Page 2 | Sister annoyed with me

NoForwardingAddress · 2024-11-21T10:50:00+00:00

I end up hosting every year at Christmas. I don't enjoy it. Up until now, the reason has been that my husband's elderly mother and very elderly grandad came to us. Both frail and would otherwise have a bleak Christmas alone, so obviously we've willingly had them round ours. At times, my husband's sibling (who lives abroad) has come too. Sadly, Mil and GFil both died this year. We will obviously miss their presence, especially my kids who naturally associate Christmas day with them being here. However, I do have to say that I was looking forward to not hosting for the first time in over 20 years. We were thinking of going to a restaurant so I wouldn't even have to cook and could spend my day relaxing and being with my kids. However, my brother then said he'd love to join us with husband's wife and 3 kids. To stress, I obviously would love to see him at Christmas as usually he's with his inlaws at the other end of the country. And our kids all adore each other, very close in age etc, so it will be lovely for them and for me to see my nieces and nephew. My sister is now annoyed that she's been left out 😩 every year, she goes to her inlaws and is doing the same this year. I assumed happily, but maybe not. Regardless, I can't stand the thought of cooking Christmas dinner and hosting my 4, my brother's 5, plus my sister's 6 (three adult children, one with fiancé). It's insanity. From past experience, my brother will contribute to the cost and help cook. My sister will not. I've already offered to host everyone at mine at some point during brother's visit and do a buffet, possibly on boxing day. Every single time my brother visits, I host everyone at mine and cook for everyone (something easy to bulk cook, like curry or chilli). My sister has never once hosted or invited me to do anything, I've never even been inside her house because she's weirdly private about it. Even when I've asked the address to drop (for example) her birthday gift off, she won't reply to me and just turns up on my doorstep! I honestly feel like I do the most to facilitate everyone being together, she does the least, yet I'm a selfish cow for leaving her out. I can't justify myself by saying that I didn't actually invite my brother, he invited himself, because that is mean to my brother and implies I don't want him here (not the case). I refuse to cook and host for that many so I'm not willing to extend the invite to her for Christmas dinner. Although she's welcome (as she's done most years previously) to come over for prosecco and croissants late morning to exchange gifts). What's the solution here? I'm most annoyed that instead of saying directly that she upset with me, she's told the rest of the family that I've left her out and always do! Urgh. Suggestions?

Sceptical123 · 22/11/2024 07:12

The person id be angry at is your brother!

He’s seen the opportunity of some space now available and assumed his family can take it. The only thing is he wants to replace 2 frail adults with 5 and the kids would probably eat more than your MIL and GFIL. He’s obviously seeing it as a repute for his own wife, although I think you said they visited in-laws so they didn’t have to host. Have they ever hosted?

I think the better thing to have done would be if he had invited your family to them when MIL and GFIL passed away, as you were now free to be more fluid, (and you’ve hosted for 20 years!) but he’s seen it as an opportunity for his family to fill and widen the void they left behind.

I can understand why you’d be annoyed at your sister never hosting but can also see why she’s upset at a family event opened up to one sibling but not her. But again she wants to bring extra ppl as well. Your brother offers the better option if he pays for his family and helps cook but he’s still a massive cheeky fucker for inviting himself to enjoy Xmas at your house with no hosting responsibilities for him or his wife - it’s a vacation for them and more work for you. At the very least ask if you can swap next year and see what his reaction is.

localhere · 22/11/2024 07:17

I'd put it as you're having a year off hosting. You might find you miss being the family hub and want to do it next year.
I'm from a large family and until a few years ago my mum and her husband were the hub at christmas. It was a really joyful experience we all have wonderful memories of but her husband died at Christmas time and since then she's not wanted to even celebrate, so we took on the job.
It's a once a year obligation we are happy to be at the centre of. Family help a lot with looking after the kids and shopping and bringing dishes so the weight is shared.
I get that you are done with hosting after 20 years but do you not think you might have burnt your bridges by saying no (of course if you're super sure you don't want to do it that's fair)

FiveShelties · 22/11/2024 07:24

Does no-one in your family know where your sister lives? I think you have done more than your bit hosting, but I would be very worried about a family member not wanting me to know their address.

