To say that being kind isn’t always the most important thing?

[SharpCyanDuck]

Sometimes being firm or even “mean” gets better results than being endlessly compassionate. Are we too focused on “niceness?”

I agree.

Yes, I agree. Being kind is often just being cowardly or weak, and letting people get away with crap, which actually be less kind for them in the long run.

Totally agree.

When you boil it down “Be Kind” is just another way of saying “STFU”. And usually to women

You can be kind and compassionate whilst still being firm and forceful.

People like this make the best parents and the best work managers imo.

I also think the whole 'being kind' movement sometimes has the result of silencing women in particular from being assertive. Men don't seem to be told to 'be kind' all the time.

I want DDs to be kind obviously but not to their own detriment or to feel unable to challenge anything or be assertive because they've been told to 'be kind'. Not everything needs someone being 'kind' in response. Sometimes being kind is actually doing what might not seem kind at first.

There is too much a lack of context here…

What's the saying...

Sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind

Agree OP.

I must be cruel to be kind - Shakespeare nailed it

You'd have to give some examples, can't tell what you are thinking of. 'Firm' is not the opposite of 'kind'; you can be both at the same time. 'Mean' by definition isn't a good way to go.

Exactly this. It's a mare as at my daughter's secondary "Be kind" is preached a lot. They've learnt I don't really buy into it and I recall a distinct conversation where I told them "my DD does not need to make herself smaller to accommodate two violent delinquent boys you can't get a grip on". The issues now been dealt with.

DD is now showing that be kind can have its place, but will also speak up when needed.

Totally agree. I think the ‘if you can be anything, be kind’ mantra is shit advice, disproportionately told to women and girls.

Being mean to get better results seems a pretty nasty way to live

Yes "be kind" is often used to shut women up but like everything in life it's a balance

Living shouldn't be focussed on "results" but on the quality of your life - and that's determined mostly by your human interactions - even the ones your don't like

I find it useful to think "are they being unkind to me" as a judge for when be kind is clearly wrong - in many cases "if you can't say anything nice keep your mouth shut" may be a better line to follow

Nothing extreme- a bit of both and a bit of give and take

I think being good is more important than being kind. Sometimes that means telling people a hard truth (you don’t have to be an arsehole about it). I think overly identifying with people doesn’t always help them, sometimes being direct and telling someone to suck it up and they can do it is more “good” than patting them on the hand being “kind” and they don’t get anywhere. I’ve had some home truths told to me that I needed to hear, painful, but did me good.

The bekind shite is toxic for women, it can get in the bin. It’s emotionally manipulative nonsense.

Agree with pp that you can be kind and firm. They are not exclusive.

However, you need to give us the context if you want honest opinions.

I'd rather have a kind partner than a 'firm' one

What is the "be kind movement". What is it actually advocating (apart from the bleeding obvious). I mean, how does it manifest in practice? Genuine question.

Being kind is a good thing. There is nowhere near enough kindness about.

However (and it’s a big one…) the whole ‘Be kind’ thing has been hijacked and weaponised so that people are no longer allowed (however fairly or reasonably) to say things that other people may need to (but don’t want to) hear.

It’s become another way for people to be avoidant about being told things that may be difficult or uncomfortable to hear - but are also necessary, personally or professionally.

Most of us don’t have anywhere near good enough ‘soft skills’ to be able to respectfully but robustly navigate difficult conversations well.

This is really vague and I think both can apply depending on the situation.

Being kind by allowing a person with a couple of items to go ahead of you with a trolley full of stuff in the supermarket queue = fine

Being firm by not allowing them to try and take your credit card to pay for it with = also fine.

I think you are unclear about the actual meaning of these words OP...

Being a kind and decent human being does not mean being a pushover. You can be a kind person and have firm boundaries, a lot of self-confidence and know how to stand up for yourself.

Being 'mean' does not mean being strong and standing your ground. It means being a bully type that enjoys putting other people down. Not something to aspire to.

I strive to be a decent and kind human being but I never put up with bullshit from people. I have no interest in being a bully however.

Much better to have both.

Someone who's kind but who will also advocate for you and your family.

Not some wet lettuce who can't even tell the nextdoor neighbour to use their own bin.

"Honesty without kindness is just brutality.
Kindness without honesty is just manipulation."

The best kindness has a lot of strength behind it.