Awaiting _____ diagnosis

[Bozzul]

I work in a school and we obviously have pupils with SEND, who have certain strategies we use with them and a number of others to monitor and trial things to include them.

All of them have attached documents to let staff know what's needed, but there's currently a trend for adding a sentence to say huge numbers of pupils are awaiting a diagnosis - awaiting dyslexia diagnosis, awaiting ADHD diagnosis etc.

They're not. They're still awaiting being assessed, and often because someone unqualified to judge has decided it's possible or suits them. But it might not be the case that a diagnosis is made (I'm thinking that the chances our school have such numbers compared to national data aren't high)

I'm all for doing what works for each child, and if they have tendencies that are normally addressed in a certain way, then of course these things can be used to help them too, but I don't think it's helpful to staff or pupils to imply issues which haven't been diagnosed.

Edited, helpful TO either staff or pupils

And I'm saying the way is being paved for this now. It will be too late next year, but there's time for this to be so.

I'm saying it isn't levelling the playing field, because some are being given an unfair advantage.

Thanks. Exactly that. The admin staff in DD's school are great. I'm sure they aren't writing judgemental, shitty posts on MN aboutthe SEN kids.

I'm saying these aren't glaring. OP, where did you get your medical degree from? Because assessment is because you CAN'T tell just looking.

Wondering if you’re my child’s teacher. She’s formally diagnosed as autistic is on a very long waiting list for adhd assessment (after us having to undergo a long pre-assessment process including in person and zoom meetings) has been her entire time at the school and refused exam adjustments because she seemed fine to the “self diagnosed expert” in ASN.

Now were going to have to have multiple communications with the school justifying her need for support because some idiot with an opinion on how she should appear or behave in public gets to decide whether or not she gets help based on their own prejudices.

people like OP shouldn’t be allowed near kids in an educational setting holding such judgmental attitudes

Yanbu. Too high a proportion of parents think their child's struggles are beyond the norm, if everyone has "additional needs" no one does (ifyswim). If we are getting to the point where the majority of children apparently aren't having their needs met without extra support it probably implies that:

• the expectations on children in schools are not consistent with what's developmentally normal for most children based on historical standards
• societal/parental factors are impacting on children's development such that they cannot meet expectations that used to be considered normal for age without additional support/adjustments
• the threshhold for what people consider as a level of difference/impairment warranting intervention has fallen too low to be meaningful.

I suspect there is some mix of all three happening.

My Dr and therapist were so convinced that I have ADHD that they put me forward for ADHD therapies. I was being treated in 3 weeks. It was life changing.

But I'm still on the list to be officially diagnosed 3 years later.

What's ridiculous is that we've come to a point where the waiting lists are so short for treatment, but so long for diagnosis. Would you rather these kids just survive in limbo til a diagnosis is given?

My Dr said to just put that I have ADHD on all medical forms from now on.

I think a lot of people don't realise that

1 in 3 kids now get extra time in exams.

1 in 3.

Its not a high bar to get it access to that extra time if a third of all kids do. Its also going to dilute the benefit it has for those who need that time the most, if there are children who need it less who get it.

You're a TA, you don't know anything about data and figures, be so for real!

Go get a degree in the medical field and be involved in some research into these types of diagnoses, then come and tell us you think people are lying.

FO!

I agree OP.

Where are you getting these statistics from? They are at odds with the official government statistics.

In the academic year 23/24, there were 1.4 million candidates taking exams in the 2023 to 2024 academic year. 419,960 has 25% extra time. 7,625 had more than 25% extra time.

Or are you misunderstanding the statistics? 67.2% of access arrangements approved (rather than of all candidates) were for 25% extra time, 1.2% for more than 25% extra time.

You can see the actual statistics here.

It's not so much medical knowledge in this case as it's needing an awareness of logistics.

The work involved to evidence ordinary ways of working, to go through various screenings, assorted trials of management and referral for assessment is considerable for each child. Beyond the most severely affected children who need things done formally immediately, focus has to be where it is most critical - the GCSE years - so getting everything in order in Year 10 ready for access arrangements to be identified and Form 8s submitted with

' ● the history of difficulties, for example, with the development of literacy skills; ● the results of screening tests; ● individual education/learning plans in place for the candidate; ● school reports; ● pupil tracking data; ● information reported by subject teachers and/or support staff. '

and then approved by the JCQ, recorded and stored suitably not just for day to day use but for the inevitable JCQ inspections during the exams season, is a massive task.

