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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

People have got very mean

24 replies

harriet435 · 21/12/2024 10:56

Is it just me or are people more mean in general? I’ve noticed this in a few areas of life, overt passive aggressiveness in work, lack of patience and customer service in general. All areas of a good society are struggling, family values are being eroded - too much of children are resilient, they don’t need committed parents in a stable home. Education is results paced only and children where I lived begin formal
testing in school at four! It just seems that genuine love, care, affection and warmth are being lost to this non real, silly, self centered other world! Maybe just me 😂😂

OP posts:
BlushPine · 21/12/2024 11:02

When someone starts banging on about ‘family values’, I always wonder if they even know what they mean themselves.

squirrelnutcartel · 21/12/2024 11:03

This is what happens as a consequence of the powers that be thinking they can treat everyone as a mere unit of production and either harassing or writing anybody off who isn't. They've openly admitted that we're supposed to be working more and paying more tax. The last government wasted billions and neglected essential public services. People are angry. It's difficult to be caring towards others and happy whilst you know full well that your life is worthless.

TheLightSideOfTheMoon · 21/12/2024 11:05

It’s just you. I’m not mean.

I am quite blunt though, so I guess that could be interpreted as mean.

Ytcsghisn · 21/12/2024 11:05

Is it?

You can’t move for people advertising their ‘be kind’ credentials everywhere.

Got mugged in the street? Oh it’s probably someone hard up. Spare a thought for them.

Your kid being bullied at school? Awww be kind, the bully must have SEN or come from an underprivileged background.

A thread running just now about scam beggars. Full of replies that no beggar ever could be a scammer. Even though we all know it’s an industry. Anyone commenting must check their privilege.

And you’re in for a pasting if you should ever call out your relative or neighbour for being a benefits fraud even though she lives with her 6 kids, boyfriend, claims as a single mother, pretends to be disabled and has never worked a day in her life.

Everyone has SEN or an underpriced background. And no one can ever be bad or do something wrong that they must take responsibility for.

Or maybe it’s all just virtue signalling.

Who knows.

fishfingersandchipsagain · 21/12/2024 11:05

First response demonstrated it.

Second response explained it.

harriet435 · 21/12/2024 11:05

BlushPine · 21/12/2024 11:02

When someone starts banging on about ‘family values’, I always wonder if they even know what they mean themselves.

Family values mean a variety of things but as child who grew up with separated and warring parents due to infidelity I do loath this culture of do what makes you happy and to f with everyone else. Abusive relationships withstanding.

OP posts:
harriet435 · 21/12/2024 11:06

That’s what I mean - be kind is everywhere but genuine kindness is hard to find.

OP posts:
CandiedPrincess · 21/12/2024 11:06

TheLightSideOfTheMoon · 21/12/2024 11:05

It’s just you. I’m not mean.

I am quite blunt though, so I guess that could be interpreted as mean.

I think it comes down to interpretation. People often mistake bluntness or directness as being mean because they don't like the truth.

I don't think there's an increase in "mean" but I do think there's an increase in people giving less fucks to pandering to other people.

soupfiend · 21/12/2024 11:08

Ytcsghisn · 21/12/2024 11:05

Is it?

You can’t move for people advertising their ‘be kind’ credentials everywhere.

Got mugged in the street? Oh it’s probably someone hard up. Spare a thought for them.

Your kid being bullied at school? Awww be kind, the bully must have SEN or come from an underprivileged background.

A thread running just now about scam beggars. Full of replies that no beggar ever could be a scammer. Even though we all know it’s an industry. Anyone commenting must check their privilege.

And you’re in for a pasting if you should ever call out your relative or neighbour for being a benefits fraud even though she lives with her 6 kids, boyfriend, claims as a single mother, pretends to be disabled and has never worked a day in her life.

Everyone has SEN or an underpriced background. And no one can ever be bad or do something wrong that they must take responsibility for.

Or maybe it’s all just virtue signalling.

Who knows.

