To resent the cognitive dissonance that exists around climate change

[JacquesHarlow]

Let’s be real - will anything get better when folk’s priorities are usually about themselves?

Let me explain my rather emotional opening point.

There’s been lots of news this week unsurprisingly about how we had the hottest year on record last year. The last 10 years have been the hottest on record. Wildfires, floods, you name it - the earth is changing.

Yet here in the temperate, largely rainy UK, many people I see around me are very happy to have their head in the sand, while also bizarrely choosing just one or two lines of attack on the climate crisis to shame others.

One of the parents i know has an electric car. It’s nice, I’m happy for them. They also take at least five flight a year. They have three children.

Yet if you hear them talk about diesel cars… it’s as if the owners are personally killing everyone around them.

Now don’t get me wrong. Emissions locally are important, the air our kids breathe is important. that might be a focus.

However you see it in the choice of car journeys over trains, of large SUVs over a normal family car like a Golf.

The latter particularly grates. We have a huge climate crisis. Yet Joanna or Nicola has to have a Discovery Sport for her three kids because she needs to sit high up, it’s easier to load them in, and she worries about crash worthiness.

The history books will show that rather than looking up and out for each other, we’re actually turning more inwards. Our own personal economy will always triumph over needing to protect others. If I’m able to pay £400 a month PCP on a Dispcvery Sport, then “I’ll protect my family over anything”, even though the entire thought process is irrational.

We need to take fewer flights and more rail journeys. working from home should mean more walking to school as the commute has gone. instead we’re seeing more car journeys. More flights. More large purchases; throwaway electronics; fast fashion.

AIBU to think there’s a lot of cognitive dissonance and head in the sand about climate change in the UK, and spending power (and the choices it unlocks) is king?

How are people to get around then, @DdraigGoch ?

No proper public transport outside cities

It's really quite convenient that being "green" these days involves buying a huge shiny new car and driving one's children to school every single day. Hilarious.

While the country disappears around us, replaced by new build housing estates to house millions more people every year.

It's irrelevant that the birth rate is falling in the UK; the population is growing at speed due to immigration and the birth rate still being too high.

Well, they'll be bought up by people who don't need to rent... developers looking to flip, better off younger couples & yes prices will drop 5 or 10% and the Mail will scream "Labour have wrecked the UK"

Meanwhile, the poor will be forced into temp accommodation, benefits bill increases as the Govt is forced to give out more in Housing support, councils worse off as they pay out more in B&B and council tax support.

All these netzero policies are going to hit the poor.

Fewer flights and more rail journeys. I'm in. Or would be if it were possible. Rail and ferries between Britain and Ireland used to be in sync for example. Bit of a minefield now. Twice I've had to stay in a B+B overnight while travelling as a foot passenger due to various mishaps. There is no real pleasure in driving or flying lately. But we are 'prodded' in that direction.

Agree, the eco choice for almost everything costs either time, money or both. We have a refill shop locally, almost everything there (dry food) to hand-wash to bamboo toothbrushes is about 3 times as expensive as the "standard" version. I generally try to walk whenever possible ...but I have that choice because I live in a town with a train service, and have teen kids that can walk the same speed and distance as me , and none of us have disabilities.

The thing about saying india or China etc should do something about climate change is a bit hypocritical. They aren't churning out goods for themselves, they're supplying the world with phones, tech, clothes, cars that we in the UK are buying! In our house we don't tend to replace tech very often, DH phone is at least 4 years old, mine and DD are about 3 years old, my laptop is 5 years old, the tv probably the same, one if our cars is 18 years old, but we eat meat, we are flying to go on holiday, and DD buys a lot of clothes

To cut climate change we need far fewer people on this earth. That's the dreadful truth.

I agree. I'm trying to reduce our carbon footprint in various ways. But by no means perfect due to the capitalist consumerist culture we are locked in to.

I sort-of agree with you, but also acknowledge that I'm one of those people who goes green when it suits me. I drive an electric car - I could take the train to work but that would quadruple my commuting time and I CBA. I shop from B-Corp brands but I also happily eat meat. I refuse to buy from Shein and Temu but shop on Amazon all the time. I looked up train prices for a recent family visit, would have been very happy to take the train, but it was stupidly expensive so we drove instead. I take multiple flights every year for work and leisure and enjoy taking the DC to far-flung destinations.

So sue me. My NDNs are cycling, camping vegans and are very happy with their choices.

The way society has evolved I think means that people are more time poor. Often 2 parents are working ft. They are making choices based on convenience and time available. And most labour saving devices that previous generations didn't have (washing machines, dishwashers, microwaves, vacuum cleaners etc) would have some carbon impact. Internet connection and a device to use has become a necessity rather than a luxury. And because of built in obsolescence, those need replacing every few years. Even white goods don't seem to last as long as previous generations.

I get the train to work (I work in London) because its the quickest way to get there. In terms of cost if I lift shared with DH , even taking into account the congestion charge and parking there would be hardly any difference, but it takes a lot longer, and also means we'd have to sync our work hours which often isn't possible. We walk to the train station because its 12 minutes away. Other people need to drive if they live in the next village or have children they are dropping at nursery or breakfast club, because bus services are minimal. Other longer journeys I make would be more expensive and/or more time consuming using public transport.

Nearly every eco alternative to the norm has a cost in terms of time or money or both. In my previous post I talked about the refill shop in the next town. If I went there I would a) spend a lot more money and b) spend more time on shopping because it only sells a limited selection of things. Ethical or eco clothes are usually a lot more expensive if bought new, electric cars are often more expensive than ICE counterparts and fewer available second hand, like a pp said heat pumps are significantly more expensive, solar panels are expensive at the outset even if they save money in the long run.