Once Year 10 are done with any late/missed previously Year 11s dealt with as quickly as humanly possible, the 7s, 8s and 9s with less severe presentations are handled. But with the numbers in any school, staffing, assessment and time constraints mean that it's less likely that the 7/8/9s will be dealt with quickly. This causes a spike in SEND recording in Year 10 by itself, completely separately from any increase due to hormones, puberty, social or emotional aspects.

Where we live, the waiting list for an NHS assessment for children is now more than 4 years. They will not allow you to join the waiting list unless you are almost certainly likely to have a diagnosis following multiple pre-assessment checks. While schools acknowledge private diagnoses (if they follow NHS procedures) they are not in our area (Cardiff) accepted until you have gone through the NHS neurodevelopmental pathway (this includes adults and young people diagnosed through the NHS in England who move here to study at uni according to our GP). We have a private diagnoses from the same consultant we will see on the NHS, but it cannot be accepted until we have been assessed again (exactly same forms and process, exactly same doctor) when we get to the top of the waiting list in 6 months to a year's time.

It is for situations like ours that many schools will put this down.

I think I know what you mean. My friend is a primary teacher and has 15 in a class of 29 who are listed as having adhd/autism or on the assessment pathway. When 50% of the class are all behaving the same way, is it neurodivergence or is it the new normal?

This is a generation of children, many of whom had a lack of socialisation during lockdown, many relied on screens while parents were working during lockdown, many have screens constantly and have never experienced the boredom of a long jouney without one. All of this is bound to have an effect on children. Perhaps there is a national shift and teachers need to deal with a new baseline of children. Alternatively, perhaps many parents spent more time with their children during lockdown and noticed more adhd/autistic traits in their children because they were seeing them more than if they had been away from them at school/work for 7/8 hours.

Whatever the reason, there is obviously a surge and that is shown by the waiting lists for assessments.

In my DS's class (age 7) it does seem that there are more children with tools/strategies/interventions than those without. There are 5 in the class with wobble cushions, another 3 with chewy things, 4 who do additional movement breaks, 3 who wear ear defenders, 1 who arrives late/leaves early to avoid the chaos of the other children arriving and leaving... probably more things less visible that I don't know about.

I don't know what the answer is, but I think that your class of 17 probably IS reflective of the wider population, it will just take a while for the statistics to catch up.

Ha! Fuck off.

You’re showing yourself up, OP. You’re making unfounded assumptions based on dots on a sheet, and zero medical knowledge. Does the dot spell out somewhere exactly who is “awaiting diagnosis” or “awaiting assessment” and who is audaciously just wanting extra time in exams for their kids? You really can’t just say ‘I think my kid is autistic’ without evidence to support this, if you want any help at all for your child. Go to the SEN threads and see how people with children who have significant (and even diagnosed!) challenges, are having to fight tooth and nail for every little tiny thing.

You’re as ignorant as these people who think everyone just asks for higher rate DLA for a sore finger and then gets handed a ‘FREE CAR’. I hope you’re working nowhere near my kids, you need to have a word with yourself, you’re petty and ill informed and shouldn’t be spreading it around.

No it isn’t. I work in a primary with SEN figures a lot higher than the national average. We don’t have this.

Even if we did we wouldn’t resent the children or dismiss their struggles.

I agree with this. This is a very eloquent explanation of what may be going on.

You work in a school and are surprised by this?! I'm guessing you're not a teacher then.
Although most of the support staff, I would say, where I work, are fully aware that masking and mis-diagnosis (e.g. anxiety being a common diagnosis given when it should be autism), amongst other things, account for late diagnoses. Or they could be like my parents, who (wrongly, admittedly) worried it would simply label me and set me apart from my peers.
I didn't get any extra support in education until I started my Masters degree, after being formally diagnosed as autistic.

To be fair, 1400000/419969= 3.33 so that is a third.

OP I agree with your wording 'Awaiting x assessment' as opposed to 'Awaiting x diagnosis'. Beyond the school issue you're specifically referring to, I've seen it in benefit groups (DLA/PIP, etc), autism/adhd (other ND) groups, adult groups with SEN children.

It gives adults (for themselves) and parents (for their kids) a false sense of entitlement to x diagnosis and most become absolutely devastated/angry/determined to appeal the decision/ determined to go elsewhere to get a diagnosis if they don't get one. If they were of the mindset that they were actually waiting for the assessment, not diagnosis, perhaps it wouldn't be that way.

