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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask for EHCP advice!

11 replies

HelpWithEHCP · 18/12/2024 16:51

Hi,

Sorry in advance for a super long post - just want to include as much detail as possible.
Ive been doing some research online and am struggling to find the answers as the case is quite complex.

My younger sister has an EHCP; she is 21 with autism and global development delay. She is nonverbal, has behavioural challenges, generalised anxiety and presents as a very young child generally.

During her last year of secondary school, it seemed there was an incident at school which made her stop wanting to attend (I feel she may have misbehaved and a teacher raised their voice to her, which is something she is very sensitive about and will hold grudges about). She began coming to school but refusing to go into class, sometimes sitting in the corridor or in the playground for the whole day. When it came time to attend college, she had no transition in place (and is very rigid with her routine and anxious about change) and ultimately refused to attend the building, so online sessions took place and tutors visited her at home a few times a week, which is something the college offers. That placement randomly broke down; one day the college said they couldn’t offer her a placement for next year, which was a surprise to us.
Fast forward to now, she has a home tutor who attends 3 days a week for two hours. He is lovely but the work he brings is way above the level of my sister which causes her to get frustrated and not engage.

My issue is with the LA - the home tutoring is not fulfilling the provision in Section F of her EHCP and is not addressing her communication, SEMH and motor needs. E.g. Section F says she will receive a high level of support and intervention to develop gross motor skills’. The provision is not quantified well (e.g. no specific interventions/strategies mentioned, use of ‘ongoing OT support’ rather than specific hours per year etc). There is also no mention of SLT support despite the fact that she’s non verbal and can’t sign due to poor fine motor skills! What can I do about this? Can this be taken to tribunal if the LA refuse to provide what is set out in Section F? Can we require the LA to get SLT to assess my sister and provide SLT input in Section F based on her obvious needs set out in Section B? Can we require the LA to amend Section F and specify and quantify the provision appropriately? Or is it too late as the plan has been finalised? I’m currently putting together an email to send to the LA.

I’m sure this question will be asked, but I’m trying to take the lead on this as my parents have other children, full time jobs and I think they’re just too stressed to keep on top of things efficiently. I just want to ensure my sister gets all the support she needs before it’s too late.

OP posts:
CatEatDogWorld · 18/12/2024 16:58

You can call an emergency EHCP review right now. Discuss all of those things there and ask for update assessments such as SALT, OT and Ed psych.

Contact your local SENDIASS service for free advice before the review and see if they can provide someone to come to the meeting with you.

Soontobe60 · 18/12/2024 17:14

The PP has given good advice, but there are other issues that need to be considered too. Does your sister have a Deputy via the Court of Protection? If so, that person needs to act in her best interests. How long has she had an EHCP?

Pigletpoglet · 18/12/2024 17:14

The information in the EHCP can only be from professional reports. Despite the fact that LAs have to create specified and quantified EHCPs, they will do everything they can to avoid this, including directing LA Educational Psychologists not to specify and quantify provision. If the provision in Section F is not specified and quantified, they will not provide it. The LA are very unlikely to commission a SALT or OT report if your sister is not currently having SALT via the NHS.
They will act illegally, but they will require you to take them to tribunal to make them provide a specified and quantified EHCP. Current tribunal waiting list is 15 months in most areas.
I don't know what the family's financial situation is like, but the things that will help are:
>A tribunal ready independent EP assessment and report (approx £2500 plus extra to actually attend tribunal and defend the report).
>Independent SALT and OT reports, also tribunal ready and preferably highly specialist SALT and a sensory integration specialist OT (approx £800 each, plus costs to attend tribunal)
>An advocate or a lawyer. Advocates are totally unregulated so there are many dodgy ones out there. Empowering SEND Families are good. Lawyers are prohibitively expensive. About £10k if you end up at tribunal. We paid nearly £2k recently just for ours to attend annual review.

A good starting point would be to request an updated EP assessment from the LA (template letter here). If that is accepted (4-6 month wait for first EHCNA, so probably longer), then it can be used at annual review or emergency annual review. Your other option is to call an emergency review, point out that the current Section F is not being provided, and then use the LA complaints procedure when they do nothing about it.

It's really shit, and it's really tough, and the LA will pull all sorts of stunts to reduce their costs, and they will string out the process as long as possible in the hope of never having to actually fund the provision. I'm sorry.

