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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

...to suggest that us women need to band together?

11 replies

sunstreaming · 05/12/2024 09:53

I've never started a thread before, but here goes. I'm appalled by the reports of Greg Wallace's behaviour. He is, in my opinion, a rather inadequate individual, who can only get what he thinks is attention and 'respect' by opening his mouth and letting the contents of his immature and sleazy brain come out. The sort of behaviour which would be excusable perhaps in a younger male, who hadn't had the benefit of good parenting and guidance. And hopefully, someone would be straightforward with such a person and set them on the right track. The people who have to listen to Wallace , or endure his grubby paws on their person are in a bit of a bind if they have signed NDAs. And if these are women, then he has his victims served up to him on a plate. Maybe NDAs need to be radically amended or abolished altogether. But I know many people complained about his behaviour to their superiors and nothing was done. I wonder if some of the males in positions of power actually rather envy him and the attention he gets and the way he can act with impunity. So they are part of the problem. But as with many things wrong with our world, it will take us women to sort it out.
The 'Me Too' movement was very powerful and brought a lot of very bad behaviour into the public realm and also named and shamed some pretty awful characters. But that Movement hasn't got the novelty value now and so doesn't attract enough attention. I'm not thinking about starting something similar, but wonder whether in our daily lives, we could all do more and encourage others to do more when men behave in obnoxious ways, to put a stop to it. Rather in the way that we would, I hope, as Mothers or mature people, call out and correct younger people (boys and girls) when they are rude, often due to impulsiveness and 'not knowing any better'. I don't think I'm explaining myself very well (sorry!) and I'm certainly not victim-blaming, but I think as a society we need to stop tolerating behaviour like this and assertively say why, at the time and to the perpetrator. I know this is hard to do and can bring on all sorts of vile and demeaning comments from the offender. But we need to stop letting them get away with it and allowing ourselves to feel embarrassed, put down and dominated. We often feel embarrassed FOR them, which is ridiculous! Even more, we need to continue to educate the men in our lives (which can be like rolling a stone up a hill in some cases) so they call out their peers when unacceptable things are said and done. This sort of poor behaviour can only be controlled by many of us acting together. As with dog fouling, but that's a whole other hornet's nest!
So - what are your experiences of trying to assert yourself in these situations? Any advice? Let's not allow this to be swept under the carpet and continue to feel victimised and helpless.

OP posts:
Hoardasurass · 05/12/2024 10:14

Thing is women have been calling this sort of behaviour out for years and nothing changes its men who need to deal with it but they just don't care enough to do so

WhoPutTheBomp · 05/12/2024 10:16

Hoardasurass · 05/12/2024 10:14

Thing is women have been calling this sort of behaviour out for years and nothing changes its men who need to deal with it but they just don't care enough to do so

Yes.

A man problem in all aspects.

Depressing.

50shadesofnay · 05/12/2024 10:30

Not sexual/creepy, but vey misogynistic example here...

Mostly I try to politely extract myself from situations, but there was one conversation a few months ago that was so over the line that I didn't even bother trying to be polite. I just put my hand up in a "stop" motion and said "I'm out. You're offensive. I'm not having a conversation with you." and walked off. This man (mid 40s) was saying very loudly and emphatically that it was unacceptable for women to deny their husbands sex because men have needs... and it was even more unreasonable to divorce over it, she's made a promise so she should just stay married and deal with it. He was going on and on about how women were all money-grabbing gold diggers and how poor men are screwed over financially by women for child support payments just so they can get their hair and nails done etc etc. A second man then tried to double down on this point because his friend's ex still wore makeup and dyed her hair yet had the audacity to keep asking him for money when she obviously had enough if she was able to pay for hair care! It was just a horrible misogynistic tirade, and I could not stand for one more sentence of it.

I know on paper that a number of men feel this way, but it was so shocking to hear these men saying it with such confidence and immunity as if it was gospel truth. I have 2 sons and sincerely hope they are never like this when they are older.

EmpressaurusKitty · 05/12/2024 11:52

I was on a stall at a Christmas fair recently, selling pet toys. There was a bloke who was making jokes about big pussies and asking if some of the dog toys were sex toys.

I told him loudly that he wasn’t funny and to go away. His poor wife pulled him off with her.

I’d have like to ask if he’d always been a stupid perv or did he have to practise, but I only thought of that later.

He was probably in his 70s but none of the other men I know in that age range would say that kind of thing.

Phineyj · 05/12/2024 11:59

Yes, I employed a couple of builders at one stage who were full of "crazy ex" stories and trotting out the crap about exes spending "their" money on nails.

At least they were contractors so I had the option of never employing them again. So I didn't.

They weren't very good at their jobs either.

Phineyj · 05/12/2024 12:02

Something I do regret. I was standing in line behind a Gregg age man at the customer service desk of a garden centre and he was verbally bullying the young girl behind the counter.

Wish I'd stepped in now.

Although I did step into a verbal abuse situation on a train and that got a bit scary.

However, I've been quite impressed with British Transport Police both times something like that's happened.

heldinadream · 05/12/2024 12:15

Welcome to feminism @sunstreaming.
It's been around for thousands of years a while.

Phineyj · 05/12/2024 12:22

I've always considered myself a feminist but that doesn't mean I automatically know what to do for the best in these sadly quite common situations.

I find Mumsnet helpful for that.

FuckItItsFine · 05/12/2024 12:36

I think the tide is turning, however slowly. For example, we’ve got singers like Taylor Swift and Olivia Rodrigo writing and performing hit songs about older men who took advantage of them in inappropriate age-gap relationships.

Dear John:
Dear John, I see it all now that you're gone
Don't you think I was too young to be messed with?
The girl in the dress, cried the whole way home
Dear John, I see it all now, it was wrong
Don't you think nineteen's too young
To be played by your dark, twisted games when I loved you so?
**

Vampire:
I used to think I was smart
But you made me look so naive
The way you sold me for parts
As you sunk your teeth into me
…
And every girl I ever talked to told me you were bad, bad news
You called them crazy, God, I hate the way I called them crazy too
You're so convincing
How do you lie without flinching?
…
Went for me, and not her
'Cause girls your age know better

A whole generation of girls is growing up armed with a little bit of knowledge about the dangers of older men. It may be small, but sunlight and oxygen always help with these issues that have historically been swept under the carpet or excused, or even romanticised.

AreYouShittingMe · 05/12/2024 12:46

I was listening to a podcast recently in which the owner of a music venue was talking about the importance of grassroots music, and bands who play there over the 'likes of Taylor Swift or Dua Luipa'. He then went on to say that women need to have more of a voice in the music industry. It was the sneering way he said Taylor Swift that really got my goat. I'm not a big fan, but I recognise how empowering she has been for so many females. And he didn't get it- he thought he was being oh so supportive of women!
We've a long way to go, but I will now quietly call out this shit when I hear it, rather than shut up due to fears for my job or my safety (but will still try to keep myself safe of course).

Goldierind · 05/12/2024 18:55

I've had a pest harrass me in a job. What I now know is women do not stick up for a female going through this. They will talk about it behind your back but offer no support. Weirdly, there might have been jealousy. Bitches.I think I can see why women never report abuse or harassment.

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