Apologies @PerditaLaChien, I read your post as 2 in 3, which is why I mentioned 60 odd %. Sorry about that.

re the diagnosed having more need than others is unfortunately bollocks at the moment as unfortunately
-some parents have gone private

• The nhs seems to have clearly misdiagnosed some kids
• Some schools purposely do not raise issues possibly as then creates a need go support the child.
• Some schools are rubbish at identifying autism and adhd especially in girls

who do you think has the most Need?
All are 11-13

child 1
sporty in member of team sports
Lots of clubs and football
Centre of friendgroup, invited to things including parties
Goes off with friends to the park and meet ups from 9yo
No issues with behaviour in primary
Some at secondary
No stims
No bullying
No depression/anxiety/time off school
Some sensory issues re food

Child 2
Restricted food only eats packed lunches wont eat out
One friend at secondary
Doesnt go out to shop alone or with friends.

Wont go to somewhere they dont want to even if friends are going
Spends most time on online games -
No sports not member of team.
Anxious about things like sports day
Lots of time off and anxiety vomiting
Issues with behaviour from reception
Wont attend anything like scouting or swimming lessons.
Cant go to theme parks as cant queue

Child 3
Restricted food only eats packed lunches eat 1-2 foods when out
Sensory issues with teeth and hair and sound.
One friend at secondary
Not made any new friends at secondary
Bullied by rest of classs/yeargroup
Only recently at 12 go out to shop with friends
Couldnt cross the road until 11.5yo
Generally Wont go to somewhere they dont want to even if friends are going
Spends most time on online games -
No sports not member of team
Cant do teamwork in any subject as cant compromise
Probably wont participate in things like sports day
Some of time off and anxiety vomiting/illness
Issues with behaviour from reception.
Cant do small talk to anyone or tell the teacher there is an issue.
Issues with out of school clubs from school age.
Goes to theme parks but queuing is always a disaster as will start arguments likewise when stuck in a car.
Never sleeps says they sleep 2-4 hours
Cant do homework independently as wouldnt do any and needs pressuring to do it at all.
Cant start any artwork or open ended homework.
Wouldnt be able to take stuff needed for school like pe kit

Who do you think has asd or is diagnosed

There has been a surge in SEN identification and formal provision. 15 years ago, when DD1 was 4 and was given her first Statement of SEN, 2.4% of children held Statements of Special Educational Need. Now 4.8% of pupils have EHC Plans.

The reasons will be mixed:
-the curriculum is more demanding, so pupils will struggle more
-covid lockdowns mean that children missed out on learning basic skills
-better awareness of how girls with ASD present Vs the classic boy presentation.
-generally more rigid school environments meaning that children with SEN cope less well and need more support.

DD3 is a classic example of a child who was put under so much pressure that the carefully constructed mask cracked and couldn't be glued back together. She now needs thousands of pounds of provision just to try and get her back into education.

But many are pretty much diagnosed before if other professionals are involved and when you get through screening a diagnosis is very likely particularly of other family members have a diagnosis.

Sorry, you're right, ESL is specifically excluded from the definition. But poverty (if it causes the child difficulty) comes under the social part in "Social, Emotional and Mental Health Needs" does it not?

The definition of SEN as set out in section 20 of the Children and Families Act 2014 is “2) A child of compulsory school age or a young person has a learning difficulty or disability if he or she—
(a) has a significantly greater difficulty in learning than the majority of others of the same age, or
(b) has a disability which prevents or hinders him or her from making use of facilities of a kind generally provided for others of the same age in mainstream schools or mainstream post-16 institutions.”

Poverty alone would not fall under definition. Poverty alone is neither a learning difficulty nor a disability. If the child also had SEMH difficulties as well as living in poverty then they can meet the definition of having SEN.

17 kids needing an individual room to take an exam is a straw man argument, though. OP never actually said all 17 of those children are requesting a private room for exam. She said they all have a dot on a class map, and several of them have "awaiting diagnosis". Then she later said "What if they all want a separate room!" but she doesn't even know if they all want a separate room.

As people have later pointed out, over 50% is highly likely if the classes are organised by expected attainment, and this is a lower-attainment set. Since OP later explained it's a Y10 class this seems likely.

It's misleading - whether deliberately or not - because most of these threads centre on lower primary school perhaps because SEND children in that age group may well have disruptive behaviours. And at that age classes aren't usually streamed so 17/35 or 17/30 would be an extremely high number.