Original poster

NoForwardingAddress · 22/11/2024 08:19

FlightofWind · 22/11/2024 03:27

Yes, I did means that ignoring it might be a useful approach to try. But only if you feel ok and ready to deal with the potential consequences. I guess the aim is to separate out your emotions from theirs. Leave them to manage their emotions and you protect yours. People pleasing/.rescuing means to take on some of theirs too and merges the emotions between you. Boundaries help stop this merging. You can still see and support others with their emotions but not take them on.

In my experience changing from being a people pleaser can lead to some mighty “extinction burst” behaviour from others who really don’t want you to stop meeting their needs. That’s scary when you’ve spent a lifetime trying to feel safe by people pleasing. The upside is that I think people pleasers find it the easiest to make change once they understand what they’re contributing to the perpetuation of the situation. I would always recommend noticing first and not rushing to change behaviour. So it might be better for you not to change what you would normally do just yet and trust your instinct to do what you’ve always done but just notice it. By just noticing you’ll actually affect some change. Label behaviours - others and your own - as it helps you separate your responses from actions. The change happens in the pause of that makes sense. At some level I would suspect that others emotions feel a threat to you and you take on the emotions yourself instead as that feels safer. My sibling told me I couldn’t expect to have a relationship with them if I behaved the way I was when I started to change. Wasn’t true - our relationship is the best it’s ever been - but it was a tactic our parents used on us (my Dad would often not speak to me for days for no other real reason that I’d been the one in the room when his stress overwhelmed him) so it was mighty hard taking the risk. I did do it with weekly counselling support for two years. It took practice and I hurt people’s feeling more than I would do now I'm practiced at it. It was ultimately killing me though perpetuating what kept me safe as a child. I have a lot of physical and mental health issues that can be managed with the wonders of modern medicine but “the body keeps the score” (a good book!)

A couple of analogies that work for me:
visw all the possible responses to this sitstuon as a field of long grass. There will be a path trodden down through the field (the way you usually behave) and a place that path leads you to. From what you’ve written you don’t want that destination anymore and walking down the usually path is exhausting you even though each step still feels the easiest option because the grass is trodden down. What is the destination you actually want to get to instead? Where in the field is that path? How overgrown is it. Etc etc. Go down the new path anyway you can - it will be painful and might need adjusting as you distill what you actually want. But with conscious effort you can forge a new path and the old path will eventually become over grown and not a comfortable path anymore.

view it as a game of emotional tennis. Emotions are being lobbed back and forward between you. If you’re the one raging inside and possibly outside, it likely means your “losing” and the emotions ball is left on your side of the net constantly.

Have you heard of the drama triangle? Persecutor, rescuer and victim? Rescuer is just as much of a contributor to the dynamic as the other two positions. There is lots to the theory but in a nutshell moving to an adjacent triangle of protector, nurturer and joyful child (they might use a different word for that one position) is the aim. Other people could probably explain it better than me but I’ve come to realise that people pleasing (and I was a master!) is often a learnt habit usually learnt in childhood that ultimately gives you a feeling of control. On some level it is your choice to continue behaving this way. Your behaviour is meeting a need in you.

Hope that makes sense! Im in hospital at the moment with an infection and lack of sleep addles my brain a little and exaggerates my dyslexia etc so sometimes I haven’t quite written what I meant clearly.

It might be as simple as placating your sister means you can enjoy your brothers visit more. I sense having him and his family for Xmas has some really value for you. If the easiest way to keep that for yourself is to placate then do it. If you can weather your sister’s tantruming in whatever form it takes and having her there or indulging her behaviour will suck out the joy from your brothers visit then I would ignore her. Silence is the most oowefrful way to leave someone’s emotions with them. Just let their emotions tennis ball drop to the ground and chances are it will largely bounce back to them and they’ll be left with the angst they were trying to offload onto you.

