to think home ed families are going to have to accept more oversight?

[DrZaraCarmichael]

To try to prevent more cases like Sara Sharif. Taken out of school - where teachers were raising concerns - and then apparently fell off the radar.

Yes children's services have to look long and hard at themselves but taking a child out of school, especially when there has been previous SS involvement, has to raise a whole field of red flags surely??

I can see how families who are home educating for the right reasons and who have nothing to hide will see this as intrusive and unnecessary. But something has to change, right?

He’s really mixing up HE with children at risk in their own home. Even children in school every day still go home each afternoon. The huge issue he’s glossing over is the incompetence of SS in this case. Yes HE does need a few more checks here and there but the big changes are needed within SS

HE parents have to make an annual report to the LA. It has to be approved. The LA keep records of all local HE kids.

The law as it stands allows LA to request it, but there is nothing that requires home educating parents to do so and absolutely nothing that requires it to be approved. Parents can literally just submit a philosophy of education if they become registered (it's not required, most areas do not have a systematic way for parents to do it themselves so largely happens when a parent is reported by someone else) and they can refuse to give further details and unless there is evidence of a lack education, the LA can do nothing.

That's been the position and the issue for decades - the LA technically have responsibilities there, but they have no real powers to do anything.

The records kept are largely ass covering - I've had this. Someone reports my kids to SS for not being in school, they pass it on to the LA who can report that they are registered. Nevermind that the last report I gave them was years before and no one from the LA had seen me in years, they had paperwork, they could tick the box.

Im so sorry to hear you're going through this. We had something similar and had to ban any mention of the word 'school' etc in front of my son - it was so triggering for him. Once I started unschooling him and just giving him a calm space to be, with no demands on him to learn, he started to recover. But to the ignorant onlooker, they would see a parent allowing their son to sit in his PJs watching telly rather than a traumatised young person who needed time and space to recover. He is now doing well and I have no regrets about doing what I had to do to support his recovery.

Why does someone disagreeing with school as a concept put their children at a higher risk of abuse (which is what you ostensibly started this thread to talk about)? Now you're already saying that parents who home educate due to certain philosophical beliefs should be checked on more.

No, it's just one of many factors which should be looked at. If the children are happy, healthy, engaged, being educated, integrating into society by attending clubs or activities, seeing their GP/dentist, their parents' philosophical beliefs are irrelevant. However, if the parents' philosophical beliefs mean that they disengage from society and actively keep their children hidden away and isolated, then how can that NOT raise red flags?

So without oversight, what do we do about for instance the kids being withdrawn from school by fundamentalist religious parents (of whatever persuasion)? Shrug and say meh?

Says the person with little idea of the crisis in education in the UK

You have no idea of systems I have researched. Fundamentally children in this country are being damaged by the school system here.
Why this isn't a problem in other countries won't be the same across the board. But we live here were currently we can legal home ed and the school system is making considerable children suicidal
So within the parameters of the UK I would rather my child be alive and home educated than at school until they succeed in suicide. Education level is irrelevant if they end up succeed after all.

I don't know why you think SEN, autism, bullying, suicidal teens and ebsa are UK-specific, but they are not

See, some families choose to home educate as a lifestyle choice for their families. An example would be world-schoolers. They believe immersive travel provides real education; so would disagree with school as a concept.

I am not comfortable deeming these families higher risk - just because they do not subscribe to the status quo.

Obviously not UK specific, but the school system approach in the UK is the national curriculum here is UK specific

Other countries also have non-SEN-friendly school systems. They allow homeschooling, but provide oversight. This is not hard to understand.

Fair enough. The problem is when that blends into giving kids an e.g. fundie religious education. Where do you draw the line?

The system here has deteriorated beyond what society realises.
SEN children have always been a thing in the UK. But we didn't have the number sof children unable to cope previously. The level of testing, the stringent non flexible curriculum that has to fit in too much is not working for these children.

Teachers are leaving in droves because of the stress of the curriculum.

Schools in the UK are in crisis. Families with SEN in the UK children are being failed.

The awful death at her families hands was a failure of social services.,. Let's not lose sight of what is of vital importance here and that is properly funded and fully staffed social services so that families known to be risk are properly monitored.

Once we have SS sorted then we can look at ensuring every child has the option of an education that's fit for purpose and meets the child's needs. So that no family or s forced to HE BM(but with it still.an option for those who want to)

Would love my child to be at school but they can't . I would love to return to my career that I loved but gave up because the LA failed my child.

This is the thing isn’t. It’s difficult to legislate on a family’s home life.

I actually have no problem with families having faith centred home education. Just like I have no problem with faith schools.

What about the kids in school whose have parents who have extreme religious beliefs? That example is not something peculiarly to HE families. As an ex teacher I met a LOT more nut job parents than I have ever done whilst home educating. HE parents by default tend to be dedicated parents going above and beyond the call of duty.

School can do nothing if a parent decides to remove them from school. NOTHING.
YES they inform the LA but that is the end of school involvement. They can't contact the parent as no longer have any authority.

Unless your school did NOT inform the LA, they have done everything correctly and expected.

If LA didn't follow up, then they are at fault.

2 cases at our school.
We had a young boy with SEND removed for home Ed. Fortunately older sibling stayed in school so we still had contact with family, everything great

Other case. Rec child removed. Parents did a midnight flit from the area. A yr later his records were still held centrally and hadn't been picked up by another school.
School wise we had no idea what happened although ss had been involved so they may have known.

It's how families slip through the net. We foster and at least once a yr ss do an 'unannounced ' visit where they see living conditions and speak with our kids.

KIds with parents with strange beliefs who go to school, also get exposed to more usual beliefs at school.
Not all HE families do so from good motivations, just as not all families with kids in school send them to school from good motivations.

Children not attending schools are a t a much higher risk

The LA can issue an Attendance Order if there is no proof the child is not receiving a suitable education.

Evidence of this ?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce902xn5kjdo

This child was missing for two years before it was noticed. Now presumed murdered. This is a cross border case in Ireland/Northern Ireland.

Children with SEND are at a higher risk too, and probably make up a higher percentage of HE children.

Children with SEND are often home educated because the LA can not meet their needs.

So less would need to be home educated if LA actually met their needs

@Changeagain3 absolutely. However, the proportion of children in Special schools noted with risk is usually quite high, again probably because even though their child is in Special school, parents aren't getting extra help outside school.

The school did everything right and I can't begin to îmagine the stress those poor staff have been going through as they get hauled over the coals despite doing nothing wrong. They will have cared about this little girl and be suffering her loss.
I'm fed up of the "lessons must be learned" narrative. The system is under-resourced and underfunded and no amount of case reviews are going to fix that. Invest properly in social services so that they can actually do their job properly. No wonder social workers are leaving in their droves.

Legally issuing an attendance order is very difficult. Anyone with any intelligence can easily make sure that never happens.
I know a mum who has produced template reports and gives them to parents and advises them just to add their children's names and a few sentences about their interests. This is then submitted as proof the children are receiving an education.
In HE social media groups there are always posts from parents saying - we deregistered nearly a year ago and I have had an email saying I have to submit a report about the education we have been doing. But we haven't been doing anything, please help. Follow up reveals the child spends hours and hours every day playing computer games and occasionally watches some youtube. Advisers tell her how to write this down as a report that demonstrates the child is receiving an education.
There are some brilliant HE parents. There is also a lot that are not. It is a bit of a shit show out there.