To think the school should grit

[SnowyOwl97]

Aibu to think a primary school should grit the school grounds and paths?

@WashingDryingForEver just op

She said caretaker?

Most schools don't have one

Who else are people suggesting then?
At our school there is the head, deputy, the 7 teachers (nursery don’t even have a teacher only a TA overseen by reception teacher) a HLTA ( for PPA cover) three additional TAs (all of which are part time) and the Office lady - who is still working at 68.
Which of us do you suggest grits the grounds?

Anyone remember the days when janitors lived in a wee house on the school premises, often attached to the school building? In Scotland he was always known as The Jannie. He lived there and dealt with any issues in the school building/grounds 24/7.

Yes, most of those houses have been turned into pupil units around here.

Some have sensory rooms and others are used for wraparound care.

This was the same even when I was at school in the 80s, there was a steep path to the school the council never gritted and nor could the janitor as it was outside school premises, it was treacherous.

and yes school playgrounds should be gritted, this country is a fucking shambles that we can’t even provide basics like gritting in winter.

this country is a fucking shambles that we can’t even provide basics like gritting in winter

I don’t agree with this. I passed two gritters out gritting the roads when I was driving home yesterday evening. What we’ve got here is a case of I want a dogsbody to make my life free of minor inconveniences, but I have no intention of doing anything useful for my community just whinge when no one else does.

OP never once suggested teachers should grit the school grounds , she suggested the caretaker employed by the school who lives on site.

I think a lot of places don't grit anymore, never mind schools. I've been in publicly owned car parks, supermarket car parks, pub car parks, plus work, where nothing has been gritted.

As another poster mentioned and I don't know how accurate it is, but I remember being told that if they grit and someone slips, then they are liable. I'm not sure how accurate that is. When heavily pregnant I was terrified going into work and walking across the untouched car park and falling, it was like an ice rink.

Without a doubt, of course.

Our school janitors have around 4-5 sometimes more buildings (nurseries, primary and secondary) to open each morning. To grit each one before the school day begins is near impossible.

I wonder how we arrived at this point?
I went to school 70s/early 80s there was always a janny with a house on the school grounds.

A formal snow clearance/gritting risk assessment should be carried out in advance of bad weather, guidance is available in the CYPD school generic risk assessment booklet. Your risk assessment must include reference to manual handling issues, personal protective equipment for staff and how the school will communicate with staff, parents & visitors the appropriate access routes to use during bad weather.

Please Note: It is not appropriate for school staff to clear or grit areas falling outside the school site boundary, e.g. pavements/public footpaths, roads forming part of the public highway, etc, if these areas are considered dangerous the school should contact your council.

We don't have grit on the premises and you have to consider the state of the playground, parking and safety of travelling staff and how to get children home if the situation indicates more snow is coming. If you have problems with children not being collected on time normally you need to consider this too.

What is safe and doable at one school is different to another school.

I do worry about slipping when it's icy on the school run - I have arthritis in both feet and walking is tricky enough as it is. The drive which the teachers use to enter the school car park is not gritted and the main path into school is not gritted.

(I'm going off on a massive tangent.)

I'm always thinking I'm going to slip and break a bone when I take my grandchildren into their primary school.

Never mind just the icy conditions - the footpath into school is three paving slabs wide and shrubs/bushes cover/overhang at least a width of two paving slabs for the full length of the path, until you get through another narrow gate (massive bottleneck) which opens onto the playground. So there's only a thin path for parents and children, lots of them with prams/pushchairs. The path is always slippy. To the side of the path used to be grass which has been a mud bath for as long as I can remember. This is an area where bikes and scooters are kept. When it's wet, three quarters of the path is under water. Even in the driest weather there remains lots of mud/churned dirt to the side of the path. The overhanging trees ensure there's always fresh heaps of bird dirt in various states of encrustation.

When invited into school for a 'book look' I couldn't help but notice the state of the carpets/rugs/sitting areas as they were absolutely filthy with a combination of sludge, smeared bird droppings and dog dirt, traipsed in on shoes - the stench was unmistakable.

