My coworker does unpaid overtime but I don’t want to

[Evangelineee]

Started the job a year and a half ago. It’s a team of 4, plus the manager. Two of my coworkers did the same job, whereas me and the other did something slightly different. The other two people, plus the manager would always be working in the evening. We only get paid until 6pm (it’s flexitime though so if you start earlier you can finish earlier but can’t start later than 10) but my coworker would be logged on at home at like 8pm. I never did that in my previous role, and it was never expected of me anyway because my job was slightly different to theirs.

One of these people left and I have taken on their role. There is a lot to do and there are time constraints and deadlines. My coworker who I am now working with never ever finishes when she should. She is off on Thursdays and even logs on then. My manager at first told her to stop doing this but she never listened so he doesn’t bother telling her anymore because she just does it anyway. However, she is now expecting me to do it, because the person who had this job before me also stayed later and they would work together. Now I log off and she does overtime on her own, but it isn’t paid. She keeps asking me if I can log back on later that evening. For a few days this week I have worked 30 minutes over to finish things off, which is fine. But I don’t really want to regularly be working at 8/9pm. I asked my manager whether this is expected of me, and he said absolutely not and mentioned in a meeting that no one should be working past their 7.5 hours. But now she’s making digs about team players and about how she is doing more work than “other people” meaning me!

Please could I have some suggestions on how to handle this?

There have been several BBC items on unpaid work.
Management needs to get control of contracts, workload, demands etc vs staff and hours. We don’t work in sweatshops any longer and there are laws to keep employees safe.
perhaps a respectful conversation about work/life balance and how she they can create ways to slash time and still get job done. The phrase working smarter not harder is a handy phrase.
Physical and mental health, stress and moral are big indicators of workplace productivity.

perhaps a respectful conversation about work/life balance and how she they can create ways to slash time and still get job done. The phrase working smarter not harder is a handy phrase.

From the sound of it it isn't a case of needing to work smarter, just purely too much work in the first place.

One of my most hated phrases is "continuous improvement", as eventually you get to the stage where you are working as smartly and efficiently as is possible but you are still expected to "improve" this every year ad infinitum.

There rarely seems to be any allowance for certain roles if they get busier over time, you're just told to "work smarter". Same when little side projects get added all the time when someone's already at capacity - "work smarter". Well guess what - the job has been optimised as far as a normal person can make it, and they ain't paying genius wages to get someone who can compress the same amount or more work any further to fit the time available.

Look at her like she’s a fucking moron and say, “I don’t work for free. My time is worth more than that, and I have a life outside of work. Every time you work for free, you’re undermining your own value.”

I would just simply say to your colleague the next time she comments something like "I manage to organise my workload so everything I need to complete is within my working hours of x-y and am meeting my deadlines so I don't feel it necessary to donate my personal time to company business unless agreed with (managers name)". Then offer to help her manage her time more effictively

She's clearly crap at organising her work, prioritising her workload, and managing her time effectively, because she's failing on all of these fronts.

That's absolutely no reason to expect you to work in your own time for nothing, and she's out of order for making snarky comments.

Tell her to get bent and get a life. Her choice to mug herself off doing free overtime. She probably thinks it's getting her somewhere chewing the boss off doing it but in reality they're probably just laughing at her.

I was fortunate that my boss who was like this worked in a different time zone and on an earlier flexitime. It meant I could get in an hour and a half later than him (2.5 including the zone difference) which meant my working until 6pm meant he would be doing an 11 hour day.

I would be aiming for the latest shift possible and telling your co-worker you can only stay until 18:00. People who log on to do unpaid overtime are usually hideously inefficient at their jobs. It should be the rare exception that you have to work late. If it's happening too much then you have too heavy a workload. I'm mean enough to be hinting to the Manager about concerns that your Co-Worker doesn't seem to be coping with their workload if it ever becomes an issue.

Fuck that! I work long hours sometimes but then I'm on 1.5x my hourly rate.

That's really nothing to be proud of. Working for free isn't a flex, it's ridiculous.

She's clearly crap at organising her work, prioritising her workload, and managing her time effectively, because she's failing on all of these fronts.

Why this assumption by a lot of people that it's the worker's fault? OP has said up thread that this person is doing more than she is many days, to try to get that day's allocation of work done whereas the OP does as much as she can in the normal working day & leaves the rest for the next day.

Again the idea that it's always the worker's fault for the work not getting done, rarely that there is just too much work to do in the hours available.😡

I think it really does depend what you do, and, crucially, how much you get paid.

Some jobs are very well paid in recognition of the fact that you need to be very reactive and available, and your level of education and professional experience is such that there aren't loads of other people in the organisation who could do your job so they really need you to do the work when they need you to, even if that means sometimes you work late. I have one of these jobs myself, and I know that sometimes doing unpaid overtime is the price I pay for having a high base salary and also having the flexibility to basically do what I want when I want when things are not so busy. I can work from home when I want to, take time out during the week to see my child's school play or accompany his class on their trip to the library, and I'm not taking that out of my annual leave allowance because my boss knows I make the time up elsewhere.