Template letter 2: asking for a re-assessment of a child or young person’s needs

CLICK TO DOWNLOAD: Asking for a re-assessment of a child or young person’s needs (template letter 2) When should I ask? You may wish to request a re-assessment if you believe that: the needs of your child, or as a young person your needs, have ch...

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/asking-for-a-re-assessment-of-a-child-or-young-persons-needs

HelpWithEHCP · 18/12/2024 17:23

CatEatDogWorld · 18/12/2024 16:58

You can call an emergency EHCP review right now. Discuss all of those things there and ask for update assessments such as SALT, OT and Ed psych.

Contact your local SENDIASS service for free advice before the review and see if they can provide someone to come to the meeting with you.

Thanks for your response. I forgot to mention in my post that an emergency review happened earlier this year. I did research and asked my parents to request this (I couldn’t attend as I was at university) and she said that his EHCP coordinator was taking it to panel, but they didn’t hear anything back from her and he now has a new coordinator who I will be contacting in the morning to chase up the result of the panel.

Another concern I have is that my parents haven’t been keeping on top of things/pushing for different outcomes and I’m just worried it hasn’t been left too late?

I will contact SENDIASS tomorrow to try and get some further advice.

OP posts:
HelpWithEHCP · 18/12/2024 17:25

Soontobe60 · 18/12/2024 17:14

The PP has given good advice, but there are other issues that need to be considered too. Does your sister have a Deputy via the Court of Protection? If so, that person needs to act in her best interests. How long has she had an EHCP?

As far as I’m aware, she doesn’t have a Deputy, but I could be wrong about this whole process started when I was a child.
She’s had an EHCP for a very long time, since they were statements rather than EHCPs (again, not sure how long sorry!)

OP posts:
HelpWithEHCP · 18/12/2024 17:32

Pigletpoglet · 18/12/2024 17:14

The information in the EHCP can only be from professional reports. Despite the fact that LAs have to create specified and quantified EHCPs, they will do everything they can to avoid this, including directing LA Educational Psychologists not to specify and quantify provision. If the provision in Section F is not specified and quantified, they will not provide it. The LA are very unlikely to commission a SALT or OT report if your sister is not currently having SALT via the NHS.
They will act illegally, but they will require you to take them to tribunal to make them provide a specified and quantified EHCP. Current tribunal waiting list is 15 months in most areas.
I don't know what the family's financial situation is like, but the things that will help are:
>A tribunal ready independent EP assessment and report (approx £2500 plus extra to actually attend tribunal and defend the report).
>Independent SALT and OT reports, also tribunal ready and preferably highly specialist SALT and a sensory integration specialist OT (approx £800 each, plus costs to attend tribunal)
>An advocate or a lawyer. Advocates are totally unregulated so there are many dodgy ones out there. Empowering SEND Families are good. Lawyers are prohibitively expensive. About £10k if you end up at tribunal. We paid nearly £2k recently just for ours to attend annual review.

A good starting point would be to request an updated EP assessment from the LA (template letter here). If that is accepted (4-6 month wait for first EHCNA, so probably longer), then it can be used at annual review or emergency annual review. Your other option is to call an emergency review, point out that the current Section F is not being provided, and then use the LA complaints procedure when they do nothing about it.

It's really shit, and it's really tough, and the LA will pull all sorts of stunts to reduce their costs, and they will string out the process as long as possible in the hope of never having to actually fund the provision. I'm sorry.

Thanks for your response.

This was quite a depressing read for me (which I’m sure was not your intention)! We aren’t financially in a position to afford any of that unfortunately.

Do you have any idea under what grounds the LA could refuse to commission reports? Although she isn’t currently receiving support from OT, this is the failing of the LA as her EHCP says she needs ongoing input from OT. And I understand there’s no SLT in the EHCP but surely being non verbal and only being able to make limited phonic sounds would be a solid ground for SLT input?

Section f says ‘ongoing input from OT’ does this mean the LA can avoid providing my sister with any OT support?

OP posts:
Pigletpoglet · 18/12/2024 18:06

The LA have 8 weeks to provide the result of the emergency review (from the date of the review) - if this hasn't been provided then you can complain to the LGO. That sometimes gets things moving!