Ever since Covid it is absolute chaos - the gates used to open early and parents who arrived at different times, could stand and wait in the playground whilst children played before school started. But since social distancing rules were first introduced, during Covid, hundreds of parents and children, lots on scooters and bikes, now all have to congregate on the village green where the vast majority of villagers take their dogs to evacuate their bowels. When the small gate opens at precisely 8.44, there's a huge surge of people - if you hang about until it's less busy you have to 'swim against the tide' of parents/prams coming out of the premises.

Every time I'm on the school run, I'm mindful of losing my balance/slipping in the chaos.

I have two DGC who go into school at 8.45 (apparently the register closes at 8.50) and then I have to wait until 9.00 for the nursery doors to open for the younger DGC. When I'm leaving, I'm usually jostled by the parents who are rushing because they're late or are either strategically coming in late to avoid the awful atmosphere. I feel sorry for the parents who have to then rush off to work. You waste a lot of time trying to stand to one side to allow others (mainly children running) to pass by.

My other granddaughter's school (I take her twice a week) reverted back to normal school entrance routine quite quickly after Covid restrictions were relaxed. It's much safer access and egress and I never feel unsafe.

Our local Jannie ( janitor) is responsible for 2 primary schools and one secondary all separate locations.
i work in a local council satellite building, we don’t have a janitor at all and they won’t even give us our own grit bin ( finance cuts) I’m admin and threw down some salt along the path to our front door out of a bag I bought, out of our petty cash money, from B and Q. No way did I have the time or even grit available to do the pavement. It is so cold here it didn’t make much difference anyway.
People are living in a dream world if they think schools are staffed like they were in the good old days.

My workplace thinks this too.

It's a load of bullshit. By not identifying and making safe the hazard they are also opening themselves up to litigation. In fact scenario B is far more likely to have a successful action taken against them than scenario A.

"Such-and-such important service used to be routinely carried out and paid for through our taxes, to the benefit of all. It no longer happens, which poses a risk to vulnerable community members. I think this important service should still happen."

"Get off your lazy arse and do it yourself, you selfish arsehole, who are you to be demanding that random unrelated workers you haven't mentioned at any point be doing something that isn't their job, just so you can swan around being safe from preventable hazards you're not responsible for? When budgets are cut below the level required to provide a safe and effective service, anyone complaining about something resulting from this is OBVIOUSLY just some idiot who wants money and time to be taken from other essential parts of the service!"

Well, a building can't apply grit, so who specifically do you think should be doing this?

The caretaker who lives in the house next to the primary school in my street isn't the caretaker for that school. There's another council building next to the school and that's one of his, as well as various other buildings including the high school. The school janitor lives several miles away

Until last summer when there was an alarm fault (and there were LOTS of complaints) the one who lives on site (and it used to be the jannies house just for that school) didn't even have keys for the school for emergency purposes.

Back when I was working, one year we had a particularly bad winter. The local council gritted the roads but wouldn't do the pavements as it would cost too much. On one single day our A&E was absolutely heaving with people with head injuries and fractures. So many elderly people with fractured hips, wrists, ankles. All needing to have emergency surgery, plaster casts, follow up in fracture clinic, carers to visit at home for weeks. It was a classic example of false economy, but of course, what comes out of one budget can't ever be linked to a different budget. No joined up thinking at all even between public services.

School staff also weirdly defensive. It is not unreasonable for somebody who does not work in a school, to wonder why a school caretaker would not have a role in gritting the ground to make it safe for everyone including staff. Esp if that happened historically, and the school still has a caretaker.

Obviously if budgets have been cut and it is no longer the school caretaker’s role, then nothing can be done. But it is a depressing state of affairs and the blame lies at government level.

There is no need to leap up defensively and be outraged and think that people are suggesting that teachers and the 68y office lady arrive at school at 5 am to start throwing grit around 🙄.

Your facetious response is embarrassing. The OP wondered if the caretaker could do it. Read the posts.

Why so defensive?

Yes. My son fell yesterday. He's ok thankfully. His school trousers not so much.

It’s really hard not to be defensive when you work really hard and at least once a week are shouted at by grown adults for just trying to do your job.