I think this is a major factor contributing to people being harder and more pissed off because of the 'be kind' bullshit and you cant move for people making excuses for poor behaviour and anti social people

Everyone is expected to tolerate everything, the person causing a problem is the one that needs to be tolerated rather than the people on the receiving end of poor behaviour. Im not really that interested in why someone is behaving badly, Im interested on the impact it has on the majority.

We have moved far too far towards always working around and prioritising the minority instead of the majority. Its making people angry and pissed off.

squirrelnutcartel · 21/12/2024 11:09

BlushPine · 21/12/2024 11:02

When someone starts banging on about ‘family values’, I always wonder if they even know what they mean themselves.

Being able to make it through a pregnancy without the man wandering off and shagging anything with a pulse would be a start. I know it's a low bar, but judging by the posts on here it seems this behaviour is positively de rigueur.

OriginalUsername2 · 21/12/2024 11:10

We are definitely becoming more individualist as a society. It’s a collective survival mode from world events and that underlying feeling that it’s not going to get better.

Dotjones · 21/12/2024 11:11

Life is more stressful and most people are poorer in real terms than they've been for generations. If living standards are constantly declining, social standards fall too, they go hand in hand. Plus society has changed so much in the last 50 years or so - racism, sexism, homophobia or being anti-disabled are no longer tolerated for example, and in the last 20 years the population has roughly grown the same amount it did in the previous 50. Crowd people in and change their values, it's no surprise that other standards change too, for better and for worse. Actions taken for good reasons have unexpected consequences, for instance the move from proactive to reactive policing in the 1960s was intended to make Britain less of an interfering state but ultimately made it more of a criminal one. And another thing, if our "betters" like MPs and the Royals and just-about-everyone-on-tv-or-in-music turns out to be dishonest at best, prolific sex offenders at worst, just makes people more convinced we're heading down the shitter.

Sometimes you get tired of trying to crawl up out of the sewer against a tide of exrement. It's easier to go with the flow and get flushed into the sea.

Happyinarcon · 21/12/2024 11:20

No, I’m finding the opposite. I left a bunch of organising to the last minute and have found everyone I dealt with was much more cheerful and understanding than I deserved

AnneLovesGilbert · 21/12/2024 11:23

I’d love to hear more about the other world you mention.

BlushPine · 21/12/2024 11:25

squirrelnutcartel · 21/12/2024 11:09

Being able to make it through a pregnancy without the man wandering off and shagging anything with a pulse would be a start. I know it's a low bar, but judging by the posts on here it seems this behaviour is positively de rigueur.

But how is that a ‘value’? What is the woman supposed to do in the situation you describe — keep him tied to a chair?

BlushPine · 21/12/2024 11:26

harriet435 · 21/12/2024 11:05

Family values mean a variety of things but as child who grew up with separated and warring parents due to infidelity I do loath this culture of do what makes you happy and to f with everyone else. Abusive relationships withstanding.

So by ‘family values’, you mean ‘stay together for the sake of the children’?

squirrelnutcartel · 21/12/2024 11:49

BlushPine · 21/12/2024 11:25

But how is that a ‘value’? What is the woman supposed to do in the situation you describe — keep him tied to a chair?

Respecting your spouse and remaining faithful is a value. Both men and women can disregard this value.

harriet435 · 21/12/2024 11:51

AnneLovesGilbert · 21/12/2024 11:23

I’d love to hear more about the other world you mention.

Mainly social media.

OP posts:
harriet435 · 21/12/2024 11:52

BlushPine · 21/12/2024 11:26

So by ‘family values’, you mean ‘stay together for the sake of the children’?

No - but there had to be some importance put on the strength of a family - in this I am not meaning to stay in an abusive relationship.

OP posts:
squirrelnutcartel · 21/12/2024 11:53

BlushPine · 21/12/2024 11:26

So by ‘family values’, you mean ‘stay together for the sake of the children’?

To a certain extent, yes. People now expect to have endless fun and the excitement of chasing the next shag. If they value the family unit, this can go a long way to curbing that urge. We all have urges we need to keep in check for the sake of others. Dumping your spouse because you're bored or have a better offer is immature and demonstrates an inability to have even the most basic self control. Investment in a long term relationship requires emotional maturity and work and to be aware that others are also invested in that relationship (children) and require a stable upbringing not subject to the whims of a selfish parent.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 21/12/2024 12:05

Ytcsghisn · 21/12/2024 11:05

Is it?