'Nobody cares' seems to be the general attitude among most people I know. It really does need a shift in thinking from higher up to move this forward. We have taken some small steps like having recycling bins and some very basic efforts to reduce single-use plastics but these are so minor in comparison to the big picture that it would be laughable if it wasn't so serious.

The problem is that even if people want to do something individually, climate change is inevitable. Limiting global warming needs more action from western Governments and that will not happen any time soon. Short-termism is the issue here and that won't change. The Government needs to be seen to be doing something to appease the electorate but will always fall a long way short of doing anything that really matters.

In the UK, many people are under the misconception that global warming means the UK will get warmer. I hate to break the news to people, but it is very possible that the UK will suffer another ice age, so if you live in the north, you can expect a lot more cold winters, more high winds and arctic conditions!

Especially if the Gulf Stream breaks down. We're very high up in latitude and if you look at Canada's climate (without Gulf Stream), that's the kind of cold we'll have to endure.

Man made climate change is a con.

The planet warms and cools in cycles. Nothing to do with us. Remember the medieval warming period?

They predicted an ice age that never happened so they changed the con to climate change as the climate does change, hourly actually.

They will meet in Davos or similar flying in by private jet with a convoy of 4 x 4’s to eat Wagu beef (flown in specially) to discuss the sacrifices and the money you have to make to change the temperature. They know it’s a con of course.

Historically people thrive during a warm periods and persish during cooler periods. That is a fact.

Almost 100% of people are hypocrites when it comes to climate change, myself included. I drive 30 mins to work in a petrol car. Occasionally, I take the train. It's a 90 minute journey door to door factoring in getting from home to station and station to work. Factor in picking two children up from after school club and getting them home. That's the one compromise I can't make. I will go electric when I can afford to get a new car.

The few that genuinely priorise live sustainably have very quiet, simple lives, in small houses, tending allotments, using public transport. They are not the loud preachy types.

Our society and economy is build on people spending money too. That's a huge elephant in the room that if we reduce spending and consumption, all grew our own food, the economy would likely tank! We need to radically rethink how society is built true green revolution.

This is a very good post OP and I agree with your reasoning. I do lots myself for the environment but will turn a blind eye for other aspects

I totally agree that those citing China, India etc are the worst, just totally ignoring that our economy is funding theirs through everything we buy, and the fact that China is massively investing in green technology and energy

But we do need governments to do more. Unfortunately we are on the back of Brexit, wars, COL, covid. And seeing a world wide shift towards populist politics, much of which denies or works against climate change. The irony of this political view arguing against immigration,when their policies will cause major climate change in the future is staggering

But individuals can only do so much, they need transport, grants to retrofit homes, policies that drive businesses to consider the environment and investment in green policies.

The changes need to come from the top. We were happy to recycle once the recycling bins were provided. All happy to reuse our plastic carrier bags when charges were applied.

I'd happily use an electric car if the infrastructure was in place and public transport if it existed effectively.

Once hydrogen fuelled houses have been developed and planes can fly by other energy, I'll happily use those too.

In the meantime, anything I do isn't going to make a jot of difference.

You have to be a special kind of stupid to still be a climate change denier given the overwhelming evidence.

kudos for honestly though. Most people accept it’s happening but think it’s someone else’s problem to solve. You’re at least being sincere

Was the car free, and no running costs

I have only read one response so far which nailed exactly what I was going to say. So many times in the last few years we’ve tried to sort out trains to go somewhere but the cost is prohibitive. Even with just one person travelling the car works out cheaper than the train almost always always, even with the railcard discount. As soon as you add in a second person it’s never cheaper by train. We just can’t afford to travel by train (but don’t use the car much either and rarely fly anywhere).

We improve public transport and active travel infrastructure in provincial towns (actually many have reasonable public transport already). The more people who switch from cars to public transport, frequent buses will become more economical and they won't get stuck in traffic. The more people who switch from cars to active travel, the safer it becomes for everyone.

A developed country is not one where the poor have cars, it is one where the rich use public transport.

No, the car wasn't free but it costs me less than £500 a year in maintenance. It was also a cheap car. So far it costs me less a year than 3 family train trips. And this will reduce further the longer I have this car, assuming there are no expensive repairs.

Or the people who are here make different choices

Our government preaches about the environment and simultaneously wants to build, build, build hundreds of thousands more houses, often destroying nature and countryside in the process. It’s totally hypocritical.

Aviation accounts for between 2.5 and 4% of global CO2 emissions. China's coal fired power stations are responsible for somewhere between 15 and 25% of global CO2 emissions. And that's China alone without considering India or the US - we were wringing our hands over having 1 remaining coal power station while China has over a thousand and are approving new ones at about 2 a week.

So people can stop taking flights if it makes them feel good about themselves but really they're just pissing in the wind. Personally I'm going to make the most of my life and fly as often as I can afford - but I only have one child, don't drive and am extremely frugal in many other ways. I'm not just being a completely selfish asshole, but travel is an amazing thing to do and even if we all give it up it's not going to save the world.

I do agree about transport
Given where we live, partly rural but nearish a city, our local transport is ok and cheap enough
National transport is shocking. I wasn't entirely in favour of hs2 for environmental reasons but it was supposed to sort out capacity and therefore prices. It wasn't about speed.
But it's more than transport. It's cheaper energy provision (getting there with renewables) and usage, retrofitting, less meat/ dairy (and as pp said eating locally not shipping in avocados),simply consuming less stuff and repairing/ reusing. As well as flights of course.

In no way saying I am good at this, and much of it needs government action, but plenty can be done by individuals

As another pp said, the overindulgence of food, drink, presents and simply everything at Xmas ( and starting with Halloween) is a start....