Thank you for taking the time to write this incredible response. Lots of food for thought. Many things ring true. I'm aware of the drama triangle and definitely know I'm a rescuer and she's a victim. Our father was a very cruel man. My sister was the scapegoat, I was the golden child. She has a lot of resentment towards me because of this, and I have a lot of guilt. The thing is, I was a young child and I never chose or wanted to be the favourite. It was my father's way of dividing and conquering us so that we had no solidarity against him. Being his favourite is no badge of honour or something anyone should want - he was still abusive and cruel to me but used me as example to make my siblings and even my mother resent me. I remember my mother, if I ever did anything that displeased her, saying "and your dad thinks you're little miss perfect but I know the truth!" in a really hateful tone, as if I was complicit and lucky to be his favourite. I was 5 years old. I look at my kids and can't imagine resenting them or saying something like that, but we were all manipulated by my father. It was horrible and stressful being his favourite.
My sister, completely understandably, feels safest in the victim role, because she had the worst of my father's anger and hatred and was always told she was the "bad one" and a disappointment. My brother and I are very aware of what she's been through, so we are always most considerate of her feelings, above our own. But I don't think that approach is helping her. Maybe it's holding her in the victim role.

I need to look in to the nurturer/joyful child dynamic. I haven't heard of that.

What is the destination you actually want to get to instead?
I guess I want to enjoy Christmas day with my brother guilt free, I want to see she can join us at any point (as always) but that it shouldn't be my responsibility to always fund everything and wait on everyone to make sure her day is how she wants at my expense (emotionally, physically and financially!). I feel she often comes to me hosting things with an attitude of "you owe me" but that could just be my perception.
Previously I would just invite her. But in recent years, I've just become so burnt out by trying to please everyone that I'm categorically not walking that path any more. I'm still not sure how to proceed.

Thanks for your response and I'm sorry you're unwell.

OP posts:

thepariscrimefiles · 22/11/2024 08:28

NoForwardingAddress · 21/11/2024 22:53

Thanks. This is interesting. So I thought ignoring the situation is avoidance and that things will fester? But you think ignoring it will be helpful? Am I reading that right? Sorry if I've misinterpreted.

I do feel like I often end up doing things I don't want to make others happy, although definitely less so as I get older and more grumpy/menopausal. 10 years ago, I'd be wracked with guilt and tears at the thought of upsetting her and immediately invite everyone even though it would massively stress me out and ruin my day. So I'm less of a people pleaser than I was, but still definitely try to hard to consider how everyone else feels before myself.

Show quote history

Honestly, her behaviour in telling everyone that you have purposely left her out and that it's not the first time you've done this would make me feel less inclined to invite her, not more inclined.

She is untruthful, spiteful and entitled and you should definitely not reward this behaviour by inviting her and her family.

Original poster

NoForwardingAddress · 22/11/2024 09:23

FlightofWind · 22/11/2024 03:40

Sorry that last message was long!

One more thing: balance in relationships is importation to me. The way you talk about your siblings leads me to think that you feel your relationship with your brother is balanced and therefore a pleasure but your relationship with your sister is a little unbalanced. i think it’s ok to be willing to do something for one sibling and not the other in the same way you’d do something for a friend who’d do the same for you both not for a friend who wouldn’t.

Keep your values but also keep your boundaries. Other people not liking your decisions doesn’t mean you were wrong to make them.

Also look up flying monkeys,FOG, grey rock/medium chill.

This resonates. I like doing things for people, but as time passes, I feel resentment if I'm always giving and it's just expected that I will with never anything reciprocated? My brother is staunchly non-piss-takey. He immediately outlined what they'll bring to contribute and asked if I'd prefer that or 50% of the cost. He's also doing the long journey, and is a hands-on cook and cleaner-upper when he's here. When I've visited his home, he is a generous host etc.

OP posts:

Original poster

NoForwardingAddress · 22/11/2024 09:30

FiveShelties · 22/11/2024 07:24

Does no-one in your family know where your sister lives? I think you have done more than your bit hosting, but I would be very worried about a family member not wanting me to know their address.

It's really just me because I'm her only family nearby. I know her inlaws go to her home, for example, although I get the impression my sister isn't happy about this. But they do things for her (ironing and DIY for example) and her partner is most likely the one inviting them.

My brother doesn't have her address, but whenever he visits, we would meet up at mine. One summer, my brother stayed in an air bnb locally and we went there all together, as well as to mine, but never to hers. He did push one year and insist on going to her village, but she said to meet in their local pub, so he still didn't actually see her home. I don't know if she's embarrassed about something or just doesn't want the hassle or expense of hosting at hers.

