To think there's a distinct difference between acknowledging feelings and validating them

[ByGentleFatball]

Someone on another thread said that children are harmed unless their feelings are validated. I disagreed. They said acknowledgement is part of validating.

Let me propose another scenario: A man genuinely feels resentful that his wife is "preoccupied" with their newborn baby.

In my view, I can acknowledge that he genuinely feels resentful. I can even acknowledge that there is a harsh adjustment process to becoming parents. I can also refrain from validating that feeling by not inferring that it is understandable, correct, or healthy for him to feel the way he does, while emphasising that the reasons he feels that way require further (likely professional) exploration.

They are distinct things and the reason is important to differentiate this to our children is because instead of learning some feelings are harmful and wrong, they learn that they should just be selective in how they express those feelings.

"No you can't openly obstruct your friend from entering a competition or make it known you don't want her to (but if you can quietly sabotage her efforts because you feel so threatened by her, then that's okay because your feelings are valid)."

Unreasonable - acknowledging is validating or vice versa

Not unreasonable - they are distinct.

I don’t think that validating a feeling means “inferring that it is understandable, correct, or healthy” necessarily- it’s more about admitting that it’s there, and not just dismissing it. So saying something like, “I can see that you feel resentful and you probably feel it’s a justified feeling. But I disagree with you, for [reasons].” Rather than saying “Oh don’t be silly, you can’t possibly be resentful about THAT!”

It’s a point of definition. I think therapists do this on a daily basis. They acknowledge the clients feelings but it doesn’t mean that what they’ve done is ‘right’. Validating is a bit different in that it’s going into empathetic territory, as in saying ‘it’s okay to feel the way you do’. Condoning is saying ‘what you’ve done is perfectly okay’.

It's funny you used the new dad example!

He's not a toddler, but I had to make this distinction to DH today.

I am in the lucky position that I can do a long lunch twice a week on compressed hours.

I use one for exercise, and one for a pub lunch. I said that we could do that once a fortnight as we both WFH, maybe more, but sometimes I'd like to see local friends.

He was upset that I didn't want to do them all with him (fine), but although acknowledging he was upset, I wasn't going to surrender my whole social life to him.

Yanbu. But I wouldn't worry yourself about trying to demonstrate the difference to someone who has cobbled together a parenting style out of therapeutic jargon.

Oh god I hate the way therapists talk - why do people do that to their kids? Isn't it always the parents with no boundaries and uncontrollable children? That's my experience anyway.

I'd say yabu. Validating feelings is not saying the feeling are correct, and isn't about encouraging someone to act on them negatively, but it also goes beyong acknowledging. Caring is involved. Encouragement for positive action is involved, and with kids it's about teaching them how to handle their feelings positively.

It's using empathy to understand why someone might have them - and then hopefully coming to a solution from there.

You can't appropriately emotionally regulate if you've learned feelings are to be ignored and that you're wrong for simply having them.

I.e resentful husband.

Your feelings are valid, your partner had a new baby and the baby needs a lot of attention. This means you arnt getting as much attention, and that can be a hard change to deal with.

Then a discourse about how it has to be this way, he isn't loved less, os very needed, etc. That next bit can't really be done without the persons input so can't really be a script.

Re: jealous kid - saying her feelings are valid is not the same as saying she can act upon them in a destructive way. It's about understanding her p.o.v, seeing where it comes from, which will then enable you to empathise and help her put it in perspective.

You can't help someone without validating their feelings, because you can't properly help someone without taking them seriously, understanding their feelings and trying to put yourself in their shoes. Taking seriously and understanding naturally leads to validation.

And if you're not aiming to help them, then you're not part of the discussion anyway and arnt important.

Sheer delusions are the only feelings not valid. My ex had episodes of Paranoid Psychosis which gave him paranoid delusional thoughts- I.e friends were conspiring against him, no reason, no changes, things like that would just pop into his head and be overpowering for him. We weren't to validate those feelings... but that's also an entirely different scenario.

That’s acknowledging it, surely? Not validating it.

A feeling is a feeling. It is neither correct, nor incorrect. Validating a feeling is to show the person feeling it they are seen, heard and that having a feeling is ok.

How people choose to respond to feeling that feeling/emotion is what can be discussed as wrong/incorrect.

i.e. feel jealous. It’s ok to feel jealous.

• Choose to respond to that feeling of jealousy by abusing/controlling partner = wrong
• Choose to respond to that feeling of jealousy by reflecting/thinking about why and having a healthy, respectful conversation = better.

