To think that tradesmen take the piss with their rates?

[Pomegranatecarnage]

Just that really. I have had a few repairs needed and some DIY recently. I paid £130 to have a leaking toilet valve fixed (it took 45 mins), £75 to have a pull string light replaced (10 mins) and then £270 labour for 6 hours work putting up some shelves, a small area of tiling and replacing skirting boards. He arrived at 10, left at 12 for lunch, back at 2 then was finished by 4pm. I can’t help wondering why I spent 5 years at University to get paid far less per hour as a teacher.

Quite possibly! I wasn’t saying he should have offered mates rates just that it might be a situation where the customer might expect them.

The pull string light sounds expensive but the rest sounds reasonable and standard I'd have thought.
As others have said you can retrain if you want to. And it's not a new thing tradesmen charging a fair amount either. Do the job yourself for free or pay someone else to do it. Or retrain.

Nail on the head. "Mates rates" only really works when it's reciprocated. That's why you find tradesmen often work for each other for free or material cost only - they're favours which will be called in by the other eventually and will balance out. What exactly is the OP doing for this "mate" for which they expected a hefty discount? Were they going to give a few hours free tuition in return for a few hours free DIY work??

Where I live builders charge a minimum of £250 per day plus materials.
I pay someone to do DIY for me. Some may say that it's not necessary and I could do it myself but I think it would tip me over the edge to do it myself. I work full time, I run a business on the side and I'm a single parent to teenagers. I literally can't cope with any more so I pay someone to do it. I think because there are lots of people like me who are too exhausted to do their own DIY the people who can do it as a job are going to be reasonably well paid. I would rather pay for that than new clothes or getting my hair or nails done etc. I need a hand so it's worth the money. It's going to be expensive as not many people want to go into the trades. It's much better paid than most other jobs.

That's great about your stepson. My nephew is doing an apprenticeship with John Deere, and he worked part time as a mechanic his last two years of high school (not UK), and honestly I couldn't be prouder, or more confident that he's going to be set for life.

I charge £30 per hour for tutoring which includes preparation and marking and feedback to parents.

If you just tutored, without any other income, how much would you charge to give yourself a decent income?

You would have to be realistic and think about how many hours you would get of actual paid work, school holidays, unavailability of students etc

The guy is a chancing greedy chunt, charging top end for a cash in hand/tax dodge job.
I'd've gave him 200 quid and told him I won't tell the tax man if you don't.

I charge £50.

Public liability insurance, Gas safe registration every year, tools insurance, running a van, buying parts. DH’s expenses are iro £12k a year so that’s £250 a week before he makes a penny.

Yes, some tradies take the piss, ironically they are likely to be the ones without proper insurance etc.

Out of interest, would you take a half day's unpaid leave to tutor your "mate's" kid for £20 for one hour at their house?

My DH gets endless requests like this because he did a good but bigger job for them once when things were quiet. People then seem to think they then own him for every random weekend blocked toilet because they don't want to pay an emergency plumber or god forbid get some drain rods and poke their own shit out! I'm cross because DH is a mug and always goes and does it at the expense of our family time 🙄

How did you set that rate?

Yes
could be right there, I’m not a millennial I’m 58 so still very much a do it myself.

I wouldn’t pay for things I can easily do myself.
perhaps a book on diy OP? For next time.

Tbh @SassK i would report him to hmrc.
This cash in hand crap is pure fraud and just another reason this country is in such a mess.

I have three siblings.
We're all in our 40s. One is a doctor; one is an advanced nurse practitioner. I have a senior management level, professional, role (which I won't name here as it's a bit outing).
Who earns the most? The one who didn't go to university.
Now clearly there's a whole other issue around the pay of doctors, nurses and other health professionals that I won't get into here.
But my youngest sibling, who went into a trade and is now a partner in a very successful business related to their trade, FAR out earns the rest of us. Additionally, they've been in paid work since 16 (while training/at college) and had no student debt like the rest of us who have all been to university and also got postgraduate degrees.
My youngest sibling may be an outlier who has had a lot of success. And I can't imagine my other siblings doing anything other than medicine/nursing (for them, it was a total vocation) but I think it shows that university isn't for everyone and practical qualifications and training can lead to a brilliant life for anyone who is motivated, hard working, and passionate about what they do.
Careers advice when we were at school in the nineties was total shit. It's remarkable any of us have done anything really. I hope today's kids get somewhat better insight to follow their interests, strengths and aspirations knowing there are all sorts of options on the table.

You may (or may not) believe the number of people who put pressure on to pay cheaper for cash, saying the quote is too much! It's often the client who wants the trader not to pay tax so they get a cheaper job, with all the risk on the traders shoulders, while they sit back adding value to their property for naff all and then moan like fuck to all and sundry that all traders are tax dodgers. DH often becomes very 'sorry, booked up for months' for quite a lot of CFs!

I don’t understand this at all. Why do you think a trades person shouldn’t be paid more than you? It’s basic demand and supply. They charge what people will pay.

You must understand that some people earn more than others???

And you don't think they trained ?

For some reason a lot of teachers have a chip on their shoulder about how much others earn. Even though, as I understand it, they are contracted to only work about 1,300 hours a year over 195 days and have a better pension than most. And yes, I am sure they actually do more hours than contracted. Show me a professional who wants to progress that hasn’t. But If you gross up their salary to the equivalent hours of professionals like doctors and lawyers then it’s not quite as bad as they like to make out, given that it needs less education and ongoing training. Indeed, a skilled tradesman is also probably lucky if they can mange that many ‘billable hours’, by the time you take into account the time taken for quotes/estimates, admin, holidays, sickness, additional training. Which makes £40/£50/£60 an hour depending on skill seem reasonable.

Quite the opposite is our experience.

We've had scaffolders (£2500 job), fencers (£500 job), lawn replacement (£750 job), shed roof replacement (£300 job) all saying they'll knock off the VAT if we pay in cash and don't want an invoice, in the last couple of years - all unprompted and the shed roof and fencing were both just over an initial enquiry phone call to random firms we'd googled for so didn't know us from Adam. The lawn guy even said he could put a couple of casual cash in hand day labourers on the job for a bigger reduction if we agreed to pay them directly and just pay him for the grass. All four mentioned the VAT and discount right from the outset without us asking.

So £270 day rate - let's assume has 6 weeks off including bank holidays, that's 210 days per year. That's around £56,000.

Then he has costs of around £10,000 and pays £10,000 into a pension (he won't get an employer contribution) - He earns roughly £36,000. OK but not fantastic.

Then he can only work full time up to the age of 55 due to a dodgy back so has to do a minimum wage job for the last 10 years ....

I’m impressed you had all the tools, good quality saw and tile cutter. And were able to bring home a 2metre length of skirting board.
Was everything done on the same day? Maybe try Checkatrade/MyBuilder next time. Good luck with anyone even wanting to quote. Or even turning up!

Beautifully explained for those who don't understand how a business works or have to go out looking for their clients.

There are a lot of cowboys out there sadly.

Seriously don't you realise not only are you paying for their skill. They have a van to.insure and run and petrol etc. Travel time.
If you want jobs done for free or cheap you need to learn yourself....