To think Free Parking is the answer to revive our town centres?

[Jumell]

I’ve been thinking a bit about this lately.

Whenever I thought about going to the city centre where I used to live, to shop/browse etc - the main thing that would stop me going was the thought of paying for parking - I’d just think - ‘nah’ - and not bother going in.

i think that if the Govt took the initiative to scrap all charges from car parking companies - NCP/Councils etc etc in town centres / high streets - it would massively revive these shopping centres that we all knew and loved?

You need residents' parking, and also restrictive convenants which stop people living in central areas near public transport from purchasing vehicles. They actually have these already in some central areas of certain cities.

Meanwhile the very wealthy have underground car parks, even in the city of london or Westminster....out of sight of the plebs.

So how do people who have no chose but to rent property in the town centre, get to their place of work, travel to an airport to on holiday, go to a garden centre, visit their parents...??

The sort of "go everywhere" public transport doesn't exist and probably never will.

Its this sort of control that makes people so angry.

I stick to retail parks now. It's not for the free parking. It's because it's just a lot safer.

They're spending a small fortune "revitalising" the nearest town centre. The plans look absolutely amazing but unless they can find a way to reduce the number of druggies and criminals it'll be a complete waste.

Ask the 46% of households in London who don’t have a car, or the 40% in Manchester

they use hire car
they use bus
they use train
they use tram
they use tube
they cycle

Some are work vehicles. The residents didn’t have a problem until they built these no car flats. I’m not in London, which is why people still need a car. If they want to go into town they can use the bus or the not very safe cycle lane.
if they want to go anywhere else? Well, it’s car.

not to mention the residents of said flats can’t get tradesman to work on them because they can’t park nearby.

one more issue, how does that leave the council tenant who was offered the HA flat? If they turn it down they get kicked off the housing list, yet they need their car for work or caring.

it needs more carrot less stick. Make it easier and cheaper to use public transport, then people will use it more and won’t need a car. I want to use the trains more, it shouldn’t be cheaper to fly or get in my car and drive somewhere. I looked at getting the train somewhere for me and my family for a weekend. We are on the trainline for it, should be straightforward. £70 per person one way. Or I could do half that in fuel.

Where public transport is great and meets their needs.
where cycle lanes are abundant and safe

go 20 miles out and it’s not the case for either of those cities.

Our town does quite well. It has a decent assortment of bars/cafes/restaurants, independent greengrocer/butcher, several bakeries, a delicatessen and other small independent shops (selling things like artwork, framing services, books, records, crafting materials/classes, hardware, bikes, musical instruments, clothing). It also has a few chain shops; boots, B&M, Greggs, Costa, Superdrug, Peacocks, a decent library, a post office, a couple of bank branches, opticians, small soft play, estate agents and charity shops.

They’ve done well by providing services that appeal to the local population. People mainly walk or get train in to use them and generally seem to enjoy seeing neighbours out and about. Several of the businesses offer free local delivery with a minimum spend.

I’m sure people driving through tut and think “if there was better parking they would get my business”. Maybe they would sometime but honestly I’m unconvinced it would help overall. The town is partly so nice to walk through and shop in as it’s not all that car friendly. We walk in and shop for some bits as we need them most days. I do think once you lose a vibrant town centre it’s hard to get it back. Just having one or two decent places to visit likely isn’t enough. Lower business rates for first few years to get new business established and cheaper public transport seem better options to me than providing free parking.

Ha so Manchester and London are typical of towns across the UK? & you might ask "why don't they have a car?" most are poor and cannot afford one, 24% of all londoner's live in poverty.

Like i said, the wealthy in London etc have exclusive use of underground carparks, i ve seen them, some are huge.

Its this complete lack of thought by, usually the well off, that leads to such derision of politicians of all parties.

Life happens.
What if they become disabled?

It's not necessarily the parking issue is it. Town and city centres aren't pleasant to be in any more.for various reasons. People don't feel safe any more, it's like Dodge City with some of the clientele. Shops are closing down and there is a plethora of charity, vape , beauty and barbers shops etc.

Not sure the outer boroughs have necessarily got the memo yet. 😀

https://www.ons.gov.uk/census/maps/choropleth/housing/number-of-cars-or-vans/number-of-cars-3a/no-cars-or-vans-in-household

but the inner boroughs reinforce your point even more strongly. All comfortably over, and in many cases a long way over 40%.