Something valid is something that’s true. So in validating a feeling you agree that it’s true for that person- but you don’t have to agree that they’re entitled to feel that way, or right to. As mentioned above, you try and acknowledge the feeling with a compassionate space to explore it and the ramifications of feeling it. @Agix put it very well and so did @OliphantJones .

The jargon used in therapy doesn't always translate very well to outside of therapy. Validation means one thing in therapy and another in real life. Its probably best to stick to plain English when you are talking about parenting your own kids, outside of a therapeutic setting.

Validating feelings does not involve agreeing with them.
It is precisely acknowledging that the person feels like that.

I disagree with OP that feelings are harmful and wrong - they are what we feel.
It's how we behave in response that can be harmful and wrong.

In the example of the husband being resentful of his wife - his feelings are not wrong or harmful. One result might be that he talks to his wife about how he feels and they agree to spend more time together with the baby as a family unit. Another result might be that he shouts at his wife and then starts spending all his evenings in the pub.

One of these is a positive outcome of the feelings. The other is not.

I understood it to mean that you are acknowledging that the person feels the way they feel. But I get what you are saying, validating seems to assume that you agree those feelings are reasonable. I would say feelings are what they are and what we teach our kids is to to be able to accurately and unashamedly label our feelings so we can acknowledge thats how we feel and that acting upon it would be inappropriate.

I think theres a lot to labelling our most negative emotions accurately and dealing with them. So lets say I’m mad and resentful at another woman because she’s popular, I should be able to accurately pinpoint my feelings to my own jealousy and it quickly becomes apparent from that, that the fault is in me not her. It doesn’t give me an excuse to be spiteful.

Your feelings are valid, your partner had a new baby and the baby needs a lot of attention. This means you arnt getting as much attention, and that can be a hard change to deal with.
Then a discourse about how it has to be this way, he isn't loved less, os very needed, etc. That next bit can't really be done without the persons input so can't really be a script.

I think that if you told him that, he would fail to see that in this situation, he is a parent. So the fact he isn't getting much attention etc shouldn't be a hard change to deal with, because it probably hasn't been forced on him. He's committed to a new role and any resentment he has about that role shift should have been handled long before. This reassurance you're giving is saying to him "ahh poor baby, so hard done by, life is tough for you, you'll have to take a back seat to the baby for a while (selfish little.bugger it is) but you'll be back in the throne soon where you should be".

You see I think that leads to sneaky behaviour. If someone feels on some level that they are right to feel how they feel. That it's understandable that they feel the way they do etc etc, they'll learn that their "valid" feeling is being repressed and this is unfair. It exacerbates their victim mentality. Therefore they start to try to get what they can furtively without being forthcoming about their true feelings. It encourages people to be manipulative to get what they feel because they deserve but the world is pitted against them.

Well that response is the opposite of validating feelings. You are essentially telling the person that they have no right to feel as they feel. Which is exactly the behaviour that can be harmful for children (to go back to the OP).

When I was a new mum I was sometimes resentful that the need to care for a baby meant that I had to give up lots of the things I did pre-children. What was helpful was coming on sites like MN and having people tell me that everyone feels like that sometimes and it's quite normal, and to make sure to carve out some time for me, even if it was something small. Telling me that I had committed to a new role and any resentment about that role shift should have been handled long before ... would not have been helpful.

You cannot police people’s feelings and label them as right or wrong. As I said, a feeling is neither correct, nor incorrect. It just IS. A feeling can never be stopped or prevented by the person feeling it. It can only be hidden, which is a huge contributing factor to many societal problems. Shaming someone for feeling something or insisting someone is ‘wrong’ to feel something is a damaging approach.
Recognising and naming a negative emotion and acknowledging that someone has this feeling is not a bad thing. There are many ways to discuss a feeling and how one could/should react to it that doesn’t encourage poor behaviours. This is what we need in society. You don’t have to suggest the feeling is understandable or reasonable...much of the time feelings are neither of those things...but they are still real for the person feeling them. Acknowledging opens the door for further conversations about why the feeling is there, what strategies can be used to manage it and what the healthy, emotionally intelligent response to it should be.
Shaming or insisting a feeling is wrong simply encourages bottling up and never learning how to manage it effectively.

Changing your thoughts, can change your feelings. Unless they are validated in they'll be reinforced as acceptable.

For several complex reasons, this example is quite different to the one I gave of a new dad.