Unfortunately the whole system is depressing. The LA don't need any grounds to refuse to do reports - they will usually just refuse and hope that they get away with it, knowing that you will have to take them to tribunal to get anything done about it.

With 'ongoing input from the OT' in Section F, it should be possible to get an OT assessment and/or some OT input. But again - I wouldn't bank on it. They will probably say that as she is not known to the OT service, they can't do it. Same with SALT. It might be helpful to get your sister referred into the NHS speech and language service locally - then at least you stand a chance of getting a report from them that will have to be considered.

The EHCP facebook groups can be helpful - lots of parents on there with a good knowledge of the system who are keen to be helpful. Empowering Families do recorded webinars with resources that are about £15, so much more accessible (I don't work for them, I promise! I've just seen their stuff and it's good quality).

BrightYellowTrain · 18/12/2024 18:25

Provision detailed, specified and quantified in F of EHCPs can be enforced, via judicial review if necessary.

However, you describe a vague and woolly EHCP which isn’t worth the paper it is written on and isn’t enforceable.

Your sister, or someone on her behalf, can appeal to SENDIST when you next have the right of appeal. You should appeal B&F at least. Maybe also section I. And maybe C, D, G and H. During the appeal process, you can look at independent assessments - e.g. ed psych, SALT, OT, ISW. DS can be assessed for legal aid in her own right. If eligible, legal aid can cover independent assessments. If DS isn’t eligible for legal aid but affording independent assessments would be too much, Parents in Need may be able to help.

When was the early review? Following the review, the LA should have informed DS/someone acting on her behalf about whether they proposed to amend or not within 4 weeks of the review meeting. Did they do this? If not, email the LA reminding them of their duty and threatening judicial review. If that doesn’t work, you need a pre-action letter. Complaining and then going to the LGO is not a suitable remedy because it takes too long. If they were going to amend, they then have a further 8 weeks to finalise.

You could request a reassessment of needs, but a) there’s no guarantee the LA will agree to a reassessment and b) even if they did the reports may be poor &/or the LA may water down B&F, which will still leave you needing to appeal.

Be careful with SENDIASS. Some are good, but many repeat the LA’s unlawful policies and practices. IPSEA and SOSSEN are better for accurate information.

Soontobe60 · 18/12/2024 21:15

I think you may have problems getting any professionals to discuss your sister with you as you are not her legal guardian. As a retired Senco, I would not have discussed a student with their sibling. You need to speak to your parent.

WanderfulTonight · 18/12/2024 21:35

@HelpWithEHCP
Panels are a load of old crap and are not part of the legal process. Sounds like the LA have mentioned it to fob you off and give you false hope.

The NHS reports are not usually worth the paper they're written on. I know of a non verbal child who gets 5 hours A YEAR SALT input!!

In your position, find a local Facebook group that supports people with disabilities and ask advice on a local group. Parents of kids with SEND usually have a wealth of knowledge.

SOS:SEN do some really good courses for around £10 and they have two really good booklets for £5 each for EHCPs and Appeals. They might be your starting point.

You really will need private reports to get any proper provision. But they don't need to be that expensive. We've paid a few hundred pounds for OT and SALT. An Ed Psych near us is about £600 but some of them go up to £1,500. We put our experts down on the Tribunal form but never actually used them. If you have a strong case then the LA usually folds before it gets to Tribunal.

Does your sister get PIP and Universal Credit? If so, could you use some of that money to pay for reports. If not, that's another thing to apply for. Contact Citizens Advice for support with filling in those forms. Also, look into Direct Payments from the 0-25 social care team.

Michael Charles on FB is a solicitor who fights for the little man so maybe ask for some advice and support from him?

RE:SEND us a Community Interest Company that a friend of mine has used in her County and she says they're amazing. Perhaps contact them for advice. They're near London, I think.

Sunshine Support also offer advice to people too.

IPSEA also have leaflets and template letters that could help you.

The only thing I'd say is that you cannot trust your LA as far as you can throw them. They will not have your sister's best interests at heart sadly. It's all about saving money...

WanderfulTonight · 18/12/2024 21:38

I've also found SENDIAS to be utterly useless to be honest. I've rung them a couple of times for help and they have just spouted the same rubbish that comes out of the LA months even though they're meant to be independent of the LA. I think they get the same rubbish training!

So, just be careful of them...

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