me during the many years I was a lone parent or had very young children. But it works brilliantly for us now. As the company grows, I anticipate operations will become regionalised and conditions might change. But I'm open to that. Different things suit different people. I agree with a previous poster who said that younger people can feel quite isolated WFH. My eldest and my niece both prefer to be in the office. I also agree that the emails you've received - or the example you provided - do sound like phishing emails from agencies. Not saying they are. But I think you should push back if you've got to interview and hybrid is a hard no on your CV/application. It's just such a waste of everyone's time! Good luck in your search.edited because typo

This. If not for these people, employers might be more open to it. I have a friend who is moaning about being forced back into the office... but a few months ago she was openly bragging to me about how little work she had to do when working from home and how she secretly akes time off to go to the gym etc! And then she wonders why her employer is calling them all back to the office...

I'm not saying all do this. But lots do.

I would expect you to ask the question about flexibility of work location towards the end of the interview. By that point, if I think you are a strong candidate, I am more likely to say we can look at options, if the job was not previously advertised as hybrid. If you ask upfront before interview stage for a job advertised as office based, I see someone who hasn't read the role profile properly and if all I have to go on is a CV and them not having read the profile, I am not going to proceed with them.

If you really want a new job, you need to learn to play the game. Get a foot in the door before you start asking a company to fit round you. If they have a pile of CVs to sift and you make yourself difficult, you are not going to make a shortlist.

@FindusMakesPancakes I see what you're saying but on this occasion it wouldn't have a made a difference I don't think. The HR manager invited me for the interview yesterday and when I spoke to him I just asked if he had received my cover letter and was he aware that I was looking for hybrid working. He said he hadn't noticed the letter and unfortunately it was office based full time. So it really would have been a waste of everyone's time having the interview (I also live 45 minutes away from the office so it's petrol costs as well)

@NewDayNewLife25 blimey OP

I saw the length of this thread and decided to only look at your posts. Glad I did as I guess people are being crazy.

People seem to lose their minds over working from home. I don't know why.

I'm freelance and vaguely looking for a permanent role again. It's not hugely important.

My last permanent place, where I mostly worked from home from 2016, has sent two jobs to me, which they said they'd rather not advertise without asking me first. They insisted both jobs had to be full time in the office. They tried to sell it to me by saying that I could work at the one nearest to my home rather than the central London one.

They actually said "it doesn't matter which office you're based in."

If it doesn't matter which office I'm based in why on earth do they need me to go into the office every day?! I would be reporting to someone more senior who goes in about twice a month. She said it's not her decision. She's been told by the powers that be. She was the one who sent me the jobs in the first place. But full-time office based is a "not no but hell no" 😂 - I haven't done it for nearly 10 years now.

I was puzzled why there wasn't more flexibility about this 20 years ago. I'm utterly baffled. I have also worked in places where chatting is discouraged btw.

So you seriously think that young people not leaving home all week, living life on devices and working on computers is great for their mental health?

@jannier ok so maybe not fully remote, but what about hybrid? Best of both worlds?

Exactly

I absolutely can deny that, @CatchThatPigeon. Do not make sweeping generalisations.
I am fairly new to full-time WFH, though not new to the workforce; I am 68 and have worked in my senior public service role for 11 years, following a long career in education. I worked full-time in the office until August last year when our sub-leasing arrangement with another related government service was cancelled, in response to a government edict to cut costs (reducing or eliminating rental costs and slashing staff numbers). For the previous three years I was able to WFH for up to three days a week, but I chose to go to the office five days. So I was not at all happy about having to WFH full-time but it was that or give up my job which I enjoy and am very good at.

Suddenly we had to re-purpose a room in the house to the inconvenience of my retired partner, buy a desk and ergonomic chair, up the internet provision, etc. And who footed the bill for those costs? Not my government employer!
The benefit for me is I no longer have to spend around 2.5 hours a day driving (it was only 30km each way but traffic is horrific), and I save on petrol. But remember, I chose those costs as I liked the office facilities, having access to a printer/heating/cooling, but mainly the physical interaction with people. I am also saving on coffees and cafe lunches, and when I log off for the day I feel much less tired than when I would get home about 7pm.
I choose to start at 7.30 and I usually finish at around 4.30; though this will depend on the fluctuations in workload. Across the week I absolutely work all of my contracted 40 hours. Of course I might unload the dishwasher (I used to do that in the office too!) and of course I will put the odd washing load on. I certainly do not spend more time doing such incidentals as I used to spend enjoying time with colleagues at their desks, in the lunch room or in the nearby cafe. You won't like this @CatchThatPigeon, but I might even take a brief nap to clear my brain but it isn't on my employer's clock, it's on mine.

Isn't it obvious?

I don’t think it is. You don’t need five days in an office to get all the benefits of face to face conversations though.

That would be from an agency I think not the company? Very generic.

Exactly this. It's as if some people think regardless how early someone starts or late they finish, if they have any slack time during office hours it's still 'skiving' if they do anything during that time that isn't work. Very limited/narrow thinking.

Covid has a lot to answer for here; prior to the pandemic it was so much less common to work from home and it’s done no favours. My workplace are full time in the office - we were three days, it’s gradually gone back up. The only people who are irritated are the ones who expect to use their working days for life admin and childcare, or who have made a choice to live a ridiculous distance away.

It’s also crazy in this day and age that employers will limit themselves to who lives near the office building, missing out on talent that live further away. Wouldn’t it help level up more poorer and deprived areas or people who can’t afford homes near London etc.

Do you feel that you are the typical WFH employee?

On the contrary! It brought about long-overdue change in the way we work.

I am FT wfh. I don't require childcare and sometimes I did life admin in the office if I needed to. I haven't moved either since Covid!!

I love love love not having the bloody awful commute every day. I don't think I could go back to that again. Such a waste of time too. I can perform my role perfectly well from home, going to meetings in work locations when I need to. Working from home means much more confidentiality than I ever had in an open-plan office.

I do think there's a disadvantage for young people in not really leaving their homes, plus they don't have the same opportunity to learn from their peers or their elders. Two of my DC have chosen careers where they can't work from home; not sure what path the third is going to take yet, but I think I'd prefer them to be office-based.

I'm old so I'm fine with it! Love it in fact.

Do you feel that she is not?

What is a "typical WFH employee" anyway?

I can tell you, working in the office is no guarantee that an employee is actually working to capacity! I can think of several examples who were always, "flat out", but never really achieved all that much!

I'm sure that's true for some business models. Not all. It's a lot more cost effective for our business to send a couple of colleagues up to Glasgow, across to Cardiff, Down to Bristol or over to Belfast - for example - than it is to have an office in each as well as a London hub. Travelling often does mean unsociable hours. It isn't all about putting a load of washing on while shoving the 3yr old in front of the TV. I did get rid of my cleaner and dog walker recently for asking to go hybrid though!

I'm not surprised to see so many WFH naysayers on here. The UK is after all the country with the insane culture of presenteeism, where if you go home at your contracted time and having worked your contracted hours, you're thought of as a slacker. It's the country where if you are ill, you'd better wear a hair shirt and look like death and not even think of popping to the shops for some more Lemsips because you'll be thought of as faking it.

And yet the UK doesn't have the most productive workers. People still haven't joined the dots.

Yes, there's value in getting together with your co-workers in person. I work hybrid, having worked fully from home, and hybrid is much better. But the drive towards 100% office based working is about control and the money to be made in office real estate.

And of course as said by a pp, if the government want to get disabled people back into work, they are going to have to put things in place to ensure employers make this possible - which will absolutely mean support for WFH.

I strongly believe working from home could revolutionise Levelling Up. This government could really seize the opportunity as employees could be based anywhere and bring prosperity to areas struggling in the current environment. WFH has the opportunity to improve productivity exponentially.

Employers could easily manage employees who take the piss by putting them on probation and seeing performance in say a six month period.

Many don't get any face to face in any other place. social anxiety is a big thing now especially for the young so even home 4 days out of 7 isn't great....with online deliveries of anything we desire, entertainment etc our future health doesn't look good ....we really are going to be the Wall-e blubber people. Not getting dressed not moving about shoving take out and coffee down our throats....you don't even need to leave home for breaks with virtual reality

Most people could probably opt to work in the office if they wish. It's pointless though. People don't have their own allocated workspace any more, so you're hotdesking. You're unlikely to be sitting with any members of your team, if even any of them are in the office on the same day.

I don't think I will ever be back in the office, because there's not space for everyone. There are some functions that do still require to be office-based, and they get priority obviously.

Not all. My work is fully remote. Lots of employers in the charity sector are still committed to remote and hybrid. Try looking there.