To think that UK pensions and UK isas should be invested in UK based companies

[Noras]

On Radio 4 Today

Hundreds of companies are being brought and then revenue goes off shore. The impact is devastating as the UK Gove loses the tax take which means that the burden of tax falls on fewer shoulders.

This week we could be losing Lounges, Direct Line to oversea investors. I have no idea where there will remit taxes.

Our high street is increasingly populated with companies who don’t remit in the UK so your hard earned pound is sent overseas to benefit others.

We need to invest in companies listed in the UK or continue with exorbitant tax rises on individuals eg direct tax, council tax etc.

We need to invest in UK based companies both with our individual spending but also with our pension investments.

@louddumpernoise actually many eu and non eu countries have saving schemes that are exempt from cgt - all will be structured a bit differently with different restrictions on how much can be invested, when it can be taken out, etc.

you seem to have missed the point that vehicles like ISAs make it easy and attractive for normal people to save and invest - the majority of account holders are probably ‘ordinary working people’. Saving and investment levels would be lower without ISAs or similar, so the impact of eliminating ISAs wouldn’t equate to a £7bn tax take. I also feel the need to clarify that not all ISAs are stocks/share, as you are now comparing and ISA to a high interest savings account - some ISAs are effectively high interest savings accounts

I also haven’t made any argument for the elimination of taxes so need for hyperbole - your original point was around a lifetime cap, which is poor policy in that it complicates financial planning, would likely incentivise economically undesirable behaviour and ultimately wouldn’t raise much money.

and do not fear, I pay plenty of tax without receiving any of the subsidies and transfers so many other ‘ordinary working people’ receive. That’s part of why I care so deeply about making the most of my post tax income.

Cannot find anything on tax exempt saving schemes in the EU, other than a scheme in Spain.

We've got a £1k allowance for the small saver, vast majority in the UK have very little in savings, in fact 1 in 6 have none! 25% less than £100.

I' ve ISAs, i ve also paid a lot of tax, i don't particularly want to pay more BUT i ve just paid £3k in dental treatment, i can afford that, millions cannot, i want dental care to go back to what it was 20 or 30 years ago, that requires money, i'd rather that £7bn or lets say £5bn goes to fixing NHS Dentistry, not into schemes that are used to wrap investments from Tax.

& no, i'm not going to pay voluntary tax, its pointless and would make zero difference, like trying to empty water from a sinking boat with a thimble.

Anyway, its been a interesting debate with you but we aren't going to agree, so i'm off out in the garden now.

Perhaps take a look at the laffer curve. When the higher tax rate was increased to 50%, the tax take went down. When it was reduced to 45%, the tax take went up.

If you want to get rid of ISAs then we should bring back indexation of capital gains, as used to exist. Otherwise you are just paying tax on inflation regardless of the performance of the underlying asset. But I expect the treasury have done the sums, and indexation on all gains would cost more than ISAs.

If I can speak from personal experience, I've always been a saver, but isa limits with tax free allowances and peps before them mean that we have been able to save effectively. The ability to quickly and easily switch funds to any type of investment anywhere in the world means that our investments have grown very very well.

Between us the most we have ever earnt is £44,500. We now have isa savings of over £1 million. This means that I retired last year at 55 because I have a health issues, arthritis, which my job was rapidly making worse. It's stabilised this year so I can do many things, but not the jobs I am qualified/experienced to do. I will not be able to work full time again.

This isn't a stealth boast but to say that isas mean that we will have a comfortable retirement and as my wife is the same age but her gran lived to 101 and her mum is fit and well at 92 she is likely to have a long retirement. My parents and several of their siblings were dead by my age, so I am happy that she will not have to worry about money when I am gone.