OP posts:

FlightofWind · 22/11/2024 10:52

NoForwardingAddress · 22/11/2024 08:19

Thank you for taking the time to write this incredible response. Lots of food for thought. Many things ring true. I'm aware of the drama triangle and definitely know I'm a rescuer and she's a victim. Our father was a very cruel man. My sister was the scapegoat, I was the golden child. She has a lot of resentment towards me because of this, and I have a lot of guilt. The thing is, I was a young child and I never chose or wanted to be the favourite. It was my father's way of dividing and conquering us so that we had no solidarity against him. Being his favourite is no badge of honour or something anyone should want - he was still abusive and cruel to me but used me as example to make my siblings and even my mother resent me. I remember my mother, if I ever did anything that displeased her, saying "and your dad thinks you're little miss perfect but I know the truth!" in a really hateful tone, as if I was complicit and lucky to be his favourite. I was 5 years old. I look at my kids and can't imagine resenting them or saying something like that, but we were all manipulated by my father. It was horrible and stressful being his favourite.
My sister, completely understandably, feels safest in the victim role, because she had the worst of my father's anger and hatred and was always told she was the "bad one" and a disappointment. My brother and I are very aware of what she's been through, so we are always most considerate of her feelings, above our own. But I don't think that approach is helping her. Maybe it's holding her in the victim role.

I need to look in to the nurturer/joyful child dynamic. I haven't heard of that.

What is the destination you actually want to get to instead?
I guess I want to enjoy Christmas day with my brother guilt free, I want to see she can join us at any point (as always) but that it shouldn't be my responsibility to always fund everything and wait on everyone to make sure her day is how she wants at my expense (emotionally, physically and financially!). I feel she often comes to me hosting things with an attitude of "you owe me" but that could just be my perception.
Previously I would just invite her. But in recent years, I've just become so burnt out by trying to please everyone that I'm categorically not walking that path any more. I'm still not sure how to proceed.

Thanks for your response and I'm sorry you're unwell.

Show quote history

Oh I’m so sorry, what a terribly challenging childhood - so abusive. Well done for finding a way of coping that’s been so successful. It met your need to survive.

Sounds as though your needs has changed slightly so you want to change your behaviour to meet your new need. Just recognise when you say you “have to” or you “mustl or you “should” that’s likely something youre choosing to do to meet your own need -,even though you feel other people’s believes and feelings are responsible for you feeling like you have to do it. There will be a counter need to tread that same old path because it’s familiar and therefore predictable.

My DH is an only child and his parents were extremely abusive. He was parade as a golden child. His Dad was an evil man in my opinion. My DH said once that having a sibling would have made it easier but I told him my belief is that it would likely have been a whole lot worse for the reasons you’ve mentioned. My parents were damaged and definitely emotionally abusive but also 100% did the best they could - which creates it’s own issues but ultimately meant they could change with me and we ended up with a lovely adult to adult relationship. Same with my sibling.

My DH did not got no contact with his parents but with a small amount of professional help (I had so many sessions and I think he had about 4!) he accepted they couldn’t change. He did try once speaking to them but they were literally incapable of change. I know it’s not considered ok to label people narcissistic but if you read a checklist of behaviour/ for a grandiose narcissist it summed his Dad up and a covert narcissist summed his Mum up. Both totally incapable of growth and change. He put very firm boundaries in place and we met in a neutral location between our houses. Worked well. My DH is a grey rock master!! I overshoot to iced chill rather than medium chill sometimes.

From what you write, you give me the impression that you’re a huge way down the path of being able to make the changes you want to make.
I’m paraphrasing but I remember reading once that people pleasers and narcissists are like two sides of the same coin. Both damaged and often abused. If you have high empathy you tend to cope by going down the people pleaser route and if you have low empathy it likely sends you down the more narcissistic route.

I see another drama triangle dynamic playing out between you and your sister. Her as a percecutor (when there is a risk you won’t support her playing victim) and you as the victim. I wonder if that pushes towards you towards being a rescuer as feeling a victim is too painful - allowing her to return to the victim position. Just something to consider.

The joy is all you have to do is step out of the triangle. (Easier said than done!) you don’t have to change her thinking or your thinking or anyone else’s. Just notice and step back.