Though if we overlaid that linked map with deprivation we’d probably see a pattern emerging. And likewise for thriving (or not) town centres.

What, all day every day, or just weekends? Lots of towns are wastelands during the day, Monday to Friday.

I agree. London and a handful of other huge cities aren't representative of the rest of the country when it comes to car alternatives. Most other places have pretty crap public transport with routes and timetables designed several decades ago.

The question was - So how do people who have no chose but to rent property in the town centre, get to their place of work, travel to an airport to on holiday, go to a garden centre, visit their parents...??

surely it is clear what the answer is?

Then look to cycling as an answer, as many people use a trike or bicycle as a walking aid https://wheelsforwellbeing.org.uk/my-cycle-my-mobility-aid-alistair-and-his-tricycle/

https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2018/jan/02/cambridge-disabled-people-cycling-rolling-walking-stick

MikeRafone it’s much harder for workers because there are hardly any council car parks which allow you to park for over 4 hours. Even part time workers need more that 4 hours to park up, get into work, finish work and drive off from the car park in less than 4 hours.
Like I said, not everyone is lucky enough to close to a bus stop/railway station where buses and trains run frequently and at a reasonable cost. I don’t.
I do walk, a lot, but if I need to travel by train or bus I have no choice but to drive first. The buses near me do not run frequently enough to get me to the railway station in time to start work.
There is private parking of course, but the deal the main one had with my employer has now ended when they sold up. The owner knows that it’s take it or leave it as the council don’t give a damn about those who need to park to work.
You can’t keep punishing people by making it harder and harder to drive, without offering a decent alternative.
No wonder people shop online or in out of town retail parks.

Well.... densify town centers and develop better public transport, then. (It's basically only possible to develop good public transport networks across cities if you have a lot of "heavy public transport" users in the center of town, otherwise it's just not financially possible)

The UK is very unusual in having a situation where the capital city is the only one in the whole country that has proper public transport.

In most European countries, cities the size of Leeds, Birmingham, Manchester, Sheffield etc. have much denser urban cores and good public transport, including a subway in most cases.

The attitude in the UK, that somehow decent public transport is "inherently" only possible in London and couldn't possibly be done elsewhere, is just so weird from a global perspective.

I get that I am sounding like a stuck record on this issue, but it's probably the only way if the UK wants to have decent town centers. If you don't have lots of people living at the center of cities because the vast majority of people live in houses in the suburbs, deserted town centers are almost inevitable, because you don't have a critical mass of people living on the doorstep of the town center--and the suburban dwellers will nearly always choose out-of-town shopping malls (because they have to drive anyway and out-of-town center are always, always going to beat the town center in terms of car friendliness. Because they have more space and always will do).

The UK needs to build shitloads of housing anyway. You can either build in town and densify, or you can concrete over a load of woodlands and meadows in what is already one of the world's most nature-depleted countries; your choice!

You can’t keep punishing people by making it harder and harder to drive, without offering a decent alternative.

that is the crux of the problem - but whilst you have such disparity between the money spent on driving and other transportation - this will continue. £1.6bn on roads 2024 v £100 million for active travel. Obviously you need some budget for roads, we all use them. If though the budget for active travel is far smaller then things will not change

Why online compare costs of roads against cost of active travel??

What about costs of subsidising the rail and bus networks - that's absolutely huge!

And of course, it's not just cars that use roads - what about lorries, buses, etc??

If you're going to compare, please compare like for like and not compare apples against coconuts!

I don't go anywhere where i can't drive and park, i'm happy to pay for parking and it would never discourage me. I'm not interested in public transport or cycling, never will be

I hate going into the town centre for shopping because it’s always far too busy. Definitely not dead here! We do have excellent public transport though, I’d never live anywhere car dependent.

Unlimited free parking in town centres would be taken up by commuters, so would not help bring in shoppers. A common method of payment with no apps, and a short period of free parking (say 30 minutes) probably would.

@erihskreb

I’d never live anywhere car dependent.

People who've lived in places where the buses have been massively reduced or routes scrapped altogether don't have that choice.

We lost our village bus service back in 2005! Now it's car, taxi or hospital transport as the only options.

It doesn't have to be all day free parking. Most places limit it to a few hours. Enough to spend 2/3 hours in town, but not enough for workers to hog the spaces.

I’d move! But I wouldn’t have moved somewhere without a train station in the first place