You can’t move for people advertising their ‘be kind’ credentials everywhere.

Got mugged in the street? Oh it’s probably someone hard up. Spare a thought for them.

Your kid being bullied at school? Awww be kind, the bully must have SEN or come from an underprivileged background.

A thread running just now about scam beggars. Full of replies that no beggar ever could be a scammer. Even though we all know it’s an industry. Anyone commenting must check their privilege.

And you’re in for a pasting if you should ever call out your relative or neighbour for being a benefits fraud even though she lives with her 6 kids, boyfriend, claims as a single mother, pretends to be disabled and has never worked a day in her life.

Everyone has SEN or an underpriced background. And no one can ever be bad or do something wrong that they must take responsibility for.

Or maybe it’s all just virtue signalling.

Who knows.

You're not wrong, Ytcsghisn, but a key point - at least IME - is that virtue signallers are often the last to actually get off their backsides and do whatever it is they're insisting needs doing. Instead of just getting on with it too many spend their time focusing on themselves and how much they "care", and that can create nastiness in itself

Happily, those who genuinely make a difference are still among us just as they've always been ... it's simply tthat you may not notice them because they're a lot quieter

RamblingAlone · 21/12/2024 12:16

OP, have a read of this thread a few weeks ago, it is very similar and might be of interest to you. I also agree, there's something in the air, definitely..

www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5217142-people-seem-angrier-somehow?page=5&reply=140202179

PheasantPluckers · 21/12/2024 12:17

On the whole, I find people pleasant and friendly. Yes, there are some selfish assholes and unpleasant fuckers, but there always have been and always will be!

I do think that customer service can be pretty poor, but I notice this most in large stores - mainly supermarkets, which I assume are run really bbadly and staff have given up. I don't notice this in smaller shops or local restaurants of cafes - most of the people there are friendly and polite.

I have noticed some really poor and aggressive driving recently, but they're also in the minority.

I see what you mean about school, though, it's very target oriented and I not sure that's necessarily the best for children, but my DC's school is nice, the teachers are lovely and she's happy.

BlushPine · 21/12/2024 12:30

squirrelnutcartel · 21/12/2024 11:53

To a certain extent, yes. People now expect to have endless fun and the excitement of chasing the next shag. If they value the family unit, this can go a long way to curbing that urge. We all have urges we need to keep in check for the sake of others. Dumping your spouse because you're bored or have a better offer is immature and demonstrates an inability to have even the most basic self control. Investment in a long term relationship requires emotional maturity and work and to be aware that others are also invested in that relationship (children) and require a stable upbringing not subject to the whims of a selfish parent.

But none of that is new! Sure, the divorce rates were lower in the past, and more infidelities, out of wedlock pregnancies etc were covered up, but the shagging around is as old as time. As amply demonstrated by people tracing their family tree and/or using DNA databases.

In my own family alone, my grandfather discovered in late middle age he was the result of a bigamous marriage and that the ‘sailor’ father he barely knew had at least one other wife and family, and, on the other side of the family, the baby (stillborn) with which my grandmother was pregnant when she married my grandfather wasn’t his child but that of a married neighbour.

A great-uncle of mine emigrated to the US in the 30s, with the plan that he’d send the fares for his wife and children once he’d settled and found work. Never heard from again, it was assumed he’d died, until a letter arrived twenty years later from his widowed second wife in Wisconsin asking his parents for financial help. She had some idea there had been another family at home, and I don’t think it was all that unusual.

A friend discovered in the late nineties that the woman she’d grown up thinking of as her mother was in fact her grandmother, and her eldest ‘sister’ was her mother.

Another friend, showed his parents his very warts and all memoir about growing up gay in smalltown Ireland before its publication. His eightysomething mother was absolutely fine with all the gay sex. The only thing she asked him to conceal was the fact that her own parents had separated discreetly in the 1950s, and her father had, no divorce being possible, lived with another woman in the same small town, while showing up to go to mass with his wife and children on Sundays.

It’s not new.

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