But overall, I agree with you. Big law firms pay eye watering salaries because they don't hire enough people. They'd rather have 100 people they really want working 16 hour days than 100 people, some of whom are less good, working 8 hour days. I don't think that's a healthy mindset so I don't work in that sort of environment. I know that in my team we have the right number of people for the amount of work overall, it's just that there are peaks and troughs in terms of when that work needs to be done, meaning that sometimes we have to work late and other times we get to clock off early.

It doesn't sound like the OP does this sort of job though. It sounds like the job she's sharing with this colleague needs three people to do it, and her colleague is perpetuating the problem by doing unpaid overtime.

It doesn't sound like OP is in a highly paid role.

OP I would speak to your manager again and ask if it's possible to move back to your previous team. Do it now whilst you still have your good reputation from your previous role. When he asks why say that X is constantly expecting you to work past your contracted hours and spoiling your reputation by complaining when you refuse to. Say also that you think there is too much work for two people, but it's hard to tell as X is working 60-70 hr weeks.

It sounds as though either her time management is terrible or she’s a slow worker. Or she enjoys playing the martyr. I used to work at a bank and if you put your coat on at finishing time of 5.30 pm, colleagues looked shocked. The culture seemed to be a competition of who could stay the latest, even if work was done!

I'd just tell her straight that you won't be bullied by anyone into working outside of your given hours, then refuse to talk about it if she tries to mention it again.

It sounds like you need to have a meeting with your manager. Remind them that you took the job because you were assured that the problem was the worker not the job role. But your co-worker is constantly doing unpaid overtime, sometimes until 1am...and making digs that you are not doing the same. You have previously asked if overtime is expected and been told absolutely not. Yet your colleague continues to do it and her behaviour towards you is now bordering on harassment. If she can't complete her work in her contracted hours then maybe management need to employ someone else.

As for your colleague next time she makes a comment just roll your eyes and tell her she's getting boring.

I think your colleague is wrong to try to guilt trip you into working extra unpaid even if they are feeling overwhelmed. They are either making a drama where there isn’t any. That it is fine to carry work over. Alternatively there is actually a workload issue. I am suspecting it is probably the latter. Think you may have been fed a line about why previous person left.

Manager saying that there is no expectation to work over. Perhaps there isn’t or maybe need to be seen to say that when not true.

Whatever the reason, colleague working herself into the ground for no extra pay is foolish. Extra people not going to be hired if someone will do work for free. They are not going to be effective and may make mistakes if they burn out They could sacked for these.

Can you have a conversation with colleague and ask what they think will happen if they don’t work over? I suspect they will say the work will build up. Perhaps it needs to. If two people can’t do work within time on a regular basis there is too much work. Perhaps the wheels need to fall off so to speak.

When colleague moans about having to do extra work because not everyone doing the same, what do others say? Have you said that I am doing my share in working hours. I am just not prepared to put in hours extra which are unpaid and that I believe there isn’t the expectation to do so as per team meeting.

Exactly.. never work for free.

She worked till 1am! That is insane! You should report this as concerns for her wellbeing. You are very clearly short staffed. Do not work extra hours. I'm surprised she hadn't been taken ill! Appalling you have been put under this pressure. She must have no life

Depends. When I was a bid manager there was a clause in my contract about being expected to 'work outside of normal hours during times of business need' which basically meant when approaching submission deadlines. It was part of the role.

If a clarification was added to the portal in the evening, picking it up and notifying the appropriate people (who needed to input post haste) could be make or break and either win or lose the company a £14m contract. You did what you needed to in order to get it out the door and were paid well for it.

Although following a submission I'd often be waiting a couple of weeks for the sales lead to finish off another bid they were working on and all I had to do was 'familiarise myself with the bid document' which could mean spending just a single day pulling off relevant ideas to put forward from previous bids. I might then 'work' from home for a whole week or two and just pop my head in for the odd half day to remain visible. But I defo did the occasional all nighter and had many consecutive days where I'd work from the minute I got up until bedtime. I still worked a lot less than many lawyers.

Truck drivers work up to 15 hours though (12 being a standard day for many) and don't earn anywhere near as much as people like lawyers. Those that do earn well still don't earn much p/h when you break it down. It's odd when you consider it's a role where health and safety is in theory paramount.

A trucker can legally work 3x15hr shifts and 2x13hr shifts in the same week as long as they don't go over their driving hours (most of that time might be sitting waiting to load/unload at depots).

A little disingenuous there I think. You are looking at the maximum working hours which includes time waiting for loading/unloading, waiting for ferries where necessary etc. All these hours must be paid for at the relevant amount. Plus if they DO work those shifts you suggest, they would be exceeding the driving hours rule as 3 x 15 hours then 2 x 13 hours adds up to 71 hours in a week with a maximum being 56. Then factor in the driving hours rule of max 90 per fortnight. The example from Michelin below gives an example of this.

In a single week, a HGV driver cannot exceed 56 hours of total drive time. Within a two-week period, HGV drivers are not allowed to have been on the road for over 90 hours. This means that if a driver was to drive for 56 hours one week, then they could only work for 34 hours the subsequent week.
For instance, a driver could work four 9-hour shifts coupled with two 10-hour shifts one week, followed by four 7-hour shifts and one 6-hour shift the next. It’s notable that these shift times do not account for the mandatory breaks.

In any case, talking about truck drivers vs lawyers isn't really relevant when the OP is about admin work, and there being too much work